Programmer
Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Re: **Live Video Streaming + Official Update Thread** - PTI's March 23rd 2013 Minar-e-Pakistan Jalsa
jahil sahi baat ko to appericiate kr do...
Imran Khan's Speech @ PTI's 23rd March Minar-e-Pakistan Jalsaa - **Official Update Thread*
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Programmer
Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Some one should get GEO 12:00 bulletin on the Jalsa some amazing footage and reaction from crowd.
Especially the ppl they interviewed during the rain.
Really its a free advertisement. The weather change actually seemed to have charged up people alot towards the end.
Another thing to note is that anchors who were in the jalsa had compeltelely different opinion then the ones that had not gone.
The ones who went insist it was bigger then 30 oct and the crowd was charged and was overall a sucess the one who did not beg to differ.
The media coverage was very fragmented through out the day so cant blame them. But do watch the 12:00 bulletin which were sent from the people who covered the jalsa the whole day. They are virtual political ads. The atmosphere even affected the journos neutrality.
Overall a great launch to the election campaign. The venue and timing is right. Now PTI just has to organize and get its message and keep the momentum till elections.
I dont think PPP Noora Jamhoras , MQM etc can match this quickly enough.
TUQ challenge has fizzled out. PTI has a good start Mashallah.
http://thespokesman.pk/index.php/component/k2/item/2739-pti-wins-first-of-15-rounds
Here is an article from one of Pakistan most credible journalist Amir Mateen. Which sums up the sitaution:
PTI wins first of 15 rounds
Especially the ppl they interviewed during the rain.
Really its a free advertisement. The weather change actually seemed to have charged up people alot towards the end.
Another thing to note is that anchors who were in the jalsa had compeltelely different opinion then the ones that had not gone.
The ones who went insist it was bigger then 30 oct and the crowd was charged and was overall a sucess the one who did not beg to differ.
The media coverage was very fragmented through out the day so cant blame them. But do watch the 12:00 bulletin which were sent from the people who covered the jalsa the whole day. They are virtual political ads. The atmosphere even affected the journos neutrality.
Overall a great launch to the election campaign. The venue and timing is right. Now PTI just has to organize and get its message and keep the momentum till elections.
I dont think PPP Noora Jamhoras , MQM etc can match this quickly enough.
TUQ challenge has fizzled out. PTI has a good start Mashallah.
http://thespokesman.pk/index.php/component/k2/item/2739-pti-wins-first-of-15-rounds
Here is an article from one of Pakistan most credible journalist Amir Mateen. Which sums up the sitaution:
PTI wins first of 15 rounds
Politically Incorrect
Amir MateenImran Khans rally in Lahore has kicked-off the election campaign in a highly spirited way that will be difficult for his rivals to match - not just in numbers but also in vigour.Even Hollywood would not have been able to create the ambience a multitude of charged crowd crying hoarse with constant sloganeering, the thunder, lightning and drizzle. Men, women, the young and the old dancing on the music beat of popular songs.
Imran Khan had such a spell that everybody stayed despite rain.Good that Khan did not bore the frenzied crowd with policy matters that are the stuff for academics. Most of what he said was rhetoric about not lying, finishing off injustice and all those customary election slogans. But he was heard with rapt attention.This is perhaps that advantage that Imran Khan has over his rivals. He is untested so people can believe him. Asfi Zardari and Nawaz Sharif have a huge baggage to defend from earlier government if they make similar promises.
No matter how rulers think about their days in government, people always have a different memory something that Musharraf may also find out today.That Imran Khan has charisma may be the biggest understatement. And he has learnt the art of oratory. Political workers may come to attend the rallies of Asif Zardari and Nawaz Sharif but they do not come to just see them or listen to what they see. It always seems as the same old speech that they have heard Asif and Nawaz made hundred times.
Nawaz Sharif and Asif Zardari may roughly be of the same age as Imran Khan but somehow do not come across as the youthful oldie Khan does. Call it beauty, his hair or charms, the way he sways crowd, particularly women and the youth nobody among the existing lot of Pakistani politicians can do that. Altaf Bhai would like to think himself a bigger star but nobody outside the remote-controlled MQM hierarchy would agree.
However, the biggest question remains how much of this will translate into electoral vote. You can give Imran Khan the credit for putting across the basic equation of the election before the public right at the start: Will the traditional electables representing biradris, feudal and pressure groups win or the PTI will be able to sway the elections towards its mantra of change. Of course, the PTI also tried the electables model, in the process of winning over the likes of Shah Mahmood Qureshi and Javed Hashmi.
But its now reverting back to popular politics - partially because it could not gather enough heavy weights. In the given situation, PTIs best shot is if it could nudge the electoral discourse also towards its popular mode of rhetorical politics. That being the case, the beginning may not have been bad.The electoral situation in other provinces, as we see it, is less hazy. Multiple political parties jostle for power in their respective power pockets as it is happening in Balochistan electoral situation.
With MQM dominating Karachi and partially Hyderabad, the Sindh rural contest is largely about how many seat will the PPP lose to the odd mixture of nationalists, PML-N led by PML-F. The Khyber Pashtunkhwa is a total mess as five parties strive for local alliances with PTI upsetting the traditional equation. The Saraiki belt too is largely a contest between PPP and PML -N.
However, the buck stops in Punjab, especially in the central belt between Attock and Khanewal that encompasses 107 electoral seats. While the PML-Q stalwarts jump the ship, the PPP seems to have given up in Punjab. The PTI may give the PML-N run for their money in cities but as things stand today, the PML-N dominates the rural Punjab heartland. The PTI will need to do something real creative to empower its mostly diminutive candidates here. This amounts to bringing about a revolution that might threaten the very political and social structure as it did in the 1970s.
This is easier said than done. But its also not the same old Nawaz League-PPP way the electoral cookie will crumble this time. But the PTIs rally has proved one thing: its a long see-saw of electoral politics from now on.The mammoth PTI rally may have already had some impact. It will have some edge in having local alliance that particularly matters in the KP. Those who have already crossed over to other parties may become doubtful about their decisions again. The indecisive fence-sitters, for instance the Legharis, may rethink again. More important, it will reinvigorate the PTI cadres.Even if one takes the PTI claim about having seven million members with a pinch of salt, the figure of 80,000 office-bearers is impressive. This amounts to a massive machinery that should matter in the election.But this seems a long haul of at least 15-round contest for sure. I give the first round to PTI.
Amir MateenImran Khans rally in Lahore has kicked-off the election campaign in a highly spirited way that will be difficult for his rivals to match - not just in numbers but also in vigour.Even Hollywood would not have been able to create the ambience a multitude of charged crowd crying hoarse with constant sloganeering, the thunder, lightning and drizzle. Men, women, the young and the old dancing on the music beat of popular songs.
Imran Khan had such a spell that everybody stayed despite rain.Good that Khan did not bore the frenzied crowd with policy matters that are the stuff for academics. Most of what he said was rhetoric about not lying, finishing off injustice and all those customary election slogans. But he was heard with rapt attention.This is perhaps that advantage that Imran Khan has over his rivals. He is untested so people can believe him. Asfi Zardari and Nawaz Sharif have a huge baggage to defend from earlier government if they make similar promises.
No matter how rulers think about their days in government, people always have a different memory something that Musharraf may also find out today.That Imran Khan has charisma may be the biggest understatement. And he has learnt the art of oratory. Political workers may come to attend the rallies of Asif Zardari and Nawaz Sharif but they do not come to just see them or listen to what they see. It always seems as the same old speech that they have heard Asif and Nawaz made hundred times.
Nawaz Sharif and Asif Zardari may roughly be of the same age as Imran Khan but somehow do not come across as the youthful oldie Khan does. Call it beauty, his hair or charms, the way he sways crowd, particularly women and the youth nobody among the existing lot of Pakistani politicians can do that. Altaf Bhai would like to think himself a bigger star but nobody outside the remote-controlled MQM hierarchy would agree.
However, the biggest question remains how much of this will translate into electoral vote. You can give Imran Khan the credit for putting across the basic equation of the election before the public right at the start: Will the traditional electables representing biradris, feudal and pressure groups win or the PTI will be able to sway the elections towards its mantra of change. Of course, the PTI also tried the electables model, in the process of winning over the likes of Shah Mahmood Qureshi and Javed Hashmi.
But its now reverting back to popular politics - partially because it could not gather enough heavy weights. In the given situation, PTIs best shot is if it could nudge the electoral discourse also towards its popular mode of rhetorical politics. That being the case, the beginning may not have been bad.The electoral situation in other provinces, as we see it, is less hazy. Multiple political parties jostle for power in their respective power pockets as it is happening in Balochistan electoral situation.
With MQM dominating Karachi and partially Hyderabad, the Sindh rural contest is largely about how many seat will the PPP lose to the odd mixture of nationalists, PML-N led by PML-F. The Khyber Pashtunkhwa is a total mess as five parties strive for local alliances with PTI upsetting the traditional equation. The Saraiki belt too is largely a contest between PPP and PML -N.
However, the buck stops in Punjab, especially in the central belt between Attock and Khanewal that encompasses 107 electoral seats. While the PML-Q stalwarts jump the ship, the PPP seems to have given up in Punjab. The PTI may give the PML-N run for their money in cities but as things stand today, the PML-N dominates the rural Punjab heartland. The PTI will need to do something real creative to empower its mostly diminutive candidates here. This amounts to bringing about a revolution that might threaten the very political and social structure as it did in the 1970s.
This is easier said than done. But its also not the same old Nawaz League-PPP way the electoral cookie will crumble this time. But the PTIs rally has proved one thing: its a long see-saw of electoral politics from now on.The mammoth PTI rally may have already had some impact. It will have some edge in having local alliance that particularly matters in the KP. Those who have already crossed over to other parties may become doubtful about their decisions again. The indecisive fence-sitters, for instance the Legharis, may rethink again. More important, it will reinvigorate the PTI cadres.Even if one takes the PTI claim about having seven million members with a pinch of salt, the figure of 80,000 office-bearers is impressive. This amounts to a massive machinery that should matter in the election.But this seems a long haul of at least 15-round contest for sure. I give the first round to PTI.
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Programmer
Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Re: Ppp , pmln, pti
i m a karachiti and 19 year old... agar noora keh k khushi milti h to kh len... but Ye socho k aaj tak PMLN ne 4.5 saal hi hakoomat ki h central govt. me... wo bhi 2 baar adhi adhi,,, phir bhi mototway ban gai, nuclear blast hogya, mass transit ban gya, Asia ka sab se bara bridge ban gya aur bhi bht projects hn..... to me khta hn k nawaz aur imran me se koi bhi best nai h... but dono behtar h.. to apas me larne k bajae PPP, MQM se laren aur mulk bachaaen
aamir_uetn
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Yeh tamboo nahi hai , it is huge huge huuuuuuuuggggeee PTI Flag :)
chaye-wala
MPA (400+ posts)
Re: For TUQ Followers : IK VS TUQ
Yes, following Prophet Muhammad by telling me you'll strip me naked.
jab phat gayee tou islam beech mein ley aaye! L@nat tumhari shakal pe!
Yes, following Prophet Muhammad by telling me you'll strip me naked.
jab phat gayee tou islam beech mein ley aaye! L@nat tumhari shakal pe!
aamir_uetn
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Mehrushka
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Yeh tamboo nahi hai , it is huge huge huuuuuuuuggggeee PTI Flag :)
nice pics..thx for sharing...so you did go (bigsmile)
Red crow
Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Congrats for this huge gathering. He is very brave leader, addressing with the floods of people without umbrella and bullet proof glass. No doubt it was very huge crowd, Ground was filled and unqiue thing about this Jalsa is that there were every type of peoples , from children to Old people. Of course very energetic youth. This is called real democracy in the party, 80,000 elected members also gathered there. Even party like PMLN, PPPP can't think to start intra-party election like this. This is called change !!
famamdani
Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: **Live Video Streaming + Official Update Thread** - PTI's March 23rd 2013 Minar-e-Pakistan Jalsa
BUT WE ARE HAPPY ANYWAY ...........................IN CIRCLE WITHOUT DIRECTION...................THATS NOT GREAT UR RIGHT AND WE ARE HAPPY ................ANYWAY ..............(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)
BUT WE ARE HAPPY ANYWAY ...........................IN CIRCLE WITHOUT DIRECTION...................THATS NOT GREAT UR RIGHT AND WE ARE HAPPY ................ANYWAY ..............(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)
aamir_uetn
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
jee i did ........ didnt u :13:
AhsanAltaf1
Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ppp , pmln, pti
thanks , hope you dont mind :)
we all are here for better Pakistan , we think IK can bring change and you think PMLn is better for Pakistan , our priorities are same but our way to acheive these priorities are different .
thanks , hope you dont mind :)
we all are here for better Pakistan , we think IK can bring change and you think PMLn is better for Pakistan , our priorities are same but our way to acheive these priorities are different .
Mehrushka
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
oho.... jab ap stage pe bethay kisi aur admi ko imran samajh ker naare mar rahe thay...peechay se maine hi awaz lagai thi ke...ye imran nahin hai...[hilar][hilar][hilar]
'damn i wana know what are you smoking man.....qadri jalsa bigger than Imran Khan one......but mr ghauri u r totally clueless of what u r saying....comparing apple with oranges wont work....i supported what qadri did to make EC stronger nd so is our Quaid ....we have no problm with qadri...we never had one ..nd once again what r u smoking?
aamir_uetn
Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
oooooooooo achaaaaaaaaa to wo aaaaap mujhe awaz de rahi thi ....... oooohh no ...... mujhe pata he nahi laga :( btw baaqi baaten on non siasi , mujhe bhi dhamki mili hai kal :(
chargootay
MPA (400+ posts)
Re: Ppp , pmln, pti
fikr na karo .. hum apne ghusa ke jawab vote se dengay insahALLAH ... we are that silent majority supporting pti :D
fikr na karo .. hum apne ghusa ke jawab vote se dengay insahALLAH ... we are that silent majority supporting pti :D
famamdani
Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: **Live Video Stream + Official Update Thread** - PTI's March 23rd 2013 Minar-e-Pakistan Jalsa
BUT ALLTHOUGHT WE ARE HAPPY ..........................BECUSE U THINK THIS ANYWAY WE R HAPPY ............(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)
BUT ALLTHOUGHT WE ARE HAPPY ..........................BECUSE U THINK THIS ANYWAY WE R HAPPY ............(bigsmile)(bigsmile)(bigsmile)
Re: **Live Video Streaming + Official Update Thread** - PTI's March 23rd 2013 Minar-e-Pakistan Jalsa
At some level I agree with you. The problem is that in Pakistan you can make all the good decisions and constitutional amendments but when it comes to implementation of any of those we have the worst track record. In my opinion the decision of not going ahead with the LB elections and depriving people that right was one of the biggest failures of the civilian political government. Some may know that I am one of the biggest critic of the military establishment (or as Sardar Mengal said, Army and ISI) on this forum but this is purely the failure of the politicians. We can blame military for its undue influence but the politicians are equally if not more responsible. Even a spineless PPP government could have used the sentiments against the military to strengthened the hold of the civilian government. But you and I know that its not what they did rather they were either too incompetent or corrupt to have anything to show for their 5 years. If the powers were given to the provinces then why did the MNAs receive development funds and it was discretion to spend those funds. Isn't it counter productive? You have to blame the politicians for their part. If we had better politicians then I am sure that military's wing could have been clipped - specially after the the rule of the last military dictator.
Sedqal, brother, you can't put all the blame of this on the military top brass. Traditional politicians in Pakistan are partly to be blamed. As for youth of Pakistan they are just a reflection of what we have all around us. Our education system, our media, our society are responsible for producing these youths and our military too (even though the top military brass gets brainwashed in the military academies still running on the lines of our past colonial masters). The thing is that we can't keep doing the same thing and expect different result. Honestly I don't think that even if PTI comes to power then a lot will change. I am just hoping for some sanity to prevail. Sometime I am even doubtful that we could achieve that since the way we have been able to screw up the way we think and the way we have divided ourselves. People who are expecting miracles from IK will be disappointed because if the party can't control a friggin stage then I am not too hopeful that it will be able to achieve the turnaround that its promising. I am just hoping for a mere reversal of the downturn.
As for Baluchistan I agree with most of what Sardar Mengal said. We can discuss it more if you like.
Wait, let me pull out my copy of Das Kapital ;)
I am not good at it. May be I am using the wrong term - status quo. You may prefer some other term to describe the spineless and imbecile political class that has been thriving and multiplying their wealth while the common man suffers. Look at these traditional politicians they have no ideology and jump from left to right to left to center to right to left or the ideological spectrum without any remorse. What do you call them? And tell me are they in any way responsible for where we are today?
Just look at your favorite neighborhood politician, Mian N Sharif. Minted in Gilani factory of sycophants and 'musta'aray' as the good sardar called them. They eventually amass enough wealth due to the patronage of their military masters that they become indispensable and are even able to buy a couple of current and ex generals. What we need is to move from this current state of affair(status quo?) which is producing the same results.
I know that you dont like PTI but come on you have to admit that other politicians are not much better. I think that PTI is capable of screwing up given the people and systems in our country but all of us are hoping that it will screw up a little less (there you go, I just comitted blasphemy ;))
At some level I agree with you. The problem is that in Pakistan you can make all the good decisions and constitutional amendments but when it comes to implementation of any of those we have the worst track record. In my opinion the decision of not going ahead with the LB elections and depriving people that right was one of the biggest failures of the civilian political government. Some may know that I am one of the biggest critic of the military establishment (or as Sardar Mengal said, Army and ISI) on this forum but this is purely the failure of the politicians. We can blame military for its undue influence but the politicians are equally if not more responsible. Even a spineless PPP government could have used the sentiments against the military to strengthened the hold of the civilian government. But you and I know that its not what they did rather they were either too incompetent or corrupt to have anything to show for their 5 years. If the powers were given to the provinces then why did the MNAs receive development funds and it was discretion to spend those funds. Isn't it counter productive? You have to blame the politicians for their part. If we had better politicians then I am sure that military's wing could have been clipped - specially after the the rule of the last military dictator.
Sedqal, brother, you can't put all the blame of this on the military top brass. Traditional politicians in Pakistan are partly to be blamed. As for youth of Pakistan they are just a reflection of what we have all around us. Our education system, our media, our society are responsible for producing these youths and our military too (even though the top military brass gets brainwashed in the military academies still running on the lines of our past colonial masters). The thing is that we can't keep doing the same thing and expect different result. Honestly I don't think that even if PTI comes to power then a lot will change. I am just hoping for some sanity to prevail. Sometime I am even doubtful that we could achieve that since the way we have been able to screw up the way we think and the way we have divided ourselves. People who are expecting miracles from IK will be disappointed because if the party can't control a friggin stage then I am not too hopeful that it will be able to achieve the turnaround that its promising. I am just hoping for a mere reversal of the downturn.
As for Baluchistan I agree with most of what Sardar Mengal said. We can discuss it more if you like.
Wait, let me pull out my copy of Das Kapital ;)
I am not good at it. May be I am using the wrong term - status quo. You may prefer some other term to describe the spineless and imbecile political class that has been thriving and multiplying their wealth while the common man suffers. Look at these traditional politicians they have no ideology and jump from left to right to left to center to right to left or the ideological spectrum without any remorse. What do you call them? And tell me are they in any way responsible for where we are today?
Just look at your favorite neighborhood politician, Mian N Sharif. Minted in Gilani factory of sycophants and 'musta'aray' as the good sardar called them. They eventually amass enough wealth due to the patronage of their military masters that they become indispensable and are even able to buy a couple of current and ex generals. What we need is to move from this current state of affair(status quo?) which is producing the same results.
I know that you dont like PTI but come on you have to admit that other politicians are not much better. I think that PTI is capable of screwing up given the people and systems in our country but all of us are hoping that it will screw up a little less (there you go, I just comitted blasphemy ;))
