Does Holy Quran's Text has Some Esoteric Connotations as Well?

[Bret Hawk]

Throughout the history of Islam there has been a tendency of many of its schools of thoughts especially among the Sufi mystics and erudite scholars as well from the rational schools of thought like Ikhwan al Safa (Brethren of the Purity) and the Shite factions as well to unearth or decipher the hidden esoteric meanings of Holy Quran especially and to some extent in the famous authenticated traditions of Holy Prophet SAW as well.

I would like to initiate this debate today among the serious members of this forum and would love to know the rational, if any, intuitive and logical reasoning of such claim and also to ascertain that what are the expert opinions of the scholars and Saints of Islam from all ages on this critical epistemological issue of Islamic theology?

 

[rolnrol]

All praise is due to Allah The Exalted, and may Allah raise the rank of our beloved Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him, his kind relatives and companions, and protect his nation from that which he feared for them Thereafter;Allah said in the Qur'an :

سورة آل عمران - سورة 3 - آية 7

هو الذي انزل عليك الكتاب منه ايات محكمات هن ام الكتاب واخر متشابهات فاما الذين في قلوبهم زيغ فيتبعون ما تشابه منه ابتغاء الفتنة وابتغاء تاويله وما يعلم تاويله الا الله والراسخون في العلم يقولون امنا به كل من عند ربنا وما يذكر الا اولوا الالباب

This Ayah Means:

<<Allah is the One Who has sent down to the Prophet the Book that contains muhkamat ayat, which are the foundation of the Book, and other ayat which are mutashabihat. Those who have perversity in their hearts, they follow the mutashabihat ayat seeking discord and searching for unbefitting meanings based on their delusions. No one knows their true meanings except Allah and those who are firmly rooted in the knowledge of the Religion. The latter say, "We believe in it, all of it is from our Lord and none will understand the message except men of comprehension>>.

So, know firmly, that the Qur'an contains two types of ayat Muhkamat ayat and Mutashabihat ayat.

Muhkamat ayat :

These are the ayat that have only one meaning according to the rules of the Arabic language or else the meaning of the ayah is clearly known.

Examples of this type of ayat are: the saying of Allah, ta^ala:

ليس كمثله شىء وهو السميع البصير

Suratash-Shura,ayah 11 means: [Absolutely there is nothing like Him] and

His saying, ta^ala:

ولم يكن له كفوا احد

Suratal-Ikhlas, ayah 4 means: [There is nothing which is equal to Him].

Mutashabihat ayat:

These are the ayat that can have many meanings according to the rules of the Arabic language. Assigning meanings to these ayat requires thorough thinking so that acceptable meanings are given to them. Examples of this type of ayat are: the saying of Allah, ta^ala, in Surat Taha, ayah 5:

الرحمن على العرش استوى

This Ayah means: [Allah subjugated the ^arsh in al-azal with a subjugation which is without a beginning, like all of the attributes of Allah.]

According to the rules of the Arabic language, this ayah is among the mutashabihat verses; so they can have many meanings. If meanings are assigned to them, this must be done in a manner that complies with the language and the Religion, and does not contradict the ayat that are muhkamat. Surely the ayat of the Qur'an do not contradict one another. Likewise, the ahadith (sayings of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam,) do not contradict one another, and they do not contradict the ayat of the Qur'an

 

[rolnrol]

End of the topic .

 

[Resonant]

No ..not end of the topic....Quran is a miracle. And its miracle is that it unfolds its meanings according to the level of understanding and enlightenment of the reader....An uthentic hadees says that Quran is descended upon seven hurf..and there are at least seven levels of understanding and perception...You refine yourself by purification of mind and heart and it will unfold more subtle meaning upon you.

 

[Mughal1]

I think divine revelation is of two kinds, one that comes from Allah in form of a book eg quran, tawraat, zaboor etc. This is manifest revelation but there is another revelation in form of inspiration in form of ideas that rise in minds of people either through reflection on nature all around or due to reflection on the manifest divine revelation. Some call it kashaf.

I do not think there is anything beyond that.

as for word ARSH, it simply means crown or thrown=sovereignty. The universe is kingdom of Allah and he alone is its ruler or king or sovereign. It is not any physical chair like that of a human king where he sits and wears crown on his head.


Have we understood the quran properly?

http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...-stand-and-why&p=490460&viewfull=1#post490460

 

[Wadaich]

All praise is due to Allah The Exalted, and may Allah raise the rank of our beloved Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him, his kind relatives and companions, and protect his nation from that which he feared for them Thereafter;Allah said in the Qur'an :

سورة آل عمران - سورة 3 - آية 7

هو الذي انزل عليك الكتاب منه ايات محكمات هن ام الكتاب واخر متشابهات فاما الذين في قلوبهم زيغ فيتبعون ما تشابه منه ابتغاء الفتنة وابتغاء تاويله وما يعلم تاويله الا الله والراسخون في العلم يقولون امنا به كل من عند ربنا وما يذكر الا اولوا الالباب

This Ayah Means:

<<Allah is the One Who has sent down to the Prophet the Book that contains muhkamat ayat, which are the foundation of the Book, and other ayat which are mutashabihat. Those who have perversity in their hearts, they follow the mutashabihat ayat seeking discord and searching for unbefitting meanings based on their delusions. No one knows their true meanings except Allah and those who are firmly rooted in the knowledge of the Religion. The latter say, "We believe in it, all of it is from our Lord and none will understand the message except men of comprehension>>.

So, know firmly, that the Qur'an contains two types of ayat Muhkamat ayat and Mutashabihat ayat.

Muhkamat ayat :

These are the ayat that have only one meaning according to the rules of the Arabic language or else the meaning of the ayah is clearly known.

Examples of this type of ayat are: the saying of Allah, ta^ala:

ليس كمثله شىء وهو السميع البصير

Suratash-Shura,ayah 11 means: [Absolutely there is nothing like Him] and

His saying, ta^ala:

ولم يكن له كفوا احد

Suratal-Ikhlas, ayah 4 means: [There is nothing which is equal to Him].

Mutashabihat ayat:

These are the ayat that can have many meanings according to the rules of the Arabic language. Assigning meanings to these ayat requires thorough thinking so that acceptable meanings are given to them. Examples of this type of ayat are: the saying of Allah, ta^ala, in Surat Taha, ayah 5:

الرحمن على العرش استوى

This Ayah means: [Allah subjugated the ^arsh in al-azal with a subjugation which is without a beginning, like all of the attributes of Allah.]

According to the rules of the Arabic language, this ayah is among the mutashabihat verses; so they can have many meanings. If meanings are assigned to them, this must be done in a manner that complies with the language and the Religion, and does not contradict the ayat that are muhkamat. Surely the ayat of the Qur'an do not contradict one another. Likewise, the ahadith (sayings of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam,) do not contradict one another, and they do not contradict the ayat of the Qur'an

Agreed at least 100%.

Majority is "Muhkamat" almost 90%. So for a common and fallible Muslim like me, to be a successful Muslim on the day of judgment, 100% Islam as code of life lies in these Ayat. I need not be curious about what lies in the "Mutashabihaat" about whom Allah (SWT) and his Love-- the Last and Final Prophet pbuh knows the best. So for people like me it is end of topic.

No ..not end of the topic....Quran is a miracle. And its miracle is that it unfolds its meanings according to the level of understanding and enlightenment of the reader....An uthentic hadees says that Quran is descended upon seven hurf..and there are at least seven levels of understanding and perception...You refine yourself by purification of mind and heart and it will unfold more subtle meaning upon you.

For the enlightened ones who are Ahle-Ishq and has special association and affiliation with the Last Prophet pbuh and through him to Allah (SWT) layers of the meanings are several depending upon their level of affiliation. And to reach that stage there are only a few upon whom Allah (SWT) unfolds layers upon layers of the meanings and lets them see through HIS(SWT) Noor. As a case in point there are three types of Tafaseer-e-Qura'an:

i. For a commoner like me. Tafaseer by Maulana Moudoodi (RA) and by Peer Karam Shah Sahib (RA).

ii. For Ulama. Tafseer by Mufti Muhammad Shafeeh Sahib (RA)

iii. For the enlightened ones (Aarif/Mystics). There is no complete Aarifana Tafseer. We can have it in chunks like in the poetry of Hazrat Allama Iqbal (RA) and others.

 

[babadeena]

To understand Quran this (3:7) is guiding principle. When Allah(SWT) has categorically
informed that:
a) none knows the Mushabat meanings, that is chapter closed;
b) People (whosoever they may be,) after reading what is in a) above, if run after
finding the meaning of Mushabat, then they have only one agenda "to cause
dissension (Fitna) among believers" So all those who ever tried this exercise, or
try/going to try are "culprits" through the lens of Quran or under the command of Allah(SWT).

c) Anyone who tried to make taweel (explanations) of such verses, can be his conjecture and
Guess only.

For me there is therefore no hidden or estoeric meaning of Quranic text, or to say it
little bit in plain way that there is no such text that only some particular people/Group, or
personality, or dynasty know. Allah(SWT) has not given this LICENSE to any one. Quran is for Linnas and open and understandable to everyone providing the guiding principle of (3:7) is kept in mind.

Rest Allah(SWT) knows the best.

 

[Mughal1]

[FONT=&quot]Here is how I interpret verse 3/7


He it is Who has sent to you the Book in which are verses that set universal goals for mankind that are firmly founded so they are the foundation upon which the book is based and the rest that are open to various meanings are to be interpreted on that basis. Those who harbour against mankind destructive ambitions and damaging desires in their minds use therefrom verses open to different interpretations out of their proper contexts to give basis to their own goals looking forward to causing disputes and wars between people, but none can make evident to people of knowledge their intended interpretation save Allah. Therefore those well founded in knowledge say, we attest to the consistency of the book that it is all from our Lord. Yet none will take heed save those who have Intelligence and use it to understand things properly.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This verse is clearly pointing out that there are two ruling systems that mankind live by. One is divine and other manmade. Those who have destructive ambitions and damaging desires amongst mankind their agenda is to derail humanity from divine rule of law because it does not allow anyone to be masters of anyone else ie it is against ignorance, poverty, oppression, injustice, cruelty etc on one hand and it is for freedom, progress and prosperity of mankind as a whole on the other. This does not suit the ruling elite and their agents the priestly classes who are set up by rulers and paid by them to work for them. Priests in this verse are particularly targeted because it is they who turn people away from proper concepts of Islam as deen=rule of law for mankind to live by towards make beliefs ie religion=mazhab based on dogmas and meaningless creed and rituals. They do this so that people become and remain ignorant and superstitious and under their control to manipulate and abuse at will. This is why here the Quran makes clear that verses in the Quran are of two sorts therefore one set of them should be interpreted according to the proper context provided by other verses that are based on values of Islam. The ultimate goal of Islam is peace in the land between mankind as a whole. Peace between people depends on land and resources and interaction between people regarding that. This has been made clear in Surahs= chapters one and two already. There is no way one could get mixed up between peace and war. However by side lining Islamic message rulers and their priests create a recipe for wars because they want to control land and resource which are livelihood of all people equally.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]With consent of all people, it is ok to utilize land and resources for benefit of whole mankind. People are free to have any system that works for the good of mankind but they cannot have any system that benefits some while it causes harm to any human being. This is double standard and it is condemned in the Quran repeatedly. It is people who intend harm for others that are condemned as aggressors, rebellious, lawless, law breakers, enemies of humanity, war mongers, rejecters or opposers of Allah etc. [/FONT]

 

[Mughal1]

To me the quran is divine constitution for mankind to set up themselves accordingly and live by. The constitution is all about goals, guidelines, rules and regulations, rights and responsibilities for all involved in the organisation as administrators or members.

It is for this reason to me it seems more reasonable that the quran should be interpreted along these lines rather than in any other context that may not even make much sense.

 

[babadeena]

Mughal1,
Brother, please let us remain on topic. We should not be driven away by our
concept or ideology and perforce attach this to each and every verse. Neither Brother
Bret Hawk asked if Quran is Constitution or not. He is very selective and particular
about his words and choice. His question is very clear. Please do enlighten us with
reference to his question, to the point and in brief way:
[h=2]Does Holy Quran's Text has Some Esoteric Connotations as Well?[/h] That is the question. Quran is a book for all mankind (linnas), if it was to contain some
hidden meanings or monopolist quality then it should have been stated. It has been categorized
by Allah(SWT) himself into different form by stating different type of things into it.
Thanks.

 

[babadeena]

Any one wish to shed light on "Mutsabhe" and paste few verses which he/she thinks
are "Mutsahbe". thanks.

 

[Mughal1]

Any one wish to shed light on "Mutsabhe" and paste few verses which he/she thinks
are "Mutsahbe". thanks.

Brother baabadeena, I do not think word verse in this verse means verses of the quran but precepts, goals and guidelines where upon we should base our interpretation of the quran. In other words maths has rules for solving mathematical problems so people who learn rules then use numbers accordingly do fine but childish people just fool about with numbers.

Or language has rules and people who use words according to those rules make sense whereas just using words is not that useful.

So the quran is likewise telling us that we must look at verses of the quran as per rules of wisdom otherwise they will make no sense. So working out rules from the quran and using rules to understand the quran would be found much helpful rather than reading the quran randomly and making no sense of anything.

regards and all the best.

 

[babadeena]

Brother baabadeena, I do not think word verse in this verse means verses of the quran but precepts, goals and guidelines

هو الذي انزل عليك الكتاب منه ايات محكمات هن ام الكتاب واخر متشابهات
For God Shake, Brother Mughal1?
People like Moudadi, GA Pervaiz and all other claimed scholars should and must have
identified from Quran all those verses which are "allegorical, smililar, alike (Motashabay)", they
did not and failed bitterly. Anyone's bet please!!!

 

[Mughal1]

I personally do not believe that there is anything in the quran which is not told for understanding of people in one sense or another. The problem is not with motashaabihaat but with people who are supposed to make sense of them.

Motashaabihaat do not mean that they cannot be understood but that they need a little bit more strain on the brain if you like. In overall sense of quranic text, it is a book for guidance of humanity as a community. It therefore gives framework for community to base itself on and then set goals and make rules and regulation accordingly for its individuals for their own benefits as individuals and for the benefit of the wider community. if one therefore applied community verses to individuals or vice versa things will get confused.

People have been interpreting this verse in various ways but any interpretation that tells us motashabihaat means verses beyond human understanding then disagreement is bound to happen because why would Allah tell us something that we cannot understand at all or will not be able to undrstand?

 

[patriot]

(The Book He has sent down, bears an important Principle.) He is the One Who has
revealed to you (O Prophet) the scripture. In it some verses are literal, while some
verses are allegorical. The verses that pertain to Permanent Values have been
presented literally. These verses, Muhkamat, are the essence of the Divine law.
But abstract phenomena, some historical events, and the World of the Unseen
are described in similes, metaphors and allegories (Mutashaabihaat) for your
understanding. But those who are given to crookedness in their hearts pursue
the allegories and try to give them literal meanings, thus creating dissension of
thought. None encompasses their final meaning (of such as the Essence of God,
His Throne, His Hand, His Book of Decrees, the exact mode of revelation on the
heart of the Messengers, the Eternity) but God. Those who are well founded in
knowledge understand why the allegories have been used and they keep learning
from them. They proclaim the belief that the entire Book is from their Lord. As
the human knowledge evolves, more and more allegories will unfold their literal
meaning. But only the men and women of understanding will bear this fact
in mind. [Every verse of the Quran is Muhkam, absolute truth. The context
enables us to understand which ones are to be taken literally and which ones are
to be taken allegorically. Each verse in the Book complements another. 11:1,
39:23, 41:53, 47:20, 74:31]

 

[ranaji]

I strongly oppose these kinds of debates which interfere some one aqeeda as a muslim.. Here some time we people( including my self) loose our temper n forget to use proper language and decency and abuse opponents political leaders and parties as well. So we should respect each others faith, aqeeda and thoughts so please let it be only a political forum . Please vote against me or in my favor .waiting for your response.

 

[babadeena]

(The Book He has sent down, bears an important Principle.) He is the One Who has
revealed to you (O Prophet) the scripture. In it some verses are literal, while some
verses are allegorical. The verses that pertain to Permanent Values have been
presented literally. These verses, Muhkamat, are the essence of the Divine law.
But abstract phenomena, some historical events, and the World of the Unseen
are described in similes, metaphors and allegories (Mutashaabihaat) for your
understanding. But those who are given to crookedness in their hearts pursue
the allegories and try to give them literal meanings, thus creating dissension of
thought. None encompasses their final meaning (of such as the Essence of God,
His Throne, His Hand, His Book of Decrees, the exact mode of revelation on the
heart of the Messengers, the Eternity) but God. Those who are well founded in
knowledge understand why the allegories have been used and they keep learning
from them. They proclaim the belief that the entire Book is from their Lord. As
the human knowledge evolves, more and more allegories will unfold their literal
meaning. But only the men and women of understanding will bear this fact
in mind. [Every verse of the Quran is Muhkam, absolute truth. The context
enables us to understand which ones are to be taken literally and which ones are
to be taken allegorically. Each verse in the Book complements another. 11:1,
39:23, 41:53, 47:20, 74:31]

This can be someone's own ideas or theory but definitely it is not
Quranic translation. If someone claims that it is quranic verse translation,
then my duty is to point out that it is "total distortion" and the text is
no where nearer to the arabic text.

 

[patriot]

Dear brother [MENTION=7169]babadeena[/MENTION] slaamun Alaykum,

The above post is not a literal translation but an explanation as it is understood in light of other
ayahs of the Qur'an.

Concerning MUTSHABIHAAT if they can be understood or not please read this ayah:

41:53 We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth. But is it not sufficient concerning your Lord that He is, over all things, a Witness?

 

[Bret Hawk]

I would like to thank to the respondents views and opinions on this thread and apologise as well for not being able to contribute on this subject matter in the last few days due to my ill health.

Anyhow lets get back to the topic of “Hidden” meanings of some of the Ayaats (I aill prefer to term Ayaats instead of verses) of Holy Quran. In my humble opinion there are two aspects of this issue which can be underpinned by using the texts of Quran apart from the bipolar division of Ayaats of Quran in to Muhkimaat (Establishing Principled dctrines) and Mtashabihaat (Allegorical).

Asit has been established in the classical period of Islam that the Ayaas of Quran were the created speech of Almighty and therefore these Ayaas have their meanings which will continue to serve their ultimate purpose of guidance for the Mankind till the doomsday. Having said that let us establish that what speech does consist of, of course primarily with words.

So the two broader aspects of the meaning of Quran’s text are;

1. Grammatical and morphological structure of such words in those particular Ayaas.
2. The impact of such words and the resultant structure of Ayaas on the psyche of its readers and audiences.

The hermeneutics of Holy Quran depend on its structural format of its words and propositions which has been established by the concerned scholars of the past and present with vigour and diligent devotion. Therefore one has to be well versed in those structural formats of those semantics before deriving any meaning from them.

The corpus of psychology which deals with the meaning and impact of words on the concerned psyche of individuals have thus far established that the impact of any particularly formed words can easily be varied as per the intelligence and maturity levels of those individuals. This sense of getting the varied meanings is what maybe the point which some schools of thought have alluded to when they arrived to this proposition that the revealed text of Quran do have some hidden meanings as well, which can only be extracted through the intense training on the subject matter of linguistics and their grammatical compositions as well as by the purification of souls and thoughts as well.

The man with a refined thought and sense of understanding can definitely derive different meanings of a sacred text like Quran’s as compare to those individual who posses a superficial knowledge of Quranic semantics along with less (or not at all) spiritual training and disciplining. Even the key terms like Tawheed / Strict monotheism have different meanings for its variety of readers which by the way does not fall in the category of Mutashabihat as it has been mentioned by the great mystics and scholars of Islam dating back to its classical to post modern period.