The Kind of Music/Raqs Allowed in Islam - A clarifying discussion by the Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

[modern fakir]

lol ...Pakistan1947 ...you are very fond of bringing this up ...we have already proven Raqs...You have an issue with it ..You show some scholars dancing...Then we have no issues ..Thanks for posting its good entertainment...Here let me show you a video of Ibn Baaz one of your kinds Dancing...Im sure you will absolutely love this ....[hilar][hilar]



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6CSumUAprw&feature=player_detailpage

????? ????? ??????????? ????? ????????? ?????? ??????? ???????????? ? ????????? ?????????? ????? ??????? ???????????
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Yusuf Ali 35: Their prayer at the House (of Allah. is nothing but whistling and clapping of hands: (Its only answer can be), "Taste ye the penalty because ye blasphemed." (Quraan 8:35)

??????? ?? ??? ?? ?? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???? ??? ?? ?? ?? ?? ??? ???? ???

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Read the above Quraanic verse and watch below what today's Muslims are doing:

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[MuslimPK]

QUOTE]

u seem mulla to me.. no wonder cudnt get the gist of the matter...

innovation = from horse/camel rides to car rides

insanity = still relying on moon sighting through naked eye

You are right, you didnt understand the matter. Innovation in worldly matters is not prohibited, but innovations in Deen is strictly prohibited because Allah S.W.T has completed our Deen for us.

By the way I am not mavlvi, I have spent my life studying science along with Islam and am a PhD Scholar in the UK. But what is wrong is wrong, doesnt matter if mullah is saying it or a scientist

 

[Pakistani1947]

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[modern fakir]

OK so Ladies and Gentleman..This guy here called Pakistan1947 is very Fond of posting Fake and out of context videos of people claiming to be sufis ....and This is my attempt to show you that by attributing some idiots and their wrong actions to the right aqeedah ...you cannot falsify the Truth... Here lets see a video of some misguided people who themselves need help ...But yet badmouth others...Now remember the sufis never created these videos ...these are created by ordinary people...lets check this out ....(bigsmile)(bigsmile)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9drTI7tjC3s&feature=player_detailpage

 

[Pakistani1947]

Talk is cheap....Bring us proof's...none of the guys opposing us here has posted any scholarly evidence ....which may prove raqs or Naats are completely Haram...We have posted several Ahadith...Bring your proofs otherwise accept the truth and dont burn in rage (bigsmile)...May Allah Truly show these ignoramouses the true and easy path to salvation and the way to a learned scholar from whom they can actually learn real Islam ...as opposed to how each and everyone one of them interpreting things according to their own wishes and whims...Ameen

Looking for proof! Read the following authentic Hadeeths listed below if you believe in authentic hadeeths. You will note that after reading all these Hadeeths, maximum you can get little relaxation on Eid days or during marriage ceremonies. The point to be noted that this relaxation is for the singing (not dancing) of small girls. In one of the Hadeeth the words of Abu Bakr (RA) "Musical instruments of Satan", proves that it was a norm that Musical instruments were not welcomed or liked. But Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) said "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268). This Hadeeth combined with other hadeeths shows permissibility or relaxation of playing music by small girls during Eid or marriage ceremony ONLY.
Following are the almost all hadeeths related to Music found in two authentic Books of Hadiths (Sahih al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim):

Narrated Aisha: Allah's Apostle (p.b.u.h) came to my house while two girls were singing beside me the songs of Buath (a story about the war between the two tribes of the Ansar, the Khazraj and the Aus, before Islam). The Prophet (p.b.u.h) lay down and turned his face to the other side. Then Abu Bakr came and spoke to me harshly saying, "Musical instruments of Satan near the Prophet (p.b.u.h) ?" Allah's Apostle (p.b.u.h) turned his face towards him and said, "Leave them." When Abu Bakr became inattentive, I signaled to those girls to go out and they left. It was the day of 'Id, and the Black people were playing with shields and spears; so either I requested the Prophet (p.b.u.h) or he asked me whether I would like to see the display. I replied in the affirmative. Then the Prophet (p.b.u.h) made me stand behind him and my cheek was touching his cheek and he was saying, "Carry on! O Bani Arfida," till I got tired. The Prophet (p.b.u.h) asked me, "Are you satisfied (Is that sufficient for you)?" I replied in the affirmative and he told me to leave. (Sahih Bukhari, Book #15, Hadith #70)

Narrated Aisha: Abu Bakr came to my house while two small Ansari girls were singing beside me the stories of the Ansar concerning the Day of Buath. And they were not singers. Abu Bakr said protestingly, "musical instruments of Satan in the house of Allah's Apostle !" It happened on the 'Id day and Allah's Apostle said, "O Abu Bakr! There is an 'Id for every nation and this is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #15, Eids, Hadith #72)

Narrated Aisha: That once Abu Bakr came to her on the day of 'Id-ul-Fitr or 'Id ul Adha while the Prophet was with her and there were two girl singers with her, singing songs of the Ansar about the day of Buath. Abu Bakr said twice. "musical instrument of Satan!" But the Prophet said, "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268)

Narrated Ar-Rabi': (the daughter of Muawwidh bin Afra) After the consummation of my marriage, the Prophet came and sat on my bed as far from me as you are sitting now, and our little girls started beating the tambourines and reciting elegiac verses mourning my father who had been killed in the battle of Badr. One of them said, "Among us is a Prophet who knows what will happen tomorrow." On that the Prophet said, "Leave this (saying) and keep on saying the verses which you had been saying before." (Sahih Bukhari; Book #62, Hadith #77)

'A'isha reported: The Messenger of Allah (way peace be upon him) came (in my apartment) while there were two girls with me singing the song of the Battle of Bu'ath. He lay down on the bed and turned away his face. Then came Abu Bakr and he scolded me and said: Oh! this musical instrument of the devil in the house of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him)! The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) turned towards him and said: Leave them alone. And when he (the Holy Prophet) became unattentive, I hinted them and they went out, and it was the day of 'Id and negroes were playing with shields and speare. (I do not remember) whether I asked the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) or whether he said to me if I desired to see (that sport). I said: Yes. I stood behind him with his face parallel to my face, and he said: O Banu Arfada, be busy (in your sports) till I was satiated. He said (to me): Is that enough? I said: Yes. Upon this he asked me to go. (Sahih Muslim, Book #004, Hadith #1942)

Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The bell is the musical instrument of the Satan. (Sahih Muslim,Book #024, Hadith #5279)

Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari: that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. And there will be some people who will stay near the side of a mountain and in the evening their shepherd will come to them with their sheep and ask them for something, but they will say to him, 'Return to us tomorrow.' Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection." (Sahih Bukhari,Book #69, Drinks, Hadith #494v)


Conclusion: The above listed hadiths can maximum justify singing (not even dancing) of little girls with daff in a non-religious activity. Singing and dancing in religious places (for example Dargah or Mazar) can not be justified in the light of above Hadeeths.

 

[modern fakir]

Proofs of Sufi Dancing [raqs]
Again Pakistan1947....I just knocking you down from your self concocted and unverified beliefs...really you have a PHD in Treachery(bigsmile)...Very beautifully you are presenting ahadith for the permissibility of Music and Musical instruments and you are Claiming them as an excuse for Sufi Raqs... Can anyone get any more treacherous than this ???[hilar]...You see with the right TAQLID (bigsmile)...we can demolish each and everyone of your self concocted beliefs...The Ahadith justifying Raqs are presented below ...(bigsmile)...But ofcourse why would you present the right hadith in the right spot..afterall ...You dont believe in 2 + 2 ...But anyways ...the world knows about people like you and here are the right Ahadith for Raqs...for the civilised Gentry


Hadith # 1

حدّثنا عبد الله حدثني أبي، ثنا عبد الصمد قال: ثنا حماد ، عن ثابت ، عن أنس قال: كانت الحبشة يزفنون بين يدي رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلّم ويرقصون ويقولون: محمد عبد صالح ، فقال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلّم: ما يقولون؟ قالوا: يقولون: محمد عبد صالح

It is narrated by Anas (R.A) that the Habashis were present in front of the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وسلم) and “THEY WERE DANCING (Yarqasun)”
and saying: Muhammadun Abdun Salih (i.e. Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم the righteous slave). The Prophet (صلى الله عليه وسلم) asked: What are they saying? They said: Muhammadun Abdun Salih
,
[Musnad Ahmed bin Hanbal, Volume No.3, Page no. 152]
,
Note : All narrators of this hadith are those of Sahih bukhari and muslim
,
Shu’yb al Aran’ut said after this hadith:
,
إسناده صحيح على شرط مسلم
,
The Chain is “SAHIH” on the criteria of “MUSLIM” [ibid]

Imam Nawawi (rah) on Above hadithsaid

with commentary by Muhammad Shirbini Khatib It is not prohibited to dance ((Shirbini ) which is not unlawful because it is only motions made while standing or bowing. Furani and others have expressly stated that neither is it offensive, but rather, is permissible, as is attested to by the hadith related in the Sahihs of Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) stood before ‘A’isha (Allah be well pleased with her) to screen her from view so that she could observe the Abyssinians sporting and dancing) – unless it is languid, like the movements of the effeminate (Mughni al-muhtaj ila ma’rifa ma’ani alfaz al-Minhaj (y73), 4.430)

Imam Ibn Hajar Al-Haytami (Rah) on above Hadith said about above hadith

Beating the kuba is prohibited… but dancing isn’t, being neither prohibited nor offensive, because it is only motions made while standing or bowing, and further because he (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) consented to the Abyssinians doing so in his mosque on the day of Eid, as related by Bukhari and Muslim.

The bold text is from the Minhaj of Imam Nawawi while the rest is Ibn Hajar’s commentary [Tuhfa al-Muhtaj fi Sharh al-Minhaj]


,
Now how many other imams [rah] of Hadith used the word Raqs "Dance" although a Salaf is enough proof in this case but still

1": Imam Tabarani [rah] used the word Raqs [dancing] Reference: Hadith #3 on page 121, Volume 9

2: Imam Nisai [rah] in Sunan Al Kubra using the word Dance "RAQS"] in page # 309, Vol 5 with same Sahih chain and says

that the Abysinians were standing in front of the door of the Holy Prophet e’s house and were ‘ecstatically dancing’ or performing raqs on anticipation of seeing the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw)

3: Imam Zamakshari also explained the same haditth with a Sahih chain calling it Raqs , And said Qala al zafaru Al Raqs The word in the hadith means Raqs

4: Imam Suyuti [rah] in[ Sharh Sahih Bukhari pg 123, Al hajl Al tawseeh] said " Al hajalo al raqs biha til maqstatin "

5: Imam Juhri [in kitab ul lugat pg 46] Says Al zafl wa Raqs
,6: Imam murtaza Zubaide [rah] in Taj us uloom kitbah ul lugat ] says " Zafana zasfun zafana ie. It Stands for Raqs [dance]

7: Imam Ibn Manzoor [in lisan ul arab, most authnetic book of lugat pg 135 ] says Al Zafl Al Raqs (i.e it means Raqs )

8: Imam Nabawi [rah] writes in sharh sahih muslim pg 347 says Mana hu yarqusoon (i.e they did Raqs)


9: Qadi Iyad [rah] said in [sarh sahih muslim pg 429 ] Al zabl hu wal raqs

So ijma of imams [rah] agreed its Raqs [dancing] what came from Sahih hadith including Imam Ahmed bin Hanbal [rah] who was a salaf himself

Hadith # 2


‘Ali ibn Abi Talib(ra) states:

حَدَّثَنَا ‏ ‏أَسْوَدُ يَعْنِي ابْنَ عَامِرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْبَأَنَا ‏ ‏إِسْرَائِيلُ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏أَبِي إِسْحَاقَ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏هَانِئِ بْنِ هَانِئٍ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏عَلِيٍّ ‏ ‏رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏أَتَيْتُ النَّبِيَّ ‏ ‏صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ ‏ ‏وَجَعْفَرٌ ‏ ‏وَزَيْدٌ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏ ‏فَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِزَيْدٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ ‏ ‏ مَوْلَايَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِجَعْفَرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ أَشْبَهْتَ خَلْقِي وَخُلُقِي قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏زَيْدٍ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ لِي أَنْتَ مِنِّي وَأَنَا مِنْكَ قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلْتُ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏جَعْفَرٍ

Aswad narrated to us that Isra’il informed us from Abi Is-haaq from Haani ibn Haani’ from ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib that he said, “I visited the Prophet (Sallallahu ‘alayhi wa Sallam) with Ja’far [ibn Abī Tālib] and Zayd [ibn Harithah]. The Prophet (Sallallāhu ‘alayhi wa Sallam) said to Zayd, “You are my freedman (mawlā’i), whereupon Zayd began to Hajala (hop on one leg- a type of dancing) around the Prophet (Sallallāhu ‘alayhi wa Sallam). The Prophet (Sallallāhu ‘alayhi wa Sallam) then said to Ja’far: “You resemble me in my physical form and character” (Khalqī wa Khuluqī), whereupon Ja’far began to do the same behind Zayd. The Nabi (Sallallāhu ‘alayhi wa Sallam) then said to me, “You are a part of me and I am a part of you” (anta minnī wa anā mink) whereupon I began to do the same behind Ja’far.”

References

►This is reported by Imām Ahmad in his Musnad (1:537 #857)2.

► Ash-Shākir declared it authentic in his review of the Musnad.

► Al-Bazzār in his Musnad with a sound chain according to Imām Al-Haythamī in his Majma’ Az-Zawā’id (5:157).

►Also reported by Imām Al-Bayhaqī in his Sunan Al-Kubrā (8:6 #15548, 20816)

►as well as Ibn Abī Shaybah in his Musannaf.

►Ibn Sa’ad reported this in Mursal form in his Tabaqāt, 4:22.

Authenticity of Above Hadith

Regarding one narrator Hani bin Hani who some ignorants use to prove above hadith weak

Imam Dhahabi (rah) said in full in his Meezan,

هانئ بن هانئ عن على رضى الله عنه. قال ابن المدينى: مجهول. وقال النسائي: ليس به بأس. وذكره ابن حبان في الثقات

Translation: Hani bin Hani narrated from Ali (Radhi Allaho Anho). Ibn Mudayni said he is Majhool. Imam Nasai (rah) said: “THERE IS NO HARM IN HIM” and Ibn Hibban mentioned him in his “THIQAAT (Reliable narrators)” [Mizan ul Aitidal (7/71)]


Imam Tirimdhi declared many ahadith from Hani bin Hani as “HASAN SAHIH” [SunnanTirimdhi Volume No.5, Hadith #3798]

Imam Ibn Majah (rah) narrated from him and did Sukoot [Sunnan Ibn Majah, Muqadma, Hadith # 143]

Imam Ibn Hibban mentioned him in his Kitab ul Thiqaat (5/508)

Muhadith Shaykh Ahmad Shaakir in his Tahqiq of Musnad Ahmad where he said: “Its chain is sound (إسناده صحيح)“ [Musnad Ahmad Volume 001, Page No. 537, Hadith Number 857, FN: 2]

Imam Ibn Hajr al Haythami (rah) said about ahadith having Hani bin Hani

ورجال أحمد والبزار رجال الصحيح غير هانىء بن هانىء وهو ثقة

Translation: The Rijaal of Ahmed and Bazaar are those of Sahih except Hani bin Hani who is “THIQA” [Majma az Zawaid (8/102)]

Imam Hakim declared ahadith from Hani bin Hani as “SAHIH” [Mustadrak al Hakim (3/179)]

Imam al Ajli (rah) said:

1885 ـ هانىء ابن هانىء، كوفي، تابعي ثقة.

Translation: Hani bin Hani, Kufi “TABI AND THIQA” [Thiqat al Ajli Volume No.1, Page No. 454]

Even famous and controversial Wahabi[salafi ] sheikh Nasir ud-din Albani declared ahadith from Hani bin Hani as “SAHIH” [Sahih Sunnan Ibn Majah by Albani, (1/119)

 

[next2saint]

You are right, you didn’t understand the matter. Innovation in worldly matters is not prohibited, but innovations in Deen is strictly prohibited because Allah S.W.T has completed our Deen for us.

By the way I am not mavlvi, I have spent my life studying science along with Islam and am a PhD Scholar in the UK. But what is wrong is wrong, doesn’t matter if mullah is saying it or a scientist

Gud to know that u r educated mulla.. (btw alim online is phd too) i hope ur phd is reliable..

yes i agree deen has been completed.. but doesnt it mean that there is no God besides Allah and Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) was the last messenger of God.

for me relying on scientific way regarding moon sighting is more islamic than relying to naked-eye witness of moon by halwa eating mullaz... i hope u aint among those who think prayers cant be accepted unless bottom of pants/shalwar is above ankles ...


in my books, education doesnt really mean knowledge...

 

[Pakistani1947]

Narrated Aisha: That once Abu Bakr came to her on the day of 'Id-ul-Fitr or 'Id ul Adha while the Prophet was with her and there were two girl singers with her, singing songs of the Ansar about the day of Buath. Abu Bakr said twice. "musical instrument of Satan!" But the Prophet said, "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268)

The words of Abu Bakr (RA) "Musical instruments of Satan", proves that it was a norm that Musical instruments were not welcomed or liked. But Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) said "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268). This Hadeeth combined with other hadeeths shows permissibility or relaxation of playing music by small girls during Eid or marriage ceremony ONLY.

Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari: that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. And there will be some people who will stay near the side of a mountain and in the evening their shepherd will come to them with their sheep and ask them for something, but they will say to him, 'Return to us tomorrow.' Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection." (Sahih Bukhari,Book #69, Drinks, Hadith #494v)

 

[modern fakir]

Narrated Aisha: That once Abu Bakr came to her on the day of 'Id-ul-Fitr or 'Id ul Adha while the Prophet was with her and there were two girl singers with her, singing songs of the Ansar about the day of Buath. Abu Bakr said twice. "musical instrument of Satan!" But the Prophet said, "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268)

The words of Abu Bakr (RA) "Musical instruments of Satan", proves that it was a norm that Musical instruments were not welcomed or liked. But Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) said "Leave them Abu Bakr, for every nation has an 'Id (i.e. festival) and this day is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #58, Hadith #268).

First : The Textual Proofs:

They base their argument on some authentic hadiths of Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). One of these hadiths is the following:

`A'ishah (may Allah be pleased with her) narrated: “Allah's Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him, came to my house while two girls were singing beside me the songs of Bu`ath (a story about the pre-Islamic war between the two tribes of the Ansar, the Khazraj and the Awus). The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) laid down and turned his face to the other side. Then Abu Bakr came and spoke to me harshly saying, ‘Musical instruments of Satan near the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him)?' Thereupon, Allah's Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) turned his face towards him and said, ‘Leave them.' When Abu Bakr became inattentive, I signaled to those girls to go out and they left.” (Reported by Al-Bukhari)

This indicates that these two girls were not so young as claimed by some scholars. If they were, Abu Bakr would not have been angry with them in such manner. In addition, in this hadith, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) wanted to teach the Jews that Islam has room for merriment and that he himself was sent with a moderate and flexible legislation. There is also another important lesson to learn here. It draws our attention to the fact that one needs to introduce Islam to others in a good fashion, along with displaying its moderateness and magnanimity.

Moreover, we can also cite as corroborating this Allah's words that read, “But when they spy some merchandise or pastime they break away to it and leave thee standing. Say: That which Allah hath is better than pastime and than merchandise, and Allah is the best of providers.” (Al-Jumu`ah: 11)

In this verse, Allah Almighty joins pastime with merchandise. He does not dispraise any of them, He just only rebuked the Companions who left Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) alone giving the khutbah (Friday Sermon), when they all rushed to attend to the caravan and beating of the drums celebrating its arrival. --- You want to talk about the Quranic Evidence now Pakistan1947 (bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)

This Hadeeth combined with other hadeeths shows permissibility or relaxation of playing music by small girls during Eid or marriage ceremony ONLY. - NO ....the permissibility of young girls is to sing for Ummul Momineed Aisha ra. Would it make sense for girls to sing infront of a Man from a Shariah Point of View ??? ...Do you have any commonsense left in you ??

Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari: that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. And there will be some people who will stay near the side of a mountain and in the evening their shepherd will come to them with their sheep and ask them for something, but they will say to him, 'Return to us tomorrow.' Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection." (Sahih Bukhari,Book #69, Drinks, Hadith #494v)


And Lastly ....lets clarify another Myth...(bigsmile)...through the scholars of Islam

Some people in supporting their view, they cite the hadith narrated by Imam Al-Bukhari on the authority of Abu Malik or Abu `Amir Al-Ash`ari (doubt from the sub-narrator) that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said, 'From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk (clothes), the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful.' Although this hadith is in Sahih Al-Bukhari, its chain of transmission is not connected to Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) and this invalidates its authenticity. Ibn Hazm rejects it for that very reason. Moreover, the sub-narrator, Hisham Ibn `Ammar is declared ‘weak' by many scholars of the Science of Hadith Methodology.

Besides, this hadith does not clearly prohibit the use of musical instruments, for the phrase 'consider as lawful,' according to Ibn Al-`Arabi, has two distinct meanings:

First : Such people think all these (the things mentioned) are lawful.

Second : They exceed the proper limits that should be observed in using these instruments. If the first meaning is intended, such people would be thus disbelievers.

In fact, the hadith in hand dispraises the manners of a group of people who indulge themselves in luxuries, drinking alcohol and listening to music. Therefore, Ibn Majah narrates this hadith from Abu Malik Al-Ash`ari in the following wording: "From among my followers there will be some people who will drink wine, giving it other names while they listen to musical instruments and the singing of female singers; Allah the Almighty will make the earth swallow them and will turn them into monkeys and pigs.” (Reported by Ibn Hibban in his Sahih )

 

[simple_and_peacefull]

I will take discussion further. Don't think that I don't have any valid point. This kind of discussions lead us both to very dangerous point which I don't want.

Secondly how can be my above post is cheap talk. If you can't understand my easy words then how can you will others details.

Talk is cheap....Bring us proof's...none of the guys opposing us here has posted any scholarly evidence ....which may prove raqs or Naats are completely Haram...We have posted several Ahadith...Bring your proofs otherwise accept the truth and dont burn in rage (bigsmile)...May Allah Truly show these ignoramouses the true and easy path to salvation and the way to a learned scholar from whom they can actually learn real Islam ...as opposed to how each and everyone one of them interpreting things according to their own wishes and whims...Ameen

 

[modern fakir]

...OK you lost me yet again ???(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)

I will take discussion further. Don't think that I don't have any valid point. This kind of discussions lead us both to very dangerous point which I don't want.

Secondly how can be my above post is cheap talk. If you can't understand my easy words then how can you will others details.

 

[simple_and_peacefull]

I missed one word in my last post.....


It was


I will not take this discussion further.

...OK you lost me yet again ???(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)

 

[Pakistani1947]

This indicates that these two girls were not so young as claimed by some scholars. If they were, Abu Bakr would not have been angry with them in such manner. In addition, in this hadith, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) wanted to teach the Jews that Islam has room for merriment and that he himself was sent with a moderate and flexible legislation. There is also another important lesson to learn here. It draws our attention to the fact that one needs to introduce Islam to others in a good fashion, along with displaying its moderateness and magnanimity.

This is perfect example of blind following. Why don't you clearly say that you would not accept even authentic Hadeeths if it is against the believe of your Peer. Have some fear of Allah and do not twist the Hadeeth by adding your own assumptions!

Let me see how you would twist the meaning of another Hadeeth, regarding the same issue, where clearly the word "two small Ansari girls" is used:

Narrated Aisha: Abu Bakr came to my house while two small Ansari girls were singing beside me the stories of the Ansar concerning the Day of Buath. And they were not singers. Abu Bakr said protestingly, "musical instruments of Satan in the house of Allah's Apostle !" It happened on the 'Id day and Allah's Apostle said, "O Abu Bakr! There is an 'Id for every nation and this is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #15, Eids, Hadith #72)

 

[modern fakir]

Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

Originally Posted by modern fakir

This indicates that these two girls were not so young as claimed by some scholars. If they were, Abu Bakr would not have been angry with them in such manner. In addition, in this hadith, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) wanted to teach the Jews that Islam has room for merriment and that he himself was sent with a moderate and flexible legislation. There is also another important lesson to learn here. It draws our attention to the fact that one needs to introduce Islam to others in a good fashion, along with displaying its moderateness and magnanimity.




This is perfect example of blind following. Why don't you clearly say that you would not accept even authentic Hadeeths if it is against the believe of your Peer. Have some fear of Allah and do not twist the Hadeeth by adding your own assumptions! -

No Pakistan1947...The problem is You have PEER-O-PHOBIA ...where every legit scholar appears as a Peer to you(bigsmile)...Everytime a proper scholar comments on something you get a severe bowel movement when you yourself are worth nothing in terms of knowledge and get ridiculed and severely exposed on this forum for following beliefs created by YOU YOURSELF and your like minded Hicks !

Any scholarly work is unacceptable to you...EVEN when the Proper Hadith are presented to you ..your thick head is so indoctrinated with NAJDI ideology that you fail to accept even the slightest of alternate opinions. That my friend is the problem with you !(bigsmile)

And Alhamdullilah we have no problem following Peers because we rather follow learned men in Islam then self concocted and self made versions of


Let me see how you would twist the meaning of another Hadeeth, regarding the same issue, where clearly the word "two small Ansari girls" is used:

Narrated Aisha: Abu Bakr came to my house while two small Ansari girls were singing beside me the stories of the Ansar concerning the Day of Buath. And they were not singers. Abu Bakr said protestingly, "musical instruments of Satan in the house of Allah's Apostle !" It happened on the 'Id day and Allah's Apostle said, "O Abu Bakr! There is an 'Id for every nation and this is our 'Id." (Sahih Bukhari, Book #15, Eids, Hadith #72)

- Now, i have clearly Refuted that the TWO SMALL girls are reciting to Bibi Aisha ra because she is a lady ..Would it have made sense for Young Boys to have recited to her Nauzubillah...ONLY A CORRUPT MIND CAN even think of this ..YOU ARE INDEED SICK !! ??...You my friend are so far burning in rage that common sense has no effect on you ...And by the way this is the Hadith of Raqs where Hazrat Jafar Bin abi Talib ra >====== He is a MAN

Ali ibn Abi Talib(ra) states:

حَدَّثَنَا ‏ ‏أَسْوَدُ يَعْنِي ابْنَ عَامِرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْبَأَنَا ‏ ‏إِسْرَائِيلُ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏أَبِي إِسْحَاقَ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏هَانِئِ بْنِ هَانِئٍ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏عَلِيٍّ ‏ ‏رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏أَتَيْتُ النَّبِيَّ ‏ ‏صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ ‏ ‏وَجَعْفَرٌ ‏ ‏وَزَيْدٌ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏ ‏فَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِزَيْدٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ ‏ ‏ مَوْلَايَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِجَعْفَرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ أَشْبَهْتَ خَلْقِي وَخُلُقِي قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏زَيْدٍ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ لِي أَنْتَ مِنِّي وَأَنَا مِنْكَ قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلْتُ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏جَعْفَرٍ

Aswad narrated to us that Israil informed us from Abi Is-haaq from Haani ibn Haani from Ali ibn Abi Taalib that he said, I visited the Prophet (Sallallahu alayhi wa Sallam) with Jafar [ibn Abī Tālib] and Zayd [ibn Harithah] <======= They are Both MEN because Our Beloved Prophet pbuh is Mashallah Present. The Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) said to Zayd, You are my freedman (mawlāi), whereupon Zayd ( THE MAN (bigsmile)) began to Hajala (hop on one leg- a type of dancing) around the Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam). The Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) then said to Jafar: You resemble me in my physical form and character (Khalqī wa Khuluqī), whereupon Jafar began to do the same behind Zayd (<==== The Man). The Nabi (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) then said to me, You are a part of me and I am a part of you (anta minnī wa anā mink) whereupon I began to do the same behind Jafar.

Now Two girls (Women) singing infront of Bibi Aisha ra (Woman) ummul momineen and and SAHABI MEN Dancing infront of the Prophet Pbuh.....I will write this one more time M-E-N ...(bigsmile)(bigsmile)

So now Pakistan1947 ..here is logic ...Woman sing for Woman = Islam
Man sings for Man = Islam
Women sings for Man = We all know what that is (bigsmile)

You know what, even after this I can assure you, you wont understand ..because najdi ideology is very hard to get rid off ![hilar][hilar]

 

[Serving Islam]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

Proofs of Sufi Dancing [raqs]

Hadith # 1

حدّثنا عبد الله حدثني أبي، ثنا عبد الصمد قال: ثنا حماد ، عن ثابت ، عن أنس قال: كانت الحبشة يزفنون بين يدي رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلّم ويرقصون ويقولون: محمد عبد صالح ، فقال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلّم: ما يقولون؟ قالوا: يقولون: محمد عبد صالح

It is narrated by Anas (R.A) that the Habashis were present in front of the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وسلم) and THEY WERE DANCING (Yarqasun)
and saying: Muhammadun Abdun Salih (i.e. Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم the righteous slave). The Prophet (صلى الله عليه وسلم) asked: What are they saying? They said: Muhammadun Abdun Salih
,
[Musnad Ahmed bin Hanbal, Volume No.3, Page no. 152]
,
Note : All narrators of this hadith are those of Sahih bukhari and muslim
,
Shuyb al Aranut said after this hadith:
,
إسناده صحيح على شرط مسلم
,
The Chain is SAHIH on the criteria of MUSLIM [ibid]

Imam Nawawi (rah) on Above hadithsaid

with commentary by Muhammad Shirbini Khatib It is not prohibited to dance ((Shirbini ) which is not unlawful because it is only motions made while standing or bowing. Furani and others have expressly stated that neither is it offensive, but rather, is permissible, as is attested to by the hadith related in the Sahihs of Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) stood before Aisha (Allah be well pleased with her) to screen her from view so that she could observe the Abyssinians sporting and dancing) unless it is languid, like the movements of the effeminate (Mughni al-muhtaj ila marifa maani alfaz al-Minhaj (y73), 4.430)

Imam Ibn Hajar Al-Haytami (Rah) on above Hadith said about above hadith

Beating the kuba is prohibited but dancing isnt, being neither prohibited nor offensive, because it is only motions made while standing or bowing, and further because he (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) consented to the Abyssinians doing so in his mosque on the day of Eid, as related by Bukhari and Muslim.

The bold text is from the Minhaj of Imam Nawawi while the rest is Ibn Hajars commentary [Tuhfa al-Muhtaj fi Sharh al-Minhaj]


,
Now how many other imams [rah] of Hadith used the word Raqs "Dance" although a Salaf is enough proof in this case but still

1": Imam Tabarani [rah] used the word Raqs [dancing] Reference: Hadith #3 on page 121, Volume 9

2: Imam Nisai [rah] in Sunan Al Kubra using the word Dance "RAQS"] in page # 309, Vol 5 with same Sahih chain and says

that the Abysinians were standing in front of the door of the Holy Prophet es house and were ecstatically dancing or performing raqs on anticipation of seeing the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw)

3: Imam Zamakshari also explained the same haditth with a Sahih chain calling it Raqs , And said Qala al zafaru Al Raqs The word in the hadith means Raqs

4: Imam Suyuti [rah] in[ Sharh Sahih Bukhari pg 123, Al hajl Al tawseeh] said " Al hajalo al raqs biha til maqstatin "

5: Imam Juhri [in kitab ul lugat pg 46] Says Al zafl wa Raqs
,6: Imam murtaza Zubaide [rah] in Taj us uloom kitbah ul lugat ] says " Zafana zasfun zafana ie. It Stands for Raqs [dance]

7: Imam Ibn Manzoor [in lisan ul arab, most authnetic book of lugat pg 135 ] says Al Zafl Al Raqs (i.e it means Raqs )

8: Imam Nabawi [rah] writes in sharh sahih muslim pg 347 says Mana hu yarqusoon (i.e they did Raqs)


9: Qadi Iyad [rah] said in [sarh sahih muslim pg 429 ] Al zabl hu wal raqs

So ijma of imams [rah] agreed its Raqs [dancing] what came from Sahih hadith including Imam Ahmed bin Hanbal [rah] who was a salaf himself

Hadith # 2


Ali ibn Abi Talib(ra) states:

حَدَّثَنَا ‏ ‏أَسْوَدُ يَعْنِي ابْنَ عَامِرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْبَأَنَا ‏ ‏إِسْرَائِيلُ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏أَبِي إِسْحَاقَ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏هَانِئِ بْنِ هَانِئٍ ‏ ‏عَنْ ‏ ‏عَلِيٍّ ‏ ‏رَضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏أَتَيْتُ النَّبِيَّ ‏ ‏صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ ‏ ‏وَجَعْفَرٌ ‏ ‏وَزَيْدٌ ‏ ‏قَالَ ‏ ‏فَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِزَيْدٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ ‏ ‏ مَوْلَايَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ ‏ ‏لِجَعْفَرٍ ‏ ‏أَنْتَ أَشْبَهْتَ خَلْقِي وَخُلُقِي قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلَ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏زَيْدٍ ‏ ‏قَالَ وَقَالَ لِي أَنْتَ مِنِّي وَأَنَا مِنْكَ قَالَ ‏ ‏ فَحَجَلْتُ ‏ ‏وَرَاءَ ‏ ‏جَعْفَرٍ

Aswad narrated to us that Israil informed us from Abi Is-haaq from Haani ibn Haani from Ali ibn Abi Taalib that he said, I visited the Prophet (Sallallahu alayhi wa Sallam) with Jafar [ibn Abī Tālib] and Zayd [ibn Harithah]. The Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) said to Zayd, You are my freedman (mawlāi), whereupon Zayd began to Hajala (hop on one leg- a type of dancing) around the Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam). The Prophet (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) then said to Jafar: You resemble me in my physical form and character (Khalqī wa Khuluqī), whereupon Jafar began to do the same behind Zayd. The Nabi (Sallallāhu alayhi wa Sallam) then said to me, You are a part of me and I am a part of you (anta minnī wa anā mink) whereupon I began to do the same behind Jafar.

References

►This is reported by Imām Ahmad in his Musnad (1:537 #857)2.

► Ash-Shākir declared it authentic in his review of the Musnad.

► Al-Bazzār in his Musnad with a sound chain according to Imām Al-Haythamī in his Majma Az-Zawāid (5:157).

►Also reported by Imām Al-Bayhaqī in his Sunan Al-Kubrā (8:6 #15548, 20816)

►as well as Ibn Abī Shaybah in his Musannaf.

►Ibn Saad reported this in Mursal form in his Tabaqāt, 4:22.

Authenticity of Above Hadith

Regarding one narrator Hani bin Hani who some ignorants use to prove above hadith weak

Imam Dhahabi (rah) said in full in his Meezan,

هانئ بن هانئ عن على رضى الله عنه. قال ابن المدينى: مجهول. وقال النسائي: ليس به بأس. وذكره ابن حبان في الثقات

Translation: Hani bin Hani narrated from Ali (Radhi Allaho Anho). Ibn Mudayni said he is Majhool. Imam Nasai (rah) said: THERE IS NO HARM IN HIM and Ibn Hibban mentioned him in his THIQAAT (Reliable narrators) [Mizan ul Aitidal (7/71)]


Imam Tirimdhi declared many ahadith from Hani bin Hani as HASAN SAHIH [SunnanTirimdhi Volume No.5, Hadith #3798]

Imam Ibn Majah (rah) narrated from him and did Sukoot [Sunnan Ibn Majah, Muqadma, Hadith # 143]

Imam Ibn Hibban mentioned him in his Kitab ul Thiqaat (5/508)

Muhadith Shaykh Ahmad Shaakir in his Tahqiq of Musnad Ahmad where he said: Its chain is sound (إسناده صحيح) [Musnad Ahmad Volume 001, Page No. 537, Hadith Number 857, FN: 2]

Imam Ibn Hajr al Haythami (rah) said about ahadith having Hani bin Hani

ورجال أحمد والبزار رجال الصحيح غير هانىء بن هانىء وهو ثقة

Translation: The Rijaal of Ahmed and Bazaar are those of Sahih except Hani bin Hani who is THIQA [Majma az Zawaid (8/102)]

Imam Hakim declared ahadith from Hani bin Hani as SAHIH [Mustadrak al Hakim (3/179)]

Imam al Ajli (rah) said:

1885 ـ هانىء ابن هانىء، كوفي، تابعي ثقة.

Translation: Hani bin Hani, Kufi TABI AND THIQA [Thiqat al Ajli Volume No.1, Page No. 454]

Even famous and controversial Wahabi[salafi ] sheikh Nasir ud-din Albani declared ahadith from Hani bin Hani as SAHIH [Sahih Sunnan Ibn Majah by Albani, (1/119)

Scanned page of above hadith from Musnad of Imam Ahmed bin Hanbal [rah]

Also

 

[Serving Islam]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

Imam Baihaqi (rah) proves Raqs from this hadith

Shaykh ul Islam Ibn Hajr Haythami (rah) said: “All narrators are those of Sahih (رجاله رجال الصحيح)“ [Majma’ Az-Zawa’id, Volume 005, Page No. 157]


Imam Bayhaqi made a whole chapter on permissibility of Raqs and after citing this hadith he said: In this (hadith) is“SAHIH PROOF” and "PERMISSIBILITY" of hoping (dancing) which includes “RISING UP OR JUMPING IN STATE OF JOY” and also that of doing “RAQS” which is similar to it [Sunnan al Baihaqi al Kubra (15/333)]

Imam Bayhaqi also states in Shu’yb ul Imaan:

وأما الرقص فإن لم يكن فيه تكسر وتخنث فلا بأس فإنه روي أن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم
قال لزيد أنت مولانا فحجل وهو أن يرفع رجلا ويقفز إلى الأخرى من

الفرح وقال لجعفر أشبهت خلقي وخلقي فحجل

Translation: As regarding “Raqs” If it does not include going wild and one does not act like the women then “THERE IS NO HARM IN IT” as the Prophet (Peace be upon him) said to Zayd (ra): You are my freedman (anta Mawlay), at this Zayd began to hop on one leg (hajala) around the Prophet (Peace be upon him), and he did this in joy, then the Prophet (Peace be upon him) said to Jafar (ra): You resemble me in my creation and my manners, at this Jafar also began to hop behind Zayd [Shu’yb ul Imaan, Volume No.4, Page No. 483-484]




Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani (rah) said : “Yes! Verily Ja’far ibn Abi Taalib Radhiya Allahu ‘Anhu did raqsin the presence of Rasulullah when he told Ja’far ‘You resemble me in my created form and in my character.’ It would have been necessary for the Nabi (alayhis salaam) to clarify whether it was halaal or haraam, yet the Nabi (’alayhis salaam) did not reject it. This is known in Mustalah Al-Hadith as “Iqraar“, or the acceptance and approval of the Prophet Muhammad . And the Nabi (’alayhis salaam) would not have remained silent regarding the Haraam (forbidden) or the Makruh (hated).”

Reference

► Shaykh Yusuf Khattaar Muhammad references As-Suyuti’s quote from As-Sayf Al-Qaati’ and also Al-Ilhamaat Al-Ilhiyah of Shaykh Mahmuh Abi Shaamaat; See the Maws’uah page 185 published in Damascus in 1999, third edition

Imam Jalal ud din Suyuti [rah]proves Raqs [dancing] in Love of Allah from Quran and Hadiths

وكيف ينكر الذكر قائما والقيام ذاكرا وقد قال الله تعالى (الذين يذكرون الله قياما وقعودا وعلى جنوبهم) وقالت عائشة رضي الله عنها كان النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم يذكر الله على كل أحيانه، وإن انضم إلى هذا القيام رقص أو نحوه فلا إنكار عليهم فذلك من لذات الشهود أو المواجيد وقد ورد في الحديث رقص جعفر بن أبي طالب بين يدي النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم لما قال له أشبهت خلقي وخلقي وذلك من لذة هذا الخطاب ولم ينكر ذلك عليه النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فكان هذا أصلا في رقص الصوفية لما يدركونه من لذات المواجيد وقد صح القيام والرقص في مجالس الذكر والسماع عن جماعة من كبار الأئمة منهم شيخ الإسلام عز الدين بن عبد السلام.

“How can one condemn making dhikr while standing, or standing while making dhikr, when Allah says, “. . . those who invoke Allah standing, sitting, and upon their sides” Qur’an 3:191. And Hazrat A`isha Siddiqa (RA) said,‘ The Prophet (SAW) used to invoke Allah at all of his times.’ Sahih Muslim, 1.282: 373 And if dancing is added to this standing, it may not be condemned, as it is of the joy of spiritual vision and ecstasy, and It is mentioned in the hadith that Ja`far ibn Abi Talib (RA) danced in front of the Prophet (Ssalallaho alaihi wasalam) when the Prophet (Salallaho alaihi wasalam) told him, ‘You resemble me in looks and in character,’ dancing from the happiness he felt from being thus addressed, and the Prophet did not condemn him for doing so, this being a basis for the legal acceptability of the Sufis dancing from the joys of the ecstasies they experience. ..Hence it is correct to stand and dance during gatherings of Dhikr and Sama according to a group of great scholars, among them being Shaykh al- Islam Izz ud-din bin Abdus Salam.”[Imam Jalal ud din Suyuti in Al-Hawi lil Fatawi, Volume No. 2, Page No. 406, Maktaba al Asriyyah Edition].

scanned page

 

[Serving Islam]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

Imam Ghazali (rah) in His Ihya reported Same hadith an supported Raqs too


He [rah] states in his Ihya uloom ud din , vol 2, Pg 179

لأدب الرابع‏:‏ أن لا يقوم ولا يرفع صوته بالبكاء وهو يقدر على ضبط نفسه ولكن إن رقص أو تباكى فهو مباح فيجوز تحريكه‏.‏
ولو كان ذلك حراماً لما نظرت عائشة رضي الله عنها إلى الحبشة مع رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم وهم يزفنون هذا لفظ عائشة رضي الله عنها في بعض الروايات‏.‏
وقد روي عن جماعة من الصحابة رضي الله عنهم أنهم حجلوا لما ورد عليهم سرور أوجب ذلك وذلك في قصة ابنة حمزة لما اختصم فيها على بن أبي طالب وأخوه جعفر وزيد بن حارثة رضي الله عنهم فتشاحوا في تربيتها فقال صلى الله عليه وسلم لعلي ‏”‏ أنت مني وأنا منك ‏”‏ فحجل علي وقال لجعفر ‏”‏ أشبهت خلقي وخلقي ‏”‏ فحجل وراء حجل علي وقال لزيد ‏”‏ أنت أخوناً ومولانا ‏”‏ فحجل زيد وراء حجل جعفر ثم قال عليه السلام ‏”‏ هي لجعفر لأن خالتها تحته والخالة والدة ‏”‏ وفي رواية أنه قال لعائشة رضي الله عنها ‏”‏ أتحبين أن تنظري إلى زفن الحبشة ‏”‏ والزفن والحجل هو الرقص

Imam Ibn Hajar Al-Haytami said

وقد صحَّ القيامُ والرقصُ في مجالس الذكر والسماع عن جماعة من كبار الأئمة منهم عزّ الدين شيخ الإسلام ابن عبد السلام
,
"It is permissible to stand and dance during gatherings of remembrance and audition according to a group of great scholars, among them being Shaykh Al-Islam Ibn Abdussalam." (فتاويه الحديثية pg. 298 )

Regarding Shaikh Izz Ad din it states:

"kana yahduru al sama` wa yarqusu wa yatawajadu"

meaning:

" (He) attended the sama` and danced in states of ecstasy"

This is reported by Nabahani in his Jami Karamat Al Awliya


[SIZE=+2]
Views of Ibn Kathir [/SIZE]
ابن زين الدين علي بن تبكتكين أحد الأجواد والسادات الكبراء والملوك الأمجاد، له آثار حسنة وقد عمر الجامع المظفري بسفح قاسيون، وكان قدهم بسياقه الماء إليه من ماء بذيرة فمنعه المعظم من ذلك، واعتل بأنه قد يمر على مقابر المسلمين بالسفوح، وكان يعمل المولد الشريف في ربيع الأول ويحتفل به احتفالا هائلا.
وكان مع ذلك شهما شجاعا فاتكا بطلا عاقلا عالما عادلا رحمه الله وأكرم مثواه.
وقد صنف الشيخ أبو الخطاب ابن دحية له مجلدا في المولد النبوي سماه: (التنوير في مولد البشير النذير)، فأجازه على ذلك بألف دينار، وقد طالت مدته في الملك في زمان الدولة الصلاحية، وقد كان محاصر عكا وإلى هذه السنة محمود السيرة والسريرة.
قال السبط: حكى بعض من حضر سماط المظفر في بعض الموالد كان يمد في ذلك السماط خمسة آلاف رأس مشوي، وعشرة آلاف دجاجة، ومائة ألف زبدية، وثلاثين ألف صحن حلوى، قال: وكان يحضر عنده في المولد أعيان العلماء والصوفية فيخلع عليهم ويطلق لهم ويعمل للصوفية سماعا من الظهر إلى الفجر، ويرقص بنفسه معهم، وكانت له دار ضيافة للوافدين من أي جهة على أي صفة، وكانت صدقاته في جميع القرب والطاعات على الحرمين وغيرهما، ويتفك من الفرنج في كل سنة خلقا من الأسارى.
حتى قيل إن جملة من استفكه من أيديهم ستون ألف أسير، قالت: زوجته ربيعة خاتون بنت أيوب - وكان قد زوجه إياها أخوها صلاح الدين، لما كان معه على عكا - قالت: كان قميصه لا يساوي خمسة دراهم فعاتبته بذلك فقال: لبسي ثوبا بخمسة وأتصدق بالباقي خير من أن البس ثوبا مثمنا وأدع الفقير المسكين، وكان يصرف على المولد في كل سنة ثلاثمائة ألف دينار، وعلى دار الضيافة في كل سنة مائة ألف دينار.
وعلى الحرمين والمياه بدرب الحجاز ثلاثين ألف دينار سوى صدقات السر، رحمه الله تعالى، وكانت وفاته بقلعة إربل، وأوصى أن يحمل إلى مكة فلم يتفق فدفن بمشهد علي.
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Translation :
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I say that the Shah of Irbil. Malik Muzzafar Abu Sa’ed Kokabri Ibn Zayn-ud-din Ali bin Tabaktakin was a "GENEROUS, MIGHTY MASTER AND UPRIGHT RULER AND HIS WORKS WERE VERY GOOD" . He built Jamiya al Muzaffari near Qasiyun…الشريف في ربيع الاول ويحتفل به احتفا



"CELEBRATE MAWLID ASH-SHARIF WITH GREAT CELEBRATION (وكان يعمل المولد الشريف في ربيع الاول ويحتفل به احتفالا )" Moreover, he was "BENEVOLENT, BRAVE, WISE, A SCHOLAR AND JUST PERSON" – Rahimuhullah wal Ikraam – Sheikh Abul Khattab (rah) wrote a book on Mawlid an Nabwi for him and named it At-Tanwir fi Mawlid al Bashir al Nazeer, for which he gave him 1000 dinars. His rule stayed till the Rule of Salahiya and he captured Aka and he remained a man worthy of respect. Al-Sabt mentions that a person attending the gathering of Mawlid held by Muzzafar said: He used to fill the table with 5000 well cooked goats, 10,000 *****ens, 100-thousand bowls (of milk) and 30,000 trays of sweets.

The narrator explains that During Mawlid he used to hold great gathering of "SUFIS AND ULAMA AND HE USED TO GRANT THEM GIFTS": He used to arrange Sama for Sufis from Dhuhr till Asr IN WHICH HE HIMSELF DID RAQS. and he had built a Dar ul Ziafat for everyone who came no matter what position the person held, and he used to give sadaqat for Haramain Shareefain and also used to get many prisoners free from Farangis (i.e. white people probably Christians/Jews), It is said that he got 60,000 prisoners free from them.

His wife Rabiya bint Ayyub "WHO WAS MARRIED TO HIM BY HER BROTHER SALAH UD-DIN AYYUBI (Rahimuhullah), she says that his shirt was not even worth 5 Dirhams, so she complained to him about it at which he replied: For me to wear shirt of 5 Dirhams only and give remaining as Sadaqa is better than wearing expensive clothes or to leave the Fuqara and Masakeen. He used to spend Three hundred thousand Dinaar on Mawlid every year, Hundred thousand Dinar on welcoming guests, and 30,000 dinars to provide water for Pilgrims on travel – Rahimuhullah -
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[Imam al Hafidh Ibn Kathir in Al Bidayah Wal Nihayah, Volume No.13, Page Nos. 174-175]

Click here for Scan page from Al Bidayah

 

[Serving Islam]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

Now on issue of Wajd, Ecstasy , Swoon

Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal(ra) said about the Sufis Ecstasy

He said "I don't know people better than them." Someone said to him: "They listen to sama and they reach states of ecstasy." He said: " Do you prevent them from enjoying an hour with Allah?"

Reference :

[From Muhammad ibn Ahmad al-Saffarini al-Hanbali (died 1188) who related in his Ghidha' al-albab li-sharh manzumat al-adab from Ibrahim ibn `Abd Allah al-Qalanasi) (Cairo: Matba`at al-Najah, 1324/1906)]


Imam Ghazali [rah][/SIZE] mentioned Mentions Sahabas (ra), Salafs [rah] in extreme Ecstasy in Ihya uloom ud din , vol 2

Imam Ibn e Arabi on wajd/ecstasy

In his book kitabb al wajd (luma 306.4-308.2) ,Janayd and sari al saqati( in d.253/867) explain that wajd can produce insensitivity towards pain to such an extent that a person can be struct by sword but not feel its effect

Imam Abu'l Husayn al-warraq (rah)

Said that The way to God is difficult for one who does not come upon it with overwhelming enthusiasm (Wajd) and passionate desire.

Abu Hamza al khurasani [rah]

Said that HE heard his companions censuring another for being overcome by wajd ,and showing his inner state in a gathering where there were opponents of sama.Abu hamza (Rah) told him to stop his scolding for wajd obliterate distinctions,one should not be censured for being over come by wajd which is involuntary act, Then he quoted the verses from books of Moulana Rumi (rah) (d.283/896)

Abu abd Allah al subayhi [rah]

said When wajd is genuine it should be upheld and defended, no one should be allowed to speak disparagingly of an altered state(hal)
He again said " The most complete form of fear is the one which takes characteristics of wajd, not from loss of some thing hoped for or desired

Imam Al kattani [rah]

said that the listener of sama ought to find more than just refershment,it causes wajd ,or being over whlemed, which destroys every settled and familiar nothing

Abu Ali ad daqqaq [rah] said

that Abu l Husayn An Nuri (Rah) writes
For 20 years I was between wajd and faqd,when I found my lord I lost my heart and when I found my heart I lost my lord

Imam Siraaj [rah] in his kitab ul luma

writes and gives authentic proofs of Prophet (Saw) and Sahabis (ra) going into wajd state several times, on hearing Quran

The great classical scholar Hadrat Ibn e Arabi [rah]

Says :Wajd is the states that come upon the heart,unexpectedly, and annihilate it from witnessing itself and those present ( kitab al wajd in luma p 309)

Sulami stated that Imam Junayd(rah) said,

"Nearness through ecstasy (wajd) is 'in-gathering' (jam'); and absence through humanness is separation (tafriqah)."

Ibn E Taymiyyah[the wahabi sheikh ul islam] on Fana(wajd)

Book: Al Ubudiyyah: Being A True Slave Of Allah
Author: Ibn Taymiyah
Published: Ta-Ha Publishers
Adress: 1 Wynne Road, London,
PostCode: SW9 0BB
Country: UK

Page Number: 126
Chapter: Fana {"Oblivion"**

"An example of this is the concept of Fana {extinction of individual consciouness, recedence of the ego, obliteration of the self**. Fana is of three types:

1** The fana of the Prophets and Awliyah {Fana Fir'Rasool' & Fana Fil Awliyah** who have attained perfection.
2**The Fana of the Awliyah and the righteous peopl who are striving in the right direction even though they are not perfect.

Page Number: 127

3** The Fana of the hypocrites and heretics who liken Allah to His creation.

The first type of fana means the oblertation of the desire for anything except Allah so that a person does not love anyone or anything except Allah he does not worship anything except Him, he does not rely on anyone except Him and he deos not ask from anyone except Him. This is the sense which should be understood from the words of Seikh Abu Yazid {Al Bistami**: "I want to not to want anything except what He wants, what Pleases the beloved {Allah**." This is what is meant by the religios will of Allah. Perfection means that a man does not want love or like anything except what Allah wants loves and likes which is what He as caommanded and made wajib or mustahab. He only loves those whom Allah loves and such as the Angles, Prophets, and the righteous people. This is what is meant by their intrepration of the Ayah:


This is what is meant by their intrepration of the Ayah: "But only he will prosper who bring to Allah a sound heart." {26:89** They said its is sound and safe from evertthing ecept being a slave of Allah or everything ecvept wanting what Allah wants or everything except Loivng Allah. The meaning is the same and whether its is called fana or not it is the begining and end of Islam the foucus of entire religion."


The second type of fana is oblivion towards others which is attained by many of those who follow the path {triqah**, because their hearts are strongly attracted to remembering, wroshipping and loving Allah and distracted from noticing anyone or anything else. Nothing crosses their minds except thoughts of Allah; they are not even aware of anythng else, as was said in the interpretation of the ayah: "But there came to be a void in the heart of the mother of Musa. she was going almost to disclose his {case**, had We not strenthen her heart {with faith** ..." [28:10** They said: her heart was oblivious to ...
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Page Number: 128

... everything except thoughts of Musa which is the kind of thing that often happens to thouse who are overwhelmed with some concern whether it be love or hope or fear - the heart is disracted from everything except that which is loved or hoped for or feared, so that it is unaware of anything else.
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If this kind of fana overwhelms a person his focus on Allah becomes so intense that he is no longer aware of anything else, not his own existance or the dhikr he is doing and everything diminishes in his senses, every created being the person, himself and everyone else and there remains only the Lord. What is meant is that everything is diminished in persons perception, so that he longer notices or remebers anything, and is quite oblivious to what is going on around him.


If this feeling becomes so strong that the person becomes confused and can no longer make proper distinctions he may think that he is his beloved, as it was said that a man fell into the water and the one who loved him threw himself in after him. The former said: "I fell in by accident; what made you fall?" and the later replied: "I was so overwhelmed with love for you that i thought I was you."
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The idea as caused many people to stumble so that they thought in the terms of phisical unity whereby there is no longer any difference between a person and the object of his love. This is incorrect, for the Creator can not be united with anything else without becoming somehting else altogather; ther essecne of the two things is lost when they unite, and they become a third of thing, neither this nor that as is the case when water and milk are mixed togather, or water or wine and so on. But what is loved and wanted by both becomes one, and what is hated and loathed by both becomes one, so they love ...


on page 129 ibn taymiyyah states about salafs

....... at the time of the Tabi'in, among the worshippers of Al Basra, among whom were some who would swooon or even die when they heard the Quran, such as Abu Juhayr Al Darir and Zararah Ibn Awfa the Qadi of Al Basra.

Some of the Sufi Shaykhs experience this kind of oblivios and and intoxication where they are unable to make proper distinctions, and when they are in that state they may say words which when they come round they realise are wrong
,. Such stories are reported about ...

... acetics such as Abu Yazid {al Bistami**, Abu'l Hasan Al Nuri and Abu Bakr Al Shibli and so on ...


on Page Number: 130

... unlike Abu Sulayman Al Darini, Maruf Al Khar'ki, and Al Fudayl Ibn Ayyad, let alone Al Junayd {Al Baghdadi** and so on, who remained of the sound mind throughou all their experiences and who never rell into states of oblivion or intoxication, etc. Those who have reached a level ofperfection have nothing in theri hearts except love of Allah and the desire to worship Him alone.[Book: Al Ubudiyyah: Being A True Slave Of Allahm Ta-Ha Publishers]

Ibn Taymiyyah again said again

The second category consists of those sufis whose experience of fana and intoxication (sukr) weakened their sense of discrimination, and made them utter words that they later realized to be erroneous when they became sober

► Majmu Fatawa vol. 10, pp. 220-1

 

[Bombaybuz]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

I have no idea how you guys are COURAGE and then time to discuss these things and 2ndly how this will be any help if the ultimate goal on the both sides is salvation on D say ... to me its playing playing with fire ... one dot here n there and whole life's struggle will be in vain ... just can't say even a word more.

 

[modern fakir]

Re: Clarification and Refutation of Raqs - Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaah

As the colloquial saying goes ...No one is playing with anything ..This is a forum and we are presenting SCHOLARLY articles ..I dont know why a healthy debate is a matter of concern.

WE HAVE CATEGORICALLY DENIED SUPPORTING ANY MUSICAL ACTIVITY IN SUPPORT OF THE VIEWS OF THE MODERN WORLD OR WHAT IS CONSIDERED HARAM.

The discussion only pertains to WAJD, RAQS in which the object of recitation is either ALLAH swt or the LOVE OF RASULLULLAH or things considered Halal as your parents or sheikh ....Is taking the name of Rasulullah PLaying with fire ??...Can someone explain this to me ??

I have no idea how you guys are COURAGE and then time to discuss these things and 2ndly how this will be any help if the ultimate goal on the both sides is salvation on D say ... to me its playing playing with fire ... one dot here n there and whole life's struggle will be in vain ... just can't say even a word more.