Kerry Alliance of sunni countries against ISIL is a nonstarter in present format .

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
John Kerry,s sunni coalition against ISIL is a house of cards , it will fall apart soon even before taking off and renegotiation of terms of coalition will occur .

It is not possible for neither Obama nor khamaenei to allow Obama to set up a suited booted Iraqi shia sunni coalition to buttress an agreement whereby some ground troops of symbolic nature like those of UN forces of Saudia ,Egypt , Turkey are made avaialble to provide cover to bombard Iraqi sunni ISIL coalition while real ground action is done by wild shia ,militias of Iran and Iraq and special western troops help peshmargas Kurds to contain ISIL . This will never work . Egypt , Saudia , Turkey all three do not trust USA anymore , all have seen it creating difficulties for each one of them like in Pakistan.

Turkey is the first to try renegotiate any action , Saudia is vary suspicious lest it is again stabbed in the back as ISIL has too many western origin Muslims or may be infiltrates of western agencies . The western style execution of western journalists, the declaration of caliphate too early in ISIL effort all are making saudis vary , Pakistan is to be involved in sealing of Saudi Iraq border like Egyptians not so much in official capacity as via recruitment some say . The helping of PKK always at war with Turkey of peshmargas of Iraq with which Turkey has working relationship makes Turkey doubly wary .

With Egypt Turkey and Saudi in no more than sybolic alliance and actual action is to be by US,France and Iran with symbolic UK presence assured by execution of British journalist aid worker is all what the plan is .

Iraqi sunnis and Iran normally under good leadership should have preferred to involve regional states along with ISil in a solution rather than beg USA and France to help the illegal government of Baghdad and Syria . If Iran follows the diastrous course in Iraq and Syria In the end Syria will be destroyed economically , Iranians and Russians will have to protect alawites from massacres , Shia will have to migrate from Saudia , they will have to seek western help in Yemen , it will all be a mayhem and blood every where .

Now is the best time for regional solution , Iran is humiliated but Saudia will not like ISIL to grow too much either , Turkey will also like a regional solution before PKK and peshmargas unite with western influence , along with Iran if Asad and Alawites quit syrian government .

Turkey Takes in ‘Terrorists’ from the Muslim Brotherhood

The Turkish government is increasingly at odds with the United States and its Arab allies in the anti-ISIS coalition.
ISTANBUL, Turkey — As the United States tries to cobble together a regional alliance capable of containing and eventually crushing the self-styled jihadist caliphate in Iraq and Syria, the behavior of NATO member Turkey is increasingly problematic. It isn’t volunteering any of its hundreds of thousands of soldiers, it doesn’t want the Americans using Turkish bases to launch airstrikes, and its efforts to close its border to ISIS oil smugglers have been half-hearted.

Now Turkey is openly welcoming members of the Muslim Brotherhood branded as terrorists by other governments vital to this awkward anti-ISIS coalition.

Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and the current Egyptian government are united in a drive to crush the Brotherhood throughout the Middle East, while Turkey and Qatar have defended the Brotherhood as a modernizing movement that should participate in evolving democratic systems.
Turkey’s offer to host the Muslim Brotherhood follows accusations, denied by Ankara, that the country has turned a blind eye to activities of Sunni extremist groups like ISIS in the hope that their fighters would push Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad from power. Instead, ISIS is becoming a regional threat and a growing problem for Turkey itself.

Qatar also has come under fire as an alleged supporter of ISIS jihadists, and, under mounting international pressure, the fabulously rich little emirate decided to expel seven Brotherhood officials, including the leader Mahmoud Hussein.

Brotherhood foreign relations officer Amr Darrag said in a statement on September 13, carried by Ikhwanweb, the Brotherhood’s official English language website, that Qatar had asked the group to leave and that the Brotherhood officials would comply with the request “in order to avoid causing any embarrassment for the State of Qatar.” Days later Darrag was reported to be in Turkey.

Then, earlier this week Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan visited Qatar. Afterward, he told Turkish reporters that Ankara was prepared to take the Brothers in. “If there is a request by them, it will be looked at,” Erdogan said. “If there is no obstacle, they would enjoy the ease that is shown to everyone else.”

Ankara has been a key supporter of the Brotherhood in recent years, arguing it is a legitimate organization that won a democratic election in Egypt before President Mohamed Morsi was unseated in a coup led by current President Abdel Fattah al Sisi. As a consequence, ties between Ankara and Cairo were thrown into crisis. Egypt expelled the Turkish ambassador last year, prompting Ankara to declare the Egyptian envoy in Turkey persona non grata.

Erdogan has refused to work with the new government in Cairo and in public speeches since Morsi's ouster Erdogan has used the four-fingered “Rabia” hand sign, a symbol of Brotherhood resistance against Egypt’s security forces. In return, Egypt has accused Erdogan of making “provocative” statements and meddling in its internal affairs.

Offering asylum to the Brotherhood leadership would take things one step further, and not everybody in the Turkish government is happy with it. Murat Yetkin, a respected Turkish columnist and editor of the Hurriyet Daily News, an English language newspaper read by many foreign diplomats in Ankara, quoted an unnamed high-ranking Turkish official saying that Turkey would rather not serve as the new base for the exiled Brotherhood. “We do not want to be in any business that will put us in difficulty,” the source told Yetkin. “A perception that Turkey is hosting the leadership of Ikhvan [Brotherhood] or any other foreign organization will put it in a difficult position.”


But Erdogan’s statements about a possible welcome for the organization in Turkey appeared to brush aside those concerns. A Turkish official told reporters in Istanbul on September 16 that there was no reason blocking the Brotherhood officials from traveling to Turkey.
“Egyptians can come here without a visa,” the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity during a background briefing. “Then they can apply for a residence permit.” The official insisted that Turkey’s approach was based on democratic principles. “We didn’t support the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, we supported democracy,” he said.
Turkey and the Muslim Brotherhood also share skepticism concerning the U.S.-led alliance against ISIS in Iraq. Ankara has said it will not take part in military action against the jihadists, even though Erdogan told reporters on his flight back from Qatar that the Turkish military was working on plans to set up buffer zones within Syria to give shelter to Syrians fleeing ISIS territory.
The Muslim Brotherhood is a major force within the non-jihadist Syrian opposition. But the organization said it would have nothing to do with the new alliance against ISIS. “The West’s sudden interest and announcement of an international coalition to eliminate ISIS … is evidence of Western hypocrisy,” Brotherhood spokesman Omar Abdul-Aziz Meshwah said in a statement carried by Ikhwanweb. “We will not start a fight with ISIS so long as it is fighting Assad,” he said. “Part of the battle with that organization is ideological, done through dialogue rather than weapons.”



http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...n-terrorists-from-the-muslim-brotherhood.html
 
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shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
ISIS will be dead very soon. Happy that this Fitna is soon over. InshaAllah
Has much less wealthy boko haram disappeared , has USA found the missing girls , Better answer after reading the thread and accompanying article . I could have said that very soon khamanei will be dead ,did I ,even though he is old and sick . Wishes donot matter ground realities do .
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
ISIS will be dead very soon. Happy that this Fitna is soon over. InshaAllah
Its a brotherly and sicere advice.. It is the prophecies coming true... These are the end times.. If u believe... So please know Islam before using such words. U R not foghting in any case but uttering such words will make you sinful unnecessarily. If U don't agree, keep quiet for your own sake. Khilafa will be established, Islam will rule the world. Whether somebody likes it or not. It is the promise of Allah and everything is going exactly in the direction Rasool Allah SAW revealed to us in Hadiths.

2477: Narrated Ibn Hawalah: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: It will turn out that you will be armed troops, one is Syria, one in the Yemen and one in Iraq. Ibn Hawalah said: Choose for me, Apostle of Allah, if I reach that time. He replied: Go to Syria, for it is Allah's chosen land, to which his best servants will be gathered, but if you are unwilling, go to your Yemen, and draw water from your tanks, for Allah has on my account taken special charge of Syria and its people.
 

khan27

Minister (2k+ posts)
Its a brotherly and sicere advice.. It is the prophecies coming true... These are the end times.. If u believe... So please know Islam before using such words. U R not foghting in any case but uttering such words will make you sinful unnecessarily. If U don't agree, keep quiet for your own sake. Khilafa will be established, Islam will rule the world. Whether somebody likes it or not. It is the promise of Allah and everything is going exactly in the direction Rasool Allah SAW revealed to us in Hadiths.

2477: Narrated Ibn Hawalah: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: It will turn out that you will be armed troops, one is Syria, one in the Yemen and one in Iraq. Ibn Hawalah said: Choose for me, Apostle of Allah, if I reach that time. He replied: Go to Syria, for it is Allah's chosen land, to which his best servants will be gathered, but if you are unwilling, go to your Yemen, and draw water from your tanks, for Allah has on my account taken special charge of Syria and its people.

kya jahil admi hai tum aur tumhara ISIS fitna hai tum log dajjal ki aulad ho Hazrat Mohammed(pbuh) ne ne ase fitna ka zikar 1600 saal phele bata diya tha tum log jahanami ***** ho tum logo ke khilaf jihad karna bhi sawab hai
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
kya jahil admi hai tum aur tumhara ISIS fitna hai tum log dajjal ki aulad ho Hazrat Mohammed(pbuh) ne ne ase fitna ka zikar 1600 saal phele bata diya tha tum log jahanami ***** ho tum logo ke khilaf jihad karna bhi sawab hai
Tunhare iss tarah ki baatein kerne se jab kuch hona nhi hey tu kion gunah apne ser le rhe ho... yehi samjha rha hon k bilawajah aisi batein ker k gunahgaar mat ho. IS ager khatm hoi tu phir jashn mana lena, abhi yeh batein ker k kia mile ga
 

khan27

Minister (2k+ posts)
Tunhare iss tarah ki baatein kerne se jab kuch hona nhi hey tu kion gunah apne ser le rhe ho... yehi samjha rha hon k bilawajah aisi batein ker k gunahgaar mat ho. IS ager khatm hoi tu phir jashn mana lena, abhi yeh batein ker k kia mile ga

mein tu jahani kutto ko support tu nahi kar raha its you not me u r one of them gunah tu tumhe hi mil raha hai abhi b time hai in se door raho
 

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
OK Guys let me try to explain things in a different way both without and then with the hadith .

Without the hadith in question , ISIL fighters were young and less numerous , in such situation there is always a danger of excesses, as they are no regular army under no signed treaties . It is an established ancient war practise and a very painful one that when a smaller army confronts a larger force and defeats it , especially away from strongholds in middle of nowhere ,they do not take prisoners , they very often kill the prisoners as they are afraid that prisoners who had initial advantage and local support will fight again as soon he is freed , some armies tried to take money instead . Napoleon Bonaparte was himself confronted with such situation and executed a massacre in Egypt , it was the duty of Baghdad government, Iran and other supporters of anti ISIL forces to have told their
soldiers that this is what happens in wars , The execution of journalists is a sad saga , who did it ,had British accent .


Now lets explain the things with help of hadith , first we need full reference and all variants of the hadith , second we should concentrate on word of hadith , if it says that the person is seeking what should be the advise if in his lifetime there are three armies to choose from in this is what it says , but let's have full text and previous explanations from others over centuries by scholars first .

My impression of some hadith of this type is about events which will occur only once in universe history not in every generation but correct me on that too.
 
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Batman1

Councller (250+ posts)
Has much less wealthy boko haram disappeared , has USA found the missing girls , Better answer after reading the thread and accompanying article . I could have said that very soon khamanei will be dead ,did I ,even though he is old and sick . Wishes donot matter ground realities do .

ISIS is stooopid organization which has nothing to do with Islam. They entice boys as well as girls to do jihaad. What kind of jihad are girls supposed to wage against the enemies of Islam? would appreciate if any ISIS lovers like to respond.... :)
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
OK Guys let me try to explain things in a different way both without and then with the hadith .

Without the hadith in question , ISIL fighters were young and less numerous , in such situation there is always a danger of excesses, as they are no regular army under no signed treaties . It is an established ancient war practise and a very painful one that when a smaller army confronts a larger force and defeats it , especially away from strongholds in middle of nowhere ,they do not take prisoners , they very often kill the prisoners as they are afraid that prisoners who had initial advantage and local support will fight again as soon he is freed , some armies tried to take money instead . Napoleon Bonaparte was himself confronted with such situation and executed a massacre in Egypt , it was the duty of Baghdad government, Iran and other supporters of anti ISIL forces to have told their
soldiers that this is what happens in wars , The execution of journalists is a sad saga , who did it ,had British accent .


Now lets explain the things with help of hadith , first we need full reference and all variants of the hadith , second we should concentrate on word of hadith , if it says that the person is seeking what should be the advise if in his lifetime there are three armies to choose from in this is what it says , but let's have full text and previous explanations from others over centuries by scholars first .

My impression of some hadith of this type is about events which will occur only once in universe history not in every generation but correct me on that too.

Mr. Shaikh, we are not seculars who can keep aside what Allah SWT and His messenger Mohammad SAW said. We start with it keeping the worldly matters aside. The killing of the iraqi army and the militias was exactly what Allah SWT ordered, His messenger Mohammad SAW practiced, and Sahaba RZA followed. Pls read Sora Mohammad, Sora Ma'ida for reference and get the details of battles Rasool Allah SAW participated in. Read about the execution of Abu Jahl. There is wisdom in what Allah SWT ordered we may or may not understand but it is not acceptable for a Muslim to pick and choose actions on the basis of what he deems fit according to the situations.

Regarding hadith, it is such a popular Hadith that if you'd even googled the keywords you would've got the reference and the details. And I will urge you to do the same. cause if you do not seek the knowledge, the details I provide you will not change your way of thinking. The Hadith is from Jihad (Kitab Al-Jihad)' of Sunan Abu-Dawud, #2477, and it is about the end of the times, the times we are living in, the times where advent of Dajjal is very near.
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
ISIS is stooopid organization which has nothing to do with Islam. They entice boys as well as girls to do jihaad. What kind of jihad are girls supposed to wage against the enemies of Islam? would appreciate if any ISIS lovers like to respond.... :)
They are so stupid that the coalition of 40 countries are unwilling to put down their their troops on ground. They are so stupid that the superpowers are begging each other for money to go to war whereas IS stands alone and self sufficent.. and these are the details provided by one of the Muhajira's for your satisfaction.
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Batman1

Councller (250+ posts)
They are so stupid that the coalition of 40 countries are unwilling to put down their their troops on ground. They are so stupid that the superpowers are begging each other for money to go to war whereas IS stands alone and self sufficent.. and these are the details provided by one of the Muhajira's for your satisfaction.
Bxu-ohRIAAANuCt.jpg:large



Bxu-rN4IcAAjqCi.jpg:large


Bxu-tXZIQAAcBwy.jpg:large

Bxu-vpsIEAA4bfB.jpg:large

Ohhh...puhleeeez, if airpower can do the job then why would any country bother to put their troops on the ground????? Wars are fought with strategies not emotions. I really hope you don't think 40 countries are peeingg their pants and scared of IS even before the war has started.
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
Ohhh...puhleeeez, if airpower can do the job then why would any country bother to put their troops on the ground????? Wars are fought with strategies not emotions. I really hope you don't think 40 countries are peeingg their pants and scared of IS even before the war has started.
Get a life.. read what their generals are saying about whether air strikes will be successful, and for a moment start believing in Allah.. it will help
 

Batman1

Councller (250+ posts)
Get a life.. read what their generals are saying about whether air strikes will be successful, and for a moment start believing in Allah.. it will help

?????????? I believe in Allah SWT. Alhamdullilah, so I don't know what you mean by that but what are their generals saying? Do you believe everything that is shown on the TV or take what is in your favor? Just curious... :)
 

Rooh-e-Safar

Senator (1k+ posts)
?????????? I believe in Allah SWT. Alhamdullilah, so I don't know what you mean by that but what are their generals saying? Do you believe everything that is shown on the TV or take what is in your favor? Just curious... :)
Read what bill clinton said on-air, that US can not win a war on land. Read what Obama advisors suggested him that we can not win this war. They couldn't win in Afghanistan, IS is much more advanced. And if you believe in Allah you wouldn't be bothered about the result, you would be bothered about what you had done to assist the Khilafah
 

shaikh

Minister (2k+ posts)
Rooh-e-Safunderstand said:
Mr. Shaikh, we are not seculars who can keep aside what Allah SWT and His messengkmowledgad SAW said. We start with it keeping the worldly matters aside. The killing of the iraqi army and the militias was exactly what Allah SWT ordered, His messenger Mohammad SAW practiced, and Sahaba RZA followed. Pls read Sora Mohammad, Sora Ma'ida for reference and get the details of battles Rasool Allah SAW participated in. Read about the execution of Abu Jahl. There is wisdom in what Allah SWT ordered we may or may not understand but it is not acceptable for a Muslim to pick and choose actions on the basis of what he deems fit according to the situations.

Regarding hadith, it is such a popular Hadith that if you'd even googled the keywords you would've got the reference and the details. And I will urge you to do the same. cause if you do not seek the knowledge, the details I provide you will not change your way of thinking. The Hadith is from Jihad (Kitab Al-Jihad)' of Sunan Abu-Dawud, #2477, and it is about the end of the times, the times we are living in, the times where advent of Dajjal is very near.


may I ask you as a person with spirit and knowledge of Islam , as to why this hadith cannot be pertaining to any expected event during life time of asker of hadith himself ,is he not asking about himself and his choices ,and if we know more about him ,did he in his life time go to Syria and whom did he fight for . This end of time business is very old , of course 50000years is like wink of an eye and this world can end for us the humans with a good sized meteorite or nukes ,there are indeed many ever present possibilities but your post tries to prove that you believe In doomsday scenario which is unnecessary to consider except for the last generation of humans, we as Muslims have the task ahead to give our time and wealth in the way of God by zakat and salah till our personal doomsday arrives .

frankly I do not understand the tone of your post , it is true that Assad and Irani Mullah are trouble incarnate but we have a duty to understand each hadith in its probable context and not apply them randomly .
 
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Pakistani1947

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Mr. Shaikh, we are not seculars who can keep aside what Allah SWT and His messenger Mohammad SAW said. We start with it keeping the worldly matters aside. The killing of the iraqi army and the militias was exactly what Allah SWT ordered, His messenger Mohammad SAW practiced, and Sahaba RZA followed. Pls read Sora Mohammad, Sora Ma'ida for reference and get the details of battles Rasool Allah SAW participated in. Read about the execution of Abu Jahl. There is wisdom in what Allah SWT ordered we may or may not understand but it is not acceptable for a Muslim to pick and choose actions on the basis of what he deems fit according to the situations.

Regarding hadith, it is such a popular Hadith that if you'd even googled the keywords you would've got the reference and the details. And I will urge you to do the same. cause if you do not seek the knowledge, the details I provide you will not change your way of thinking. The Hadith is from Jihad (Kitab Al-Jihad)' of Sunan Abu-Dawud, #2477, and it is about the end of the times, the times we are living in, the times where advent of Dajjal is very near.

Regardless of being in agreement or disagreement with you. I like your style! Your oponents are being abusive to you and yet you are politely responding them.
 

Batman1

Councller (250+ posts)
Read what bill clinton said on-air, that US can not win a war on land. Read what Obama advisors suggested him that we can not win this war. They couldn't win in Afghanistan, IS is much more advanced. And if you believe in Allah you wouldn't be bothered about the result, you would be bothered about what you had done to assist the Khilafah

Last time I checked, Bill Clinton was not a general. :) Answers my question that you guys are no different. You seem to pick out what goes in your favor.