The benefits of family based political parties and Dynasties of Pakistan

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
Advantages for family based political parties in Pakistan are more than the disadvantages .

A ground fact of federation of Pakistan is that Punjab has to play a crucial part to hold the federation together .

Now that is a delicate job, it is quite difficult to satisfy each and every non Punjabi of the federation but by virtue of family based politics it becomes easy , all you need is an effective sardar or feudal landlord or notable trader or professional who has the gaddi as well as the ability to keep a greater mass of people in their area , you share power with him and that runs the state .


All which needs to be constantly looked at is that sardar or hereditary politicians or pir or party leaders have sufficient interest in state itself , if say a Baluchi leader has house or property in Quetta ,Karachi ,Islamabad , may be a child or two is studying locally , then there is no worry even if he utters a few words of parochial nature consistent with their culture ,because he is embedded in Pakistan with his dearest money and children . Same stands for Pathan chiefs or tribal leaders or Sindhi leaders . Without such ordered social structure in other provinces running Pakistan was impossible , this structure has partly broken in KPK and what you have is traditional political leadership being killed by armed Taliban and Imran khan supporting Taliban ,hailing them as biggest local invention ever ,as if .


Hereditary political parties work well in Punjab as well, compare jamaat Islami and PMLN , jamaat is not hereditary , it is near extinction in public life ,whereas Nawaz might still survive and is very much there . MQM chief is not well, hereditary line is not there , Punjab might have a difficult time when Altaf dies , whom to talk to will be an issue .Musharaf cognizant of Altaf health has already placed himself locally but he will not be allowed to get it when times comes.


An important point in politics of Pakistan is that no matter what is the format of social leadership , be it hereditary political party , ordinary political party , clubs ,pir Faqirs , or even tablighi jamaat , all act as power and contact club .participant of theirs benefit from it . People want to keep sticking to their arrangements of influence be it rotary club or be it president of market or be it shah sahib the big pir .

So when Imran talks about condemning hereditary leadership , he is talking childish , he has every right to make his party available to those who do not want to follow a hereditary leader but to criticise Nawaz or Shehbaz is unnecessary , if some people in Punjab think of shehbaz as their king or report to him even when they are not in power it is their choice . One non hereditary politician of Potohar told me that some people in his town have no assets , their only hope is him to get something out of it .


The very target of west and other enemies of Pakistan is its nuke and its federal structure , they had local people like Gen.Naqvi of reconstruction bureau , Musharaf, Raza Rabbani who went to the very root of federalism to weaken it , Naqvi by way of police order and local bodies changes, Musharaf the boss by removing media control and raza rabbani by giving more autonomy to provinces ,all three undercutting power of federation .


Both Moghal Empire and Ottoman empire demise started with local rulers asking for provincial autonomy , so it is mandatory that before Nawaz and shahbaz leave the scene , some constitutional amendments are put in place to undo 18th amendment and make federation strong as under existing culture if these brothers go and different parties come in centre and province of Punjab ,the state anarchy will accelerate to unbelievable height. Enemies of Pakistan want the only hope of smaller province in insurrection ,I.e help from federation and Punjab should dissipate .


what did we get out of adult franchise based election of 1970, except breakup of Pakistan , what will UK get from non hereditary parties if referendum this week results in Scottish independence . What did Britain get out democracy when whilst fighting Germans they won but lost empire to USA .


the only problem with hereditary political parties and monarchial system was transfer of crown ,rendered more difficult by polygamy in Muslims . Second being some second rate prince coming up ,otherwise all glory of Islamic superpower hood over about 600years pertains to monarchial system .
 
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Zameen

MPA (400+ posts)
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fawad ali

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
The biggest disadvantage of family politics is that there is no merit. Any person who prefers family politics should be sent to psychological department since it is too late to make him understand that this world after thousands of years has established that no nation survives without merit.
 

azaad62

Councller (250+ posts)
correct your history the mughal and ottoman demise was inter khandani fighting supported by othe dynastics khandans,,...in simple terms the bigs boys were fighting for real estate among themselves
 

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
The biggest disadvantage of family politics is that there is no merit. Any person who prefers family politics should be sent to psychological department since it is too late to make him understand that this world after thousands of years has established that no nation survives without merit.
Not correct in enterity . As a matter of fact one disadvantage of former times was that education of good quality was for the selected few , the princes and chief's sons were educated in literature ,natural sciences , war sciences and religion or law as well as politics , the monarchies lasted for centuries as say about 30% of kings were trained as soldiers, politician and scholar at the same time ,a kind of combination not found today .

Merit too had an outlet , have you heard of Chinese civil service exam of ancient times like CSS of today , who were jannisaries , read more read more
 

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
correct your history the mughal and ottoman demise was inter khandani fighting supported by othe dynastics khandans,,...in simple terms the bigs boys were fighting for real estate among themselves
Partly correct but not the whole story , typical scenario was a good simple soldier was recruited in kings service ,he rose ,kingdom expanded, slowly he joins ruling cliche , is ambitious ,becomes head of a rich but distant state as governor , works to his advantage , asks autonomy from father king , declares independence of some type from child king or worse still occupies throne .
 

PIND-WALA

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
So in order to keep the country united, you just need to some pirs/jagerdars/waders etc to control different parts of the country and all report to federal regardless how the rest of the issues namely justice system, health care, education ,business etc etc .This system only promotes slavery and poverty.
Did you ever notice the India as example? Heriditory politics is over now , they are managing the country much better just because they have ridden themselves of that system of waderas.
That mindset needs to change.
 

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
So in orderIto keep the country united, you just need to some pirs/jagerdars/waders etc to control different parts of the country and all report to federal regardless how the rest of the issues namely justice system, health care, education ,business etc etc .This system only promotes slavery and poverty.
Did you ever notice the India as example? Heriditory politics is over now , they are managing the country much better just because they have ridden themselves of that system of waderas.
That mindset needs to change.

I have been to Bombay only , not impressed deeply , same 90 year olds were controlling Maharashtra from behind , but yes Hindus have a work and immigration culture . Hereditary politics is not over at all ,it was never the sole form of politics in history and is not now either .
 

PIND-WALA

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
I have been to Bombay only , not impressed deeply , same 90 year olds were controlling Maharashtra from behind , but yes Hindus have a work and immigration culture . Hereditary politics is not over at all ,it was never the sole form of politics in history and is not now either .

So your argument that it is essential for Pakistan is wrong and leads to poverty/slavery which this country is already facing.Just look at the people in interior sindh , they have been voting for PPP ever since its inception, They have been slave to Jagerdar system, whats their condition ? Remember the thar issue few months back. Main reason that we have problems in Karachi/sindh and Baluchistan is injustice.
 

bisaat

Banned
this is the exact mentality which OP wrote that the various ethnicities don't want to remain in pakistan

when Pakistan came into being, it were mohajirs who formed the country and ran its affairs till native pakistanis themselves didn't become capable of running it

Balochs and pashtuns are iranians and afghans respectively, they had no wish to remain in Pakistan to accept Punjabi hegemony

similarly mohajirs came in Pakistan not to accept any sindhi or any other's hegemony

similarly it goes itself with Punjab, it didn't lose its east Punjab to hegemonise or rule all other muslim states

all the different states called as provinces today joined the federation because of muslim cause, and to be frank, if it weren't for the british, the balochs would have joined iranians and KPK the afghans and kashmir would have gone to india and i don't know about sindh because it was not a major player in pak's independence

i agree that Punjabis have a lot of responsibility to work this federation out, if Punjabis consider Pakistan their colonies, the country would break

im sorry to say but Pakistan is not a Punjabi colony, it is a democratic state, where the four provinces willfully joined the federation which was also not made by Punjabis

is Pakistan breaks, all responsibility will be on Punjabis since they are the major players

unfortunetely Pakistan has become synonimous with Punjab and not real Pakistan, it is all now on Punjabis that they give proper rights to balochs, sindhis, mohajirs etc otherwise every one of them think that since Pakistan has become a PUnjabi monopoly, its better to make their own country not to get monopolised

Punjabis has numerical superiority, i agree, but its all upto Punjabis if they use their majority as Pakistan's advantage or disadvantage
 
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azaad62

Councller (250+ posts)
yes all well said ,,,but we have moved on from a tribal protection to a nation protection in the form of a state army and national police force ,, ,,,and lets not forget the first free primary school was in place during the prophets time (pbuh),,later to be instilled in oxford ,,and today it is the for front of education ,,,two points i am trying to make our beloved prophet gave us a system the second a protection ,,1400 years represented ,,what is today modern western europe ,,,,and our islamic nations wanna hold to the quresh era ,,,,,democracy in its entirety was born during the prophets time ,,,the greek democracy was a representation of votes for the ruling elites not for the ordinary citizen who had no say whatsoever in the nations governance which is pretty much like pakistan today

@ SHAIK
 
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shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
azaad62;es all well said said:
Islam is not a political Doctrine , it is a spiritual doctrine , democracy is not part of islam , but shoora or advisory is . Shoora is the body of learned and significant not necessaroly popularly elected .
 
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