Rich Muslim vows to pay all French burka fines
- Thread starter Waseem
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Taul and Karachiwala, let me deal with you one at a time. Mr. Taul, your lengthy speach didn't answer anything about facts about Pakistan or Saudi as I highlighted. All the countries you named such as UAE, Qater and Oman ect. has westrenize themself that is why westrens have preveliges and even more preveliges them muslims themselves. Question was rasied about Saudi and Pakistan both muslim countries.... Saudi don't want to give any freedom to other faiths of muslim Ummah.Forget about Christians, let's remember Irani Shia's wanted to protest in Saudi...what happaned. Its just their sect think or nothing. Shia or Sunni(not wahabi) can't take any muslim literature to spread in Saudi.
You also failed to see the example of Pakistan in my response. No word for that. Don't you kill qadian's, sikh, shia's, sunni in their mosques, Imam Bargh, temple, churches... what happned to shia's in sarghoda yesterday. Did these people have freedom of expression and speach. hypocraites.
Now barqa or niqab...i know from my experience in US and Canada, most burkawalya, work in the malls wear pants and teeshirts and when come to the mosque they wear Niqab and Barqa to show of their islamic side. Their must be a reason to ban it. Here is the reason. Remember the Lal Masjid Islamabad where Ghazi's brother was busted wearing barqa with the ladies (a coward)... You cowards hide you identity in burqa and bomb shrines, mosques and Iraq is where you should that part.
Hijab is what is required in Islam not a Niqab or Burqa, so as a muslim I am all for hajib as a fundamentle right of Muslims doesn't matter where they live. Niqab and Burka is tridition and a security risk when people are using it to bomb killing innocent people. should be banned from all countires including Pakistan. In the above video you can see the uneducated molvis who has nothing better to do brainwashing other uneducated people about Islam.
Brother their is no comparision between Iran and Pakistan. Iran is the only True Islamic Country which doesn't accept the pressure from the west and puting is with our country Pakistan is the greatest insult of that great Muslim nation.
You have nothing to say to the facts stated about Saudi and Pakistani, How they take freedom away from their own muslim brothers so i will not argue with you. You can't see a heystack in your own eye but point out needle in the others.
I do admit the war in Iran and Afganistan by Westren countries is unjust and all american public, westren public and muslims alike think that the war is not justified. So according to rules of engagment against aggression in Islam, the iraqi army with 600,000 soilders should have faught this war. They did wear burqa's and vinish in the innocent public. what happen to the 600,000 soliders of Saddam( the great islamic worriers)...nowhere to be found. Is this the Islamic teaching to run away from the war. Isn't it true that 20 persent of Sunni ruled 70% of Shia's and 10 persent of Kurds with the help of west. You remember west supporting Iraq in Iran-Iraq war. That time west was your friend when you we killing Innocent shia's with chemical bombs puchased from the west... Now that your coward Iraqi army is wearing burqa like you malvi in Pakistan, for the safety of 95% of Iraqi nation who is free today because of the west, Everybody need to be checked to root out the devils who are so shameless that they bomb the procession of Imam Hussain in Karbala, bomb the shrines of shia Imams. Shame on those bombers. Brother wake up and smell the coffee. you have a DEVIL Scet amoung yourslef giving bad name to Islam all around the world.
You have also missed the whole point about Pakistan and Saudi as not giving any freedom to the muslim ummah(other sects) or other faiths(pakistan) and failed to see the spread of Islam with love and respect like Phophet Muhammad(PBUH)
Yes like is said before we are thankful to the west for our right to freedom of expression and speech by allowing us to spread the word of Allah, convert christians to islam, spread out literatue. Hundrens of christians men and women are converting everyday without us bombing or wearing naiqab. Read on this site the link about westren women converting. I will not argue with you any further as you can't see the light of the truth. If Allah has taken light from your eyes, we can't show you the right path.
As to Karachiwala, if you don't drink beer how to your know? By the way, Haider is spelled as Heather in the west same way Mohsin is spelled Molson. Judge not so not be Judged so who ever shall judge, will be judge the same way. I have nothing further to say to you.
You also failed to see the example of Pakistan in my response. No word for that. Don't you kill qadian's, sikh, shia's, sunni in their mosques, Imam Bargh, temple, churches... what happned to shia's in sarghoda yesterday. Did these people have freedom of expression and speach. hypocraites.
Now barqa or niqab...i know from my experience in US and Canada, most burkawalya, work in the malls wear pants and teeshirts and when come to the mosque they wear Niqab and Barqa to show of their islamic side. Their must be a reason to ban it. Here is the reason. Remember the Lal Masjid Islamabad where Ghazi's brother was busted wearing barqa with the ladies (a coward)... You cowards hide you identity in burqa and bomb shrines, mosques and Iraq is where you should that part.
Hijab is what is required in Islam not a Niqab or Burqa, so as a muslim I am all for hajib as a fundamentle right of Muslims doesn't matter where they live. Niqab and Burka is tridition and a security risk when people are using it to bomb killing innocent people. should be banned from all countires including Pakistan. In the above video you can see the uneducated molvis who has nothing better to do brainwashing other uneducated people about Islam.
Brother their is no comparision between Iran and Pakistan. Iran is the only True Islamic Country which doesn't accept the pressure from the west and puting is with our country Pakistan is the greatest insult of that great Muslim nation.
You have nothing to say to the facts stated about Saudi and Pakistani, How they take freedom away from their own muslim brothers so i will not argue with you. You can't see a heystack in your own eye but point out needle in the others.
I do admit the war in Iran and Afganistan by Westren countries is unjust and all american public, westren public and muslims alike think that the war is not justified. So according to rules of engagment against aggression in Islam, the iraqi army with 600,000 soilders should have faught this war. They did wear burqa's and vinish in the innocent public. what happen to the 600,000 soliders of Saddam( the great islamic worriers)...nowhere to be found. Is this the Islamic teaching to run away from the war. Isn't it true that 20 persent of Sunni ruled 70% of Shia's and 10 persent of Kurds with the help of west. You remember west supporting Iraq in Iran-Iraq war. That time west was your friend when you we killing Innocent shia's with chemical bombs puchased from the west... Now that your coward Iraqi army is wearing burqa like you malvi in Pakistan, for the safety of 95% of Iraqi nation who is free today because of the west, Everybody need to be checked to root out the devils who are so shameless that they bomb the procession of Imam Hussain in Karbala, bomb the shrines of shia Imams. Shame on those bombers. Brother wake up and smell the coffee. you have a DEVIL Scet amoung yourslef giving bad name to Islam all around the world.
You have also missed the whole point about Pakistan and Saudi as not giving any freedom to the muslim ummah(other sects) or other faiths(pakistan) and failed to see the spread of Islam with love and respect like Phophet Muhammad(PBUH)
Yes like is said before we are thankful to the west for our right to freedom of expression and speech by allowing us to spread the word of Allah, convert christians to islam, spread out literatue. Hundrens of christians men and women are converting everyday without us bombing or wearing naiqab. Read on this site the link about westren women converting. I will not argue with you any further as you can't see the light of the truth. If Allah has taken light from your eyes, we can't show you the right path.
As to Karachiwala, if you don't drink beer how to your know? By the way, Haider is spelled as Heather in the west same way Mohsin is spelled Molson. Judge not so not be Judged so who ever shall judge, will be judge the same way. I have nothing further to say to you.
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taul
Siasat.pk - Blogger
--I truly believe the fairness i projected in my detailed response escaped your prejudiced or must i say clouded judgment with errors in drawing parallels while taking up the issue as highlighted by the title of the thread..The crux of the matter is if such an issue were raised by a strictly Christian country only then it would hold only merit and since france or for that matter any other european country isn't one and thrives on the so called "Freedom" needs to look at themselves while focusing on such issues with the rest of Muslim countries.
--You failed to even grasp very fair similarities projected while addressing all the different Muslim countries coz their citizens are being affected by this law.
--You need to focus more hardly on the issues of Holy Places "Vatican and Saudi Arabia" and look up at the issues that may be common or are different.....It isn't that hard to comprehend.
--Again if any Muslim women wishes to wear it>>this is her right to dress as she sees fit while practicing her faith and yet again this category falls under "Freedom of Expression and Religion".....Once you get this basic idea clear in your head you'd be much at ease like much of the westerners.
--As i mentioned earlier Niqab is worn by Muslim women from through out the Muslim world and by doing so ( bringing such absurd laws) they're basically snatching the rights of Muslim women belonging to all the countries i mentioned.
--Yet again the most ridiculous statement or shall i more accurately say a delusion that by no means has any real grounds.....Would you be kind enough to share the recent security threats/failed bomb attempts or plots by alleged persons that happened to be women or as in this case by a burka/Niqab wearing women and moreso in a country who is pushing so hard for such a law i.e france.
--Again this is your view but the bottom line in your response is they adhere to strict implementations of their perceived version of Islam so you're basically negating your own question put forth initially.
--You can NOT simply neglect/put in the back burner while taking the strict perception of their version of Islam when considering Iran coz it's extremely important and holds a high importance when the issue being bothering you is undertaken like Curbing the practices of Non-muslims.
--Qaidyanis have been declared "Non Muslims" and this has been agreed upon by all School of thoughts and if qadiyanis wish to pursue their Qadiyanism they need to do that while staying away from the Identity theft of Muslims>>>If this is met they're more than welcome to do so but plagiarizing isn't allowed to malign rest of the Muslims and this latest attack on their worship place highlights the point i made that a war zone or a country directly affected by it has repercussions that lead to such incidents coz during all these years of them being declared as Kafirs>>none of the attacks happened.
--You failed to acknowledge the terror unleashed in Iraq by the shite mehdi militia including similar bombings and executions and still going on simply resembling some jinny outta the bottle that had been capped for years and years>>>>like i earlier said lawlessness/ill motives breeds such violence or unless you think otherwise.
--Anywhere in the world including Iran majority rules and so have tried to firm their roots and grounds.....Does that mean they are not letting people of other faiths flourish/propagate their beliefs>>be it any particular sect..
--Lastly and most importantly try sorting things out the way they ought to be and not like mixing apples with oranges and not be baffled coz once the things/issues are seen with a clear head only then it lets one to analyze things/issues being discussed more critically as well as realistically and the perspective becomes more clear so the issue of this thread needs to be dealt while looking at and by taking all the relevant laws of the other Muslim countries whose citizens are unfortunately being suffocated by this prejudiced law especially in such a western country who boasts of being free and secular.
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Sorry my friend you are blinded. You are not talking about the issues raised but going around the circle because you know the truth. Its just you hatred towards west nothing else. If they don't like the law they are welcome to leave and go to their respective countries and get religiously persecuated. The once born their can wear a hijab required by Islam and if they want to be extreamist and want Burka, pay the fine as the majority has ruled on the issue.
As for your knowledge... I think u have never left your own city let alone seen other countries. Just for info. Vitacan is a small city enclaved within the city of Rome capital of Itlay like Kaba is enclaved within city of Mecca inside saudi arabi. But we are talking about all Saudi Arabia as a country so i don't know how to deal with your uneducated views and you knowledge. I think I should not waste my time and time in the west is valuable unlike other places. May Allah give you Guaidence. Even Phophet Muhammad was not able to convinced everyone to embrace peace over war and I am one of his servents.
As for your knowledge... I think u have never left your own city let alone seen other countries. Just for info. Vitacan is a small city enclaved within the city of Rome capital of Itlay like Kaba is enclaved within city of Mecca inside saudi arabi. But we are talking about all Saudi Arabia as a country so i don't know how to deal with your uneducated views and you knowledge. I think I should not waste my time and time in the west is valuable unlike other places. May Allah give you Guaidence. Even Phophet Muhammad was not able to convinced everyone to embrace peace over war and I am one of his servents.
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taul
Siasat.pk - Blogger
--I'm not surprised by your inability to compare the issue as it needs to be and resorting to an overwhelmingly unnecessary gestures and highly childish and an ill aimed exasperations that are in no way remotely close to or associated with the law being proposed by france in this post so to grasp the issue and comprehend it did beat your trivial level of IQ as you'd only time and time again resort to talk of all the irrelevant matters but the ONLY law being paraded against...your incapability along with any little information that you may have was quite displeasing regarding the whole matter since you could not even figure out the numbers being added and the result expected and in the process unveiled the disturbed impulses operating in your quite stuffed head.
--Finally you had the courage to see through your own created fog that was blurring your vision and were able to get thru to the vatican,that's good but the matter still dodged your mind as the conditions imposed on such places had to be considered not the area occupied by that place which again for your information is way bigger and way more with it's own proper governing system than what you so funnily projected restricting to just couple of square meters.
--I hope you have atleast enough sense of "Immigration laws" which do NOT apply here remotely so where does the issue of anyone leaving the country arise????Secondly there are lot of reverts who're westerners and have NOT immigrated from any Muslim country but lived for generations and generations and are natives of countries like france and else where>>you're suggesting they be forced to pay fines especially in the presence of the founding laws of their own countries based on "freedom of expression and religion">>now how funny this sounds>>>Again all is needed is some serious contemplation from people like you who may be are on cocktails ( as in drugs that disorientates your state of mind ) a li'l too much which isn't letting ya'll think through with some real attention.
--Yet again you failed to see and weigh the ludicrous impulses and all the ill intentions implicated by this law to stifle majority of Muslim women from different Muslim countries,so the hatred aspect is right there emanating straight from such an idiotic attempt>>just for an argument sake even if it were part of their culture>>>>you just like the prejudiced and twisted thinking westerners who rally for this preposterous law are simply too blind to see the so called "freedom of expression" they atleast try to stick out in,is being forcefully snatched from all these Muslim women for no apparent reason at all.........they're simply being forced out of their comfort zone against their free will which they do not want to.
--Unfolding/breaking free the prejudiced banner would enable you to may be just may be see and understand the gist of the crucial law being imposed on all the citizens from the Muslim countries unless you'd want them to target each and every individual but then that would tantamount to racial profiling isn't it!!!
--Always remember never ever try to leave out the context and moreso the real obvious motto's being suggested by any law being putforth and do try to refrain from all the illusions and hype being created and surrounding it that is ofcourse completely unrelated and purely irrelevant to it.
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Son , I obviously haven't tried ridin a bike without a seat but I am sure you are speaking from experience .....blindness of the fact is you farted before you ate , once again if you had read the related article carefully you would just may realize how pathetic you sounded but of course you had to stand your ground , the educated person you are . please try a better line bicycle rider. THOSE WHO CAN'T HELP THE SITUATION , THEY SHOULD EITHER SHUT UP OR DIE . (quoted from khurram.K's DIE HARD PAKISTANI)
You want your religious right in Frace but fail to give other their right in your land. Read Dawn today:
LAHORE: Two Christian brothers accused of writing a blasphemous pamphlet critical of the Prophet Mohammed were shot dead on Monday outside a court in eastern Pakistan, police and doctors said.
An unidentified youth shot dead pastor Rashid Emmanuel, 32, and his brother Sajjad, and left their police escort critically wounded, as they left a court hearing in Faisalabad city, police official Amanullah Khan told AFP.
“Both brothers were rushed to hospital where they were pronounced dead,” Khan said.
Doctor Rana Bashir, chief of main Allied Hospital in the city confirmed the deaths and said the wounded police officer was undergoing surgery.
The brothers were arrested on July 2, with their supporters claiming the charges against them were trumped up.
James Aftab, a senior church official in Faisalabad said the men had been “implicated in a fake case” while Atif Jamil Pagaan, a spokesman for Pakistan Minorities Democratic Foundation, also said the men had been set up.
“The charges levied on them are false as no evidence has been brought and no witness was present,” he said, adding that the pamphlets were handwritten and photocopied, and anonymously distributed with the brothers’ contact details.
Earlier this month, about 400 demonstrators burned tyres and held protests in the low-income Waris Pura neighbourhood of Faisalabad, a slum inhabited by nearly 100,000 Christians, demanding the death penalty for the accused.
Pakistan’s controversial blasphemy law carries the death penalty although no one has ever been sent to the gallows for the crime.
Human rights activists want the legislation repealed, saying it is exploited for personal enmity and encourages extremism.
Dawn
IS THIS THE FREEDOM OTHER PEOPLE HAVE IN YOUR LANDS AND YOU TALK ABOUT OTHERS... HAHHAAAAAA
LAHORE: Two Christian brothers accused of writing a blasphemous pamphlet critical of the Prophet Mohammed were shot dead on Monday outside a court in eastern Pakistan, police and doctors said.
An unidentified youth shot dead pastor Rashid Emmanuel, 32, and his brother Sajjad, and left their police escort critically wounded, as they left a court hearing in Faisalabad city, police official Amanullah Khan told AFP.
“Both brothers were rushed to hospital where they were pronounced dead,” Khan said.
Doctor Rana Bashir, chief of main Allied Hospital in the city confirmed the deaths and said the wounded police officer was undergoing surgery.
The brothers were arrested on July 2, with their supporters claiming the charges against them were trumped up.
James Aftab, a senior church official in Faisalabad said the men had been “implicated in a fake case” while Atif Jamil Pagaan, a spokesman for Pakistan Minorities Democratic Foundation, also said the men had been set up.
“The charges levied on them are false as no evidence has been brought and no witness was present,” he said, adding that the pamphlets were handwritten and photocopied, and anonymously distributed with the brothers’ contact details.
Earlier this month, about 400 demonstrators burned tyres and held protests in the low-income Waris Pura neighbourhood of Faisalabad, a slum inhabited by nearly 100,000 Christians, demanding the death penalty for the accused.
Pakistan’s controversial blasphemy law carries the death penalty although no one has ever been sent to the gallows for the crime.
Human rights activists want the legislation repealed, saying it is exploited for personal enmity and encourages extremism.
Dawn
IS THIS THE FREEDOM OTHER PEOPLE HAVE IN YOUR LANDS AND YOU TALK ABOUT OTHERS... HAHHAAAAAA
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taul
Siasat.pk - Blogger
@ molson4u
--I believe you know very well that in a slithering way you're so unsuccessfully trying to balance out the notions here,be it from the Real Practicing Muslim women who would go out ONLY covered from head to toe to working Muslim girls ( who ofcourse are NOT the target) along with purely diluting the whole essence of the "Freedom of Religion and Expression" these european countries possess/stand for with the countries where religion is considered supreme like Iran but even Iran can NOT be compared to these european countries coz like i said the equation would simply be unbalanced but you are adamant on holding to this delusion so what can i say and i won't even ask ( though know quite well ) of the backlashes minorities suffer in Iran>> simply because it is NOT the issue here....You have gone completely off the track as i said from the word get go.......If other issues are bothering you,you may create a new thread pertaining to the issues creating havoc in your head and place all the countries like Iran,Saudi Arabia and Pakistan and if further wished to proceed could also compare these countries with the Vatican city.
--While comparing the agenda the basic concept needs to be atleast clear and i repeatedly clarified if it were any of their religious countries ( which unfortunately they have none) we Muslims would most happily oblige but you are knowingly reluctant and unwilling to compare all the rest of Muslim countries with these european countries who rally for such absurd laws and when especially the population of all these Muslim countries is going to suffer and more especially when in these Muslim countries special privileges are granted to all the nationals of these so called european countries.
--If still unclear then i'll lay it out in an easy way>>>>You say Saudi Arabia and Pakistan but even if your crude assumptions are upheld then why would Muslim women from UAE,Qatar,Kuwait,Oman,Bahrain,Egypt,Syria,Jordan,India and the list is endless and ofcourse lastly their own native reverts suffer because of these blanket laws???Why would they be willing to act on Muslim women from all these countries even if we take into account your ludicrous,impractical,unreal and childish approach??
--I urge you to leave all or none rule and snap out of this illusion that whosoever is condemning such laws is basically Anti-west coz then again just like your whole take on this issue,you'd be only fooling your ownself.
--Blasphemy laws are fine meant to keep balance and cap on all those who would deliberately retort in an abhorrent manner and utter unfathomable words but then again misuse of any law can be lethal and if any action is undertaken without proper evidence then the fellows trying to act on their own thinking of doing justice become themselves the perpetrators and ought to be punished sternly and accordingly and hope you atleast understand and be able to grasp that they were NOT killed just because of their faith.
--I believe you know very well that in a slithering way you're so unsuccessfully trying to balance out the notions here,be it from the Real Practicing Muslim women who would go out ONLY covered from head to toe to working Muslim girls ( who ofcourse are NOT the target) along with purely diluting the whole essence of the "Freedom of Religion and Expression" these european countries possess/stand for with the countries where religion is considered supreme like Iran but even Iran can NOT be compared to these european countries coz like i said the equation would simply be unbalanced but you are adamant on holding to this delusion so what can i say and i won't even ask ( though know quite well ) of the backlashes minorities suffer in Iran>> simply because it is NOT the issue here....You have gone completely off the track as i said from the word get go.......If other issues are bothering you,you may create a new thread pertaining to the issues creating havoc in your head and place all the countries like Iran,Saudi Arabia and Pakistan and if further wished to proceed could also compare these countries with the Vatican city.
--While comparing the agenda the basic concept needs to be atleast clear and i repeatedly clarified if it were any of their religious countries ( which unfortunately they have none) we Muslims would most happily oblige but you are knowingly reluctant and unwilling to compare all the rest of Muslim countries with these european countries who rally for such absurd laws and when especially the population of all these Muslim countries is going to suffer and more especially when in these Muslim countries special privileges are granted to all the nationals of these so called european countries.
--If still unclear then i'll lay it out in an easy way>>>>You say Saudi Arabia and Pakistan but even if your crude assumptions are upheld then why would Muslim women from UAE,Qatar,Kuwait,Oman,Bahrain,Egypt,Syria,Jordan,India and the list is endless and ofcourse lastly their own native reverts suffer because of these blanket laws???Why would they be willing to act on Muslim women from all these countries even if we take into account your ludicrous,impractical,unreal and childish approach??
--I urge you to leave all or none rule and snap out of this illusion that whosoever is condemning such laws is basically Anti-west coz then again just like your whole take on this issue,you'd be only fooling your ownself.
--Blasphemy laws are fine meant to keep balance and cap on all those who would deliberately retort in an abhorrent manner and utter unfathomable words but then again misuse of any law can be lethal and if any action is undertaken without proper evidence then the fellows trying to act on their own thinking of doing justice become themselves the perpetrators and ought to be punished sternly and accordingly and hope you atleast understand and be able to grasp that they were NOT killed just because of their faith.
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vaqarraees55
Citizen
"Islam, Fastest Growing Religon in the West" !!!
This is another mis-conseption. A large number of the converts in US are the prisoners in the American jails where 'gang' system works and it is said that the Muslim 'Gangs' are the strongest there. Having said that, I myelf think that it is not a senceable argument, since I don't know what is in the hearts of these new converts. But I do know that majority of these new converts follow the faith spread by Alligah Mohammad group, who again the main stream does not thing to be Muslim in the firsdt place.
Secondly, on one hand we claim that Islam is the fastest growing religon in the world, amd on the other hand we, ourselves, keep on excluding other sects from Islam. Shias are not Muslims, Agakhanis are not Muslims, the pepole who go to 'Mazars' are not Muslims, Qadyannis are the non Muslims, and some even say the the people living in Sauda Arabia are not Muslims.
So now you tell me, is Islam the fastest growing or the fastest depleting religon?
This is another mis-conseption. A large number of the converts in US are the prisoners in the American jails where 'gang' system works and it is said that the Muslim 'Gangs' are the strongest there. Having said that, I myelf think that it is not a senceable argument, since I don't know what is in the hearts of these new converts. But I do know that majority of these new converts follow the faith spread by Alligah Mohammad group, who again the main stream does not thing to be Muslim in the firsdt place.
Secondly, on one hand we claim that Islam is the fastest growing religon in the world, amd on the other hand we, ourselves, keep on excluding other sects from Islam. Shias are not Muslims, Agakhanis are not Muslims, the pepole who go to 'Mazars' are not Muslims, Qadyannis are the non Muslims, and some even say the the people living in Sauda Arabia are not Muslims.
So now you tell me, is Islam the fastest growing or the fastest depleting religon?
