Anti venom (Phaki) for Engineer Ali Mirza (Full Ilmi Kitabi)

[Nosarbazian]

محمد علی مرزا صاحب سے تعارف دو ہزار دس میں ہوا، کیوں کہ میرا اپنا تعلق جہلم سے ہے اس لئے ان کی اکیڈمی دار ارقم میں بھی کافی بار جانے کا موقع بھی ملا اور مرزا صاحب سے ملاقات بھی ہوی ...مرزا صاحب کا جارحانہ انداز، اور منفرد قسم کی انداز گفتگو نے بیشمار لوگوں کو نہ صرف متاثر کیا بلکہ عصر حاضر کے علما سے سوالات کرنے کا حوصلہ بھی ملا... ایک طویل عرصہ تک ان سے متاثر رہا، اور آج بھی ان کی بہت سے باتوں سے اتفاق بھی کرتا ہوں ... لیکن ایسا کوئی بھی سخص جو مرزا صاحب کو ریگولر سنتا رہا ہو وو یہ بات یقین سے کہ سکتا ہے کہ گزشتہ دو سال یا کچھ زیادہ ہو گیا ہے مرزا صاحب کبھی سیاست پر ویڈیوز کر رہے ہیں اور کبھی قادیانیوں سے متعلق بے سروپا باتیں کر رہے ہیں... لیکن انہوں نے رمضان کے دوران ایک ٹی وی چینل پر فرمایا کہ حضرت خالد بن ولید کے زہر پینے والا واقعہ "کہانی" ہے اور جھوٹ پر مبنی ہے .... اس واقع کو لے کر کچھ دنوں سے یہ مفتی راشد محمود رضوی ویڈیوز اپلوڈ کر رہے ہیں، اور مرزا صاحب سے جواب بن نہیں پڑ رہا ...میرا مفتی صاحب کے مسلک سے کوئی تعلق نہیں ہے لیکن اگر کوئی بھی غیر جانب دار شخص یہ ویڈیوز دیکھے تو بتا سکتا ہے ... مرزا صاحب نہ صرف بیہودہ طریقے سے بات کر رہے ہیں بلکہ بہت صاف قسم کے دلائل کے جواب میں محض " ہا ہو " ہی کر رہے ہیں ... یہ ویڈیو دیکھیں تو پتا چلتا ہے کہ محض یہ کہ دینا کہ بخاری کے فلاں صفحے پر یہ لکھا ہے اور مسلم کے فلاں صفحے پر یہ لکھا ہے کافی نہیں ہے ... بلکہ اصول حدیث کی تو دنیا ہی الگ ہے ... گزارش ہے کہ یہ ویڈیو اور اس چینل سے اپلوڈ کی گی آخری چار ویڈیوز ضرور دیکھیں.. کافی معلوماتی ہیں

 

[vicahmed99]

Engineer is nausar baaz and doesn't have proper islamic education from any where.
He doesn't quote complete Hadiths.
Samney Ahadeeth ki boook rakh kar you can't be an Aalim

 

[Citizen X]

Yeh sub ke sub hi moulvi bhaand hai.

 

[Citizen X]

Doesn't have proper islamic education from any where.

The one\s who do have so called "proper islamic education" kounse sahi hai, woh bhi sub hi bhaand hain.

 

[vicahmed99]

I'm not supporting any Aalim here but requesting to stay away from his fitna
He uses Ahadeeth to show fights between companions (Sahaba).
My question is if has not born during that time then whey does he have to promote the case of fights between companions.........Ikhtalafat her jaga hote hein

The one\s who do have so called "proper islamic education" kounse sahi hai, woh bhi sub hi bhaand hain.

 

[Nosarbazian]

The one\s who do have so called "proper islamic education" kounse sahi hai, woh bhi sub hi bhaand hain.

i dont know who claimed that he is "proper islamic ...."... these days its hot issue between mufti and engineer sahab... like it was between engineer and tariq masood .. but this time mufti took him to the cleaners big time

 

[Citizen X]

I'm not supporting any Aalim here but requesting to stay away from his fitna

Saray moulvi hi fitna hai stay away from them all, moulviyon ka mulk to barbaad kerne mein bohat barda haath hai.

At least with this mirza he exposes these other jahil bhaand sects and what blasphemous bullshit they are based on and practice. So a lesser evil than the rest.

 

[Citizen X]

One does not need any moulvi or any "proper Islamic education" in todays world. Quran is clear in what is says, if any one who does not speak or understand Arabic can use any given translation he wishes to use.

These moulvis are only there to confuse people and lead them astray so they can keep making a living off their chandas and stay relevant.

 

[Nosarbazian]

One does not need any moulvi or any "proper Islamic education" in todays world. Quran is clear in what is says, if any one who does not speak or understand Arabic can use any given translation he wishes to use.

These moulvis are only there to confuse people and lead them astray so they can keep making a living off their chandas and stay relevant.

brother you took it too far....these two are not from those who "collect" chandas... one is qualified, from one of the most prestigious religious institute in subcontinent, jamia naeemia aur other one is well known religious scholar (or what ever you call him)... they are not chanda collectors, they are having good debate these days thats why i post this thread...

 

[rahail]

I'm not supporting any Aalim here but requesting to stay away from his fitna
He uses Ahadeeth to show fights between companions (Sahaba).
My question is if has not born during that time then whey does he have to promote the case of fights between companions.........Ikhtalafat her jaga hote hein

Oh really. The reason you and nosarbazian posted this on siasat.pk and now commenting on it shows that you big supporter of jahil moulvis who has no educational and moral ground to defend Ali Mirza's points.

I read ahadeeth and I do it everyday. Whatever he says is written with sound narration. It happened and more than this which he never talks about.

Those who study hadeeth know that almost every moulvi in Pakistan is a liar and a supporter of a corrupt Islamic system that has befallen upon us. Almost every moulvi in the last 1200 years lead us astray. Allah un sab ko gharat kare. ameen.

 

[Nosarbazian]

Oh really. The reason you and nosarbazian posted this on siasat.pk and now commenting on it shows that you big supporter of jahil moulvis who has no educational and moral ground to defend Ali Mirza's points.

I read ahadeeth and I do it everyday. Whatever he says is written with sound narration. It happened and more than this which he never talks about.

Those who study hadeeth know that almost every moulvi in Pakistan is a liar and a supporter of a corrupt Islamic system that has befallen upon us. Almost every moulvi in the last 1200 years lead us astray. Allah un sab ko gharat kare. ameen.

without even asking im saying this you did not watch the video?? if you read hadees everyday then im sure you know hadees regarding khalid bin waleed drank poison is sehe and mentioned in more than 12 books, which mirza denied that its a kahani and based on lies.. then ibne umars hadith was challeneged by this mufti that its zaeef... and mirza came up with that shaykh zubair ali zai says its sehe so its sehe... is that what you read and he reads?

 

[rahail]

without even asking im saying this you did not watch the video?? if you read hadees everyday then im sure you know hadees regarding khalid bin waleed drank poison is sehe and mentioned in more than 12 books, which mirza denied that its a kahani and based on lies.. then ibne umars hadith was challeneged by this mufti that its zaeef... and mirza came up with that shaykh zubair ali zai says its sehe so its sehe... is that what you read and he reads?

Khalid ibn waleed drinking poison is not mentioned in any other book except Sunan Al kubra bahyqi. Stop telling lies. That hadeeth has majhool riwayat. I am not going to explain Majhool.

And I don't know which IBne Umar hadith you are mentioning. There are many yard rules in the knowledge of hadith. You have to spend like 4 to 5 years to understand hadith and the rules Muhadith used to select/discard hadiths.

Those who follow Hanafi or any other madahibs have little or no idea about ILM e hadith. I can challenge anyone that almost everyone of them haven't read entire hadith books even the famous Bukhari/Muslim. And if they read it, they only read selected hadiths that fall under their figh.

Broad reading is necessary. Even if we accept Khalid bne waleed poison drinking event, it doesn't address any of the critical issues. Khalid ibne waleed was a Tulaqa (those who accepted Islam after the event of Hudabiyah). Similarly, all those sahabas that you revere are tulaqas. Most of them had very little guidance that came with sitting with PROPHET MUHAMMAD SALLAHU ALAIYE WASSALAM.

 

[Nosarbazian]

Khalid ibn waleed drinking poison is not mentioned in any other book except Sunan Al kubra bahyqi. Stop telling lies. That hadeeth has majhool riwayat. I am not going to explain Majhool.

And I don't know which IBne Umar hadith you are mentioning. There are many yard rules in the knowledge of hadith. You have to spend like 4 to 5 years to understand hadith and the rules Muhadith used to select/discard hadiths.

Those who follow Hanafi or any other madahibs have little or no idea about ILM e hadith. I can challenge anyone that almost everyone of them haven't read entire hadith books even the famous Bukhari/Muslim. And if they read it, they only read selected hadiths that fall under their figh.

Broad reading is necessary. Even if we accept Khalid bne waleed poison drinking event, it doesn't address any of the critical issues. Khalid ibne waleed was a Tulaqa (those who accepted Islam after the event of Hudabiyah). Similarly, all those sahabas that you revere are tulaqas. Most of them had very little guidance that came with sitting with PROPHET MUHAMMAD SALLAHU ALAIYE WASSALAM.

broad reading is very important and for that here is the link of baba of engineer sahab.. nasir uddin albani.... watch it yourself what he is saying.... and for your kind information.... watch the video i gave the link in original thread... hadith is mentioned in many books with sehe references...

 

[Nosarbazian]

 

[Kavalier]

Yeah saray hi aik jesay hayn, lakin Engineer inmayn thora sa behter hay k bohat sari fazool baton ko rud karta hay, uss say thora aur behter Ghamidi hay, baqi sab aik hi theeli k chuttay buttay hayn

 

[Citizen X]

brother you took it too far

No I didn't. I know mirza doesn't collect chanda but at the end of the day is just another moulvi. An alien concept in actual Islam.

one is qualified, from one of the most prestigious religious institute in subcontinent,

What religious institute, hey teach nothing but traditional hadith-centric religion. Not the deen of the Quran.

they are having good debate these days thats why i post this thread.

Good debate my @$$. This is all what bhaand moulvis do, argue about stupid and frivolous matter which have no meaning snf impact or improvement on the life of a normal person. Fulaan hadith said this dhimak hadith said this, dhimkana moulvi said that, fulana moulvi said that. Absolute rubbish!

This is the fasaad and fitna one gets into when they abandon the Quran and start running after stories written by defeated persians centuries after the Prophet's passed away.

 

[Citizen X]

Khalid ibn waleed drinking poison is not mentioned in any other book except Sunan Al kubra bahyqi. Stop telling lies. That hadeeth has majhool riwayat. I am not going to explain Majhool.

And I don't know which IBne Umar hadith you are mentioning. There are many yard rules in the knowledge of hadith. You have to spend like 4 to 5 years to understand hadith and the rules Muhadith used to select/discard hadiths.

Those who follow Hanafi or any other madahibs have little or no idea about ILM e hadith. I can challenge anyone that almost everyone of them haven't read entire hadith books even the famous Bukhari/Muslim. And if they read it, they only read selected hadiths that fall under their figh.

Broad reading is necessary. Even if we accept Khalid bne waleed poison drinking event, it doesn't address any of the critical issues. Khalid ibne waleed was a Tulaqa (those who accepted Islam after the event of Hudabiyah). Similarly, all those sahabas that you revere are tulaqas. Most of them had very little guidance that came with sitting with PROPHET MUHAMMAD SALLAHU ALAIYE WASSALAM.

without even asking im saying this you did not watch the video?? if you read hadees everyday then im sure you know hadees regarding khalid bin waleed drank poison is sehe and mentioned in more than 12 books, which mirza denied that its a kahani and based on lies.. then ibne umars hadith was challeneged by this mufti that its zaeef... and mirza came up with that shaykh zubair ali zai says its sehe so its sehe... is that what you read and he reads?

Question I ask both of you, what difference does it make he if did or did not drink poison? Did the teaching of the Quran change? Did Allah start commanding to start believing in more than one god? etc etc.

Typical fitna created by molvis using the 100 plus books of persian stories rather than teaching the one confirmed book of Allah

All of this is just pointless blah blah which has no use of any kind.

 

[punjab]

I can't comment about Eng. Sahib religious competence but politically he is very biased.

 

[Citizen X]

He uses Ahadeeth to show fights between companions (Sahaba).

SO? Sahaba were not Prophets or inflatable, they were just normal human beings. Their are a lot of questionable actions of a lot a sahabas before and after they accepted Islam.

Whats there to get so upset about or start getting into arguments and fights over it? Does it change your deen or your beliefs?

 

[Citizen X]

I can't comment about Eng. Sahib religious competence but politically he is very biased.

Politically poora ka poora patwari cherry blossom hai. As far I know from what he has said he works in some govt agency that does work for the military or it's a military organization. So thats why he supports nooras and the establishment.