Atheists Rising?

zhkhan

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Atheism - Not Islam?

on the rise?



Is 'Atheism' the new 'fastest growing' group (religion?)
Atheists Are Speaking Out - in favor of -
For of Homosexuality
For drinking alcohol
For adultry
For abortion (murder of unborn babies)
Against Religion - Belief -
Will You Answer?
(bottom of this page to give your answer)

“Long after blacks and Jews have made great strides, and even as homosexuals gain respect, acceptance and new rights, there is still a group that lots of Americans just don’t like much: atheists. Those who don’t believe in God are widely considered to be immoral, wicked and angry.”

Victim complex alert, victim complex alert – to be honest, I don’t think that many Americans actually spend that much time even thinking about atheists, let alone not liking them.

And I don’t think the atheists have anybody but themselves to blame if people mistakenly believe them to be an angry lot while they keep touting people like Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens (the man who once called Mother Teresa a “*****”, and said that it was “a shame” that there is no Hell for her to go to) as their shining stars and role models.




“On basic questions of morality and human decency — issues such as governmental use of torture, the death penalty, punitive hitting of children, racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-Semitism, environmental degradation or human rights — the irreligious tend to be more ethical than their religious peers, particularly compared with those who describe themselves as very religious.”

What a load of absolute twaddle.

Yes, because religious believers sit round all day plotting new ways to violate the environment and people from other racial groups, and of course those famous atheists Stalin and Pol Pot were the most ethical leaders who never actually killed all those millions and millions of innocent people.

Notice the lack of actual citations for these wild claims?

“Consider that at the societal level, murder rates are far lower in secularized nations such as Japan or Sweden than they are in the much more religious United States, which also has a much greater portion of its population in prison.”

Notice how they fail to mention that the top ten countries with the LOWEST murder rates in the world are actually nations where the majority profess religious belief in either Christianity or Islam – the country with the lowest murder rate in the world, Iceland, is 80% Lutheran.

What they also fail to mention is that neither Sweden or Japan are in the top ten countries for the lowest murder rates – oops.

“Even within this country, those states with the highest levels of church attendance, such as Louisiana and Mississippi, have significantly higher murder rates than far less religious states such as Vermont and Oregon.”

I really can’t believe that these academic chaps would be dumb enough to miss the fact that Louisiana and Mississippi have greater levels of poverty (one of the major issues related to crime) than Vermont and Oregon do.

According to the US Census Bureau 17.3% of the population of Louisiana and 21.2% of the population of Mississippi live below the poverty level, whereas only 13.6% do in Oregon and only 10.6% do in Vermont.

“As individuals, atheists tend to score high on measures of intelligence, especially verbal ability and scientific literacy.”

Yes, and so do many religious believers, so this actually means nothing.

“They tend to raise their children to solve problems rationally, to make up their own minds when it comes to existential questions and to obey the golden rule.”

Yes, and so do most religious believers, once again, this proves absolutely nothing.

“They are more likely to practice safe sex than the strongly religious are…”

Not only is this claim out of date and debunked, but non-religious people are also more likely to be promiscuous, and therefore help to spread sexual disease, etc, than strongly religious people are.

“…and are less likely to be nationalistic or ethnocentric.”

Yes, which is why all these atheistic communists never went to war, or engaged in displays, acts and ventures of nationalistic pride, oh, hold on a minute, they did do that, and they still do that in atheistic Communist China – oops.

“They value freedom of thought.”

So do the majority of religious believers.

“While many studies show that secular Americans don’t fare as well as the religious when it comes to certain indicators of mental health or subjective well-being, new scholarship is showing that the relationships among atheism, theism, and mental health and well-being are complex.”

So let me get this straight while you have your cake and eat it too, you’re saying that when research shows that atheists don’t enjoy the same level of mental health and well-being, it’s ‘complicated’, and probably wrong.


http://www.islamnewsroom.com/news-we-need/1570
 

SalmanKhanN

MPA (400+ posts)
Let them increase as Allah SWT is the best of Judges..we shall all know Who is the King of All Worlds..and what is waiting for the disbelievers..InshAllah..Athiests want humans to act like animals...InshAllah..
 

thedude

Councller (250+ posts)
The Belief of Atheism:

"No religion so far has given CONCLUSIVE evidence of their God ... therefore we assume there is no God"
 

shamsheer

Senator (1k+ posts)
Muslims are responsible for the rise in Atheism.

I originally posted only the above line, but I am adding the following details to my comment for those who do not ponder.

I find muslims responsible for rise in Atheism becuase they have failed to present the deen correctly for the people who think and base their life on logical reasoning. Quran invites the people of logic and sanity to it self and challenge them to ponder with a sincere heart. People become atheist when they do not find answers to their logical questions in their beliefs. Quran provides all the answers but our lack of understanding of the divine contents fails us in helping those who are in search of the truth but do not understand the divine message. Since we muslims do not understand the religion well and do not have enough knowledge and wisdom to make an impact, that may be causing the rise in the number of atheists.

The problem with logic is it is based on what we can notice through our senses and within our life time to draw a conclusion. Any thing beyond that we cannot comprehend. That including the fragile human nature that tend to focus on trifles more than what is the more important, make us fail to understand the divine messages.
 
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Unicorn

Banned
It is true that atheists/agnostics are growing in great numbers. But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me.

We present arguments based on reason and logic and do not follow anything blindly just because it says so in a book , by Baba's, priests, Mullahs or Pundits. We accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind and mend our ways accordingly.

We still have disagreements
 

nauman

Senator (1k+ posts)
The Belief of Atheism:

"No religion so far has given CONCLUSIVE evidence of their God ... therefore we assume there is no God"
THEY ARE MOSTLY THINKING PEOPLE AND MOSTLLY PEOPLE WHO COVERT TO ISLAM FIRST BECOME ATHEIST.THATS WHY WEST IS CONVERTING TO ISLAM AS THEIR RELEGION DO NOT PROVIDE A TRUE CONCEPT OF GOD.DR ZAKIR NAIK BEAUTIFULY EXPLAIN IT TAHT I BECOME VERY HAppy WHEN I HAVE TO GIVE THE MESSAGE OF ISLAM ATHEIST BECAUSE THEY ALLREADY BELIVE FIRST PART OF KALMA .THAT THERE IS NO GOD AND I HAVE TO CONVENCE THEM ON THAT THERE IS NO GOD BUT ALLAH
 

SalmanKhanN

MPA (400+ posts)
Is it logic to say the earth and human race came into existence..by a chemical reaction..and then everything just happened..like a coincidence??? and can scientists or atheists tell that that chemical reaction that happened..where did the atoms for that came from???
Atheists believe in what they see?? so that means they dont believe in souls or do they?? science is about discoveries of how things happen..not who did them?? it is just HOW they are happening..and when atheists cant find the answer..Who and Why..they have no answer?? how about bacteria's?? did they exist 500 years ago??? noo coz naked eye couldnt see them..and now we can see them and we discovered them.. rite?? just like Jins we cant see..just like souls we cant see..the day we get to see God..i bet most of us wont be on the right side..and we dont have to wait long..coz like will be 40 ??50 years or 70 years more..who knows...then we will surely be given eyes to see the unseen..Humans are from monkeys????? hahah..they got aids from monkeys i know that LOL
It is true that atheists/agnostics are growing in great numbers. But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me.

We present arguments based on reason and logic and do not follow anything blindly just because it says so in a book , by Baba's, priests, Mullahs or Pundits. We accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind and mend our ways accordingly.

We still have disagreements
 

cefspan

Minister (2k+ posts)
It is true that atheists/agnostics are growing in great numbers. But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me.

We present arguments based on reason and logic and do not follow anything blindly just because it says so in a book , by Baba's, priests, Mullahs or Pundits. We accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind and mend our ways accordingly.

We still have disagreements

Whom do u classify by we, I just want to know , no offence mate.....
Secondly ,

Its just like this , DENIAL is the first step towards acceptanc3e , U deny what exists.........
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
It is true that atheists/agnostics are growing in great numbers. But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me.

We present arguments based on reason and logic and do not follow anything blindly just because it says so in a book , by Baba's, priests, Mullahs or Pundits. We accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind and mend our ways accordingly.

We still have disagreements
Religious people also "accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind". It is a common (and wrong) generalization that every religious person blindly follows in a book and priest and that if they became rational they would stop following their religion. With that said, Atheists arguments have always seemed rather weak to me.

"But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me." But why is it beyond you? there is not such thing as good or bad in atheism and if there is then who is dictating it? Why shouldn't an atheist support homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion?
 

Unicorn

Banned
Whom do u classify by we, I just want to know , no offence mate.....
Secondly ,

Its just like this , DENIAL is the first step towards acceptanc3e , U deny what exists.........

Being one of agnostic I refereed my self as a group even though atheists are the ones who do not believe in god they are our close cousins. We as agnostics like to keep our mind always open that's what makes us agnostics. I don't know what you mean by denying what exists?
 

Unicorn

Banned
Is it logic to say the earth and human race came into existence..by a chemical reaction..and then everything just happened..like a coincidence??? and can scientists or atheists tell that that chemical reaction that happened..where did the atoms for that came from???
Atheists believe in what they see?? so that means they dont believe in souls or do they?? science is about discoveries of how things happen..not who did them?? it is just HOW they are happening..and when atheists cant find the answer..Who and Why..they have no answer?? how about bacteria's?? did they exist 500 years ago??? noo coz naked eye couldnt see them..and now we can see them and we discovered them.. rite?? just like Jins we cant see..just like souls we cant see..the day we get to see God..i bet most of us wont be on the right side..and we dont have to wait long..coz like will be 40 ??50 years or 70 years more..who knows...then we will surely be given eyes to see the unseen..Humans are from monkeys????? hahah..they got aids from monkeys i know that LOL

We are put in a position either to accept illogical and irrational statements or to explain how every thing came into being unfortunately we cannot do that. Today we know for a fact that earth and our solar system was not the first that came into existence there have been thousands of Suns and Planets that had lived and died before.

Existence of microorganisms have been contemplated long time ago. Unseen in a religious sense in existence of a "being" that no one sees and whose pleasure is dependent upon my worship to him for this he created this entire universe in return he will provide me heaven for my worship. To me it sounds like I scratch your back and you scratch mine.

Most of us are "Blessed" with the power of questioning and how to use it.
 

thedude

Councller (250+ posts)
Is it logic to say the earth and human race came into existence..by a chemical reaction..and then everything just happened..like a coincidence???

Human race did not just happen ... it came from the apes, who came from primitive primates, and so on (all the way down to multicellular organisms, unicellular organisms ) ...

Earth did not just happen, it popped out as a lump of mass from our star (the sun) which popped out of the core of our galaxy, and so on ... and all galaxies were part of one mass in a tiny volume when big bang happened

However then you might ask the question "where did life originally come from?" ... also "how the big bang was caused?"

and can scientists or atheists tell that that chemical reaction that happened..where did the atoms for that came from???

these questions have not been answered scientifically ... BUT

Atheists stop there and say "we don't know but we're trying to find out ... and as long we don't find out we don't make any truth claims"

God-believers don't stop there, but then make the truth claim "therefore there is a God"


Atheists believe in what they see?? so that means they dont believe in souls or do they??

not every atheist believes in "no soul" ... in philosophy this debate has been transformed into the debate of "physicalism versus dualism" ...

this is an unsolved problem just like the origin of life and universe ...

but again ...

- some atheists like to call it "an unsolved problem" and assume there is no soul ...
- some atheists call it "not a problem" ... they simply refuse to believe in soul ...
- and God-believers like to call it "a solved problem" because God said there is a soul ...

science is about discoveries of how things happen..not who did them?? it is just HOW they are happening..and when atheists cant find the answer..Who and Why..they have no answer?? how about bacteria's?? did they exist 500 years ago??? noo coz naked eye couldnt see them..and now we can see them and we discovered them.. rite?? just like Jins we cant see..just like souls we cant see..the day we get to see God..i bet most of us wont be on the right side..and we dont have to wait long..coz like will be 40 ??50 years or 70 years more..who knows...then we will surely be given eyes to see the unseen..

you raise an interesting point ... 500 years ago there were no bacteria ... so if someone claimed:

"I believe in bacteria",

scientists and atheists would not believe and simply say

"I do not have CONCLUSIVE evidence that bacteria exists ... therefore I assume bacteria don't exist"

now the question is who is more logical? the one who is making a truth claim without evidence (bacteria-believer) or the one who simply suspends judgement until the evidence comes in (bacteria-atheist)

when bacteria was discovered it might have gone like this:

bacteria-believer: I told you there are bacteria but you didn't believe me
bacteria-atheist: I didn't believe you because you were making the claim without evidence ... and I wasn't making any claim ... I was simply saying I would not believe until the evidence comes in
bacteria-believer: but I was right then
bacteria-atheist: you were not right then because if you didn't have evidence it's quite possible your claim might turn out to be the incorrect one ... in fact you're lucky bacteria were found and your claim ended up being the correct one after the fact
 
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thedude

Councller (250+ posts)
just for clarification of definitions:

Theist: the one who believes in god
Agnostic: the one who is unsure whether there is a god or no god
Atheist: the one who lives and acts as if there is no god (but still open to the possibility of god if there is evidence)
Anti-theist: the one who is sure there is "no god" ... or the one who "hates god"

for more details:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Silence/Theism
 

Unicorn

Banned
Religious people also "accept answers that satisfy a rationale mind". It is a common (and wrong) generalization that every religious person blindly follows in a book and priest and that if they became rational they would stop following their religion. With that said, Atheists arguments have always seemed rather weak to me.

"But where this idea that we are for Homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion is beyond me." But why is it beyond you? there is not such thing as good or bad in atheism and if there is then who is dictating it? Why shouldn't an atheist support homosexuality, alcohol, adultery and abortion?

There is something call conventional wisdom that comes from with in. People of wisdom have been on record throughout history, Socrates is one example. Knowing the difference between right and wrong is well with in the range of human wisdom.
 

thedude

Councller (250+ posts)
sometimes agnostics (and theists too) have a problem with atheists ...

agnostics say, "if we don't have evidence why don't we stay unsure? ... why do we have to assume non-existence?"

the assumption of non-existence comes in practical matters ... e.g., if you need to earn money would you just sit at home and pray to God to give you money? or would you go out and find a job and do hard work? ...

in practical matters most muslims are atheists too because (other than making dua) they don't leave anything to God ... if they have to do work to earn money and buy food, they are going to do the effort without assuming God's active interference

FOR EXAMPLE

if a student has exam tomorrow ... he has to prepare from a book that has 10 chapters ... he wants to perform at his best in his exam ...

if he's a muslim, would he prepare 9 chapters and make dua for the 10th chapter like this "O God! I prepared 9 chapters, please put knowledge of 10th chapter in my head?" no ... he would make dua but he would still prepare all 10 chapters assuming dua is not going to make him memorize even a single line without himself actively preparing for it

if he's an atheist, he would still prepare all 10 chapters ... but he would not make any dua because he thinks dua doesn't do anything


AND IN THE EXAM ROOM, HARD-WORKING MUSLIM STUDENTS DON'T DO ANY BETTER THAN HARD-WORKING ATHEIST STUDENTS ... THEY ALL GET GOOD RESULTS ON AVERAGE IF THEY PREPARE ... BAD RESULTS ON AVERAGE IF THEY DON'T PREPARE

IN FACT IF YOU CAN PROVE (SCIENTIFICALLY OR STATISTICALLY) THAT MUSLIMS DO BETTER IN ANY FIELD ON AVERAGE (BECAUSE OF DUA) THAN PEOPLE OF OTHER RELIGIONS, MOST ATHEISTS WOULD ACCEPT ISLAM
 
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Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
There is something call conventional wisdom that comes from with in. People of wisdom have been on record throughout history, Socrates is one example. Knowing the difference between right and wrong is well with in the range of human wisdom.
Conventional wisdom doesn't tell you what's wrong or right.