Aisa na ho Walidain apna baita aur Biwi apna shohar kho de - Boxer Amir Khan

[Two Stooges]

ایک اور ۔ ۔ ۔مظلوم

Can you please merge, the two threads
http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...a-aur-Biwi-apna-shohar-kho-de-Boxer-Amir-Khan

http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...;۔۔-mazloom&p=4270744#post4270744

 

[jani1]

Re: ایک اور ۔ ۔ ۔مظلوم

[hilar][hilar][hilar][hilar][hilar][hilar][hilar]
۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔.او نہ کریں جی۔۔۔۔۔۔کیوں مظلُوموں کی بد دُعائیں لینا چاہتے ہیں۔۔:lol:۔۔مظلُوم ۔۔2۔۔۔:lol:۔٫٫

 

[jani1]

Re: ایک اور ۔ ۔ ۔مظلوم


ویسے فوٹو زبردست پیدا کیا ہے۔۔۔۔۔

بیچارہ دو خواتین کے بیچ میں پھنس کر سوچ رہا ہے شاید۔۔۔۔کہ۔۔۔

کوئی بتلائے کہ ہم کیا کریں۔۔۔(bigsmile)۔

 

[دوسرا_سوال]

Offshore company is not illegal. IK was wrong when he said that.

Not being a tax resident.....what is incorrect about that? If you spend more than 180 days out of Pakistan, you are not a tax resident. 1. At that time, IK was not a tax resident.

Tax amnesty scheme....That allegation is weird. I have asked many PMLNers, but noone responds. Maybe you can. 2. Tell me how does one get tax amnesty on something that isnt taxable to begin with? Simple answer please.

Undervaluing flat.......Not sure if you are aware of property law in Pakistan, but the valuation used for tax purposes is the 3. 'purchase price', not the current market price.

4. Avoids paying property tax on Bani Gala........that is news to me. There is no law that says that if a property was gifted, it would be exempt from tax for life. If it is gifted, that only helps avoid tax on the value of the sale. In subsequent years, property tax is always payable, and IK is paying that. Check the facts pls.

5. Overseas party funding disclosure......The issue on that has been debated to death. Parties only need to disclose funds meant for party operations. A lot of overseas funding IK has raised has been for non party expenses. Like dharna, lockdown etc. The head under which you raise funds is what specifies the funds usage. These are laws made by the ECP itself. Lol.

You may make all the arguments that you want, and pretend to be politically correct by saying things like "IK is as bad as Nawaz/Zardari", but I have rarely seen you talk about Zardari and NAwaz'' corruption. You dont even raise an eyebrow on the daylight robbery called Panama leaks, and then you claim to be neutral. Sorry, but it doesnt really work that way.

And your repeated references to Sita White etc dont really bother me. But they seem biased, unless you also talk about the personal life (mis)adventures of Zardari, Benazir , Shahbaz, Hamza, NAwaz and Maryam. But in my mind, all of these are off the table during a political debate. Its cowardly to use such references.

Look, your monkey's white so I can't argue on reason with you, I just can't imagine why do you choose to be so naive when it comes to IK!


Nawaz-o-Zardari are the most corrupt persons in the history of the universe. Nawaz even more so because he is in Punjab and securing this is more important to form a govt., but really Nawaz is most corrupt in ever of ever. What's the point of beating this dead horse when everyone agrees to it??


1. IK was not tax resident in Pakistan between 1992 to 2000 - that's news to me. Or, or, you're just lying out of your true Imran Love.


2. Only an idiot will buy car insurance for a car he doesn't own. Likewise, only an idiot will use TAS 2000 if and when he has nothing to hide. Your simplicity is admirable. Rather than question your beloved leader on why he used TAS 2000, your comeback is that there was nothing taxable. The question than is for which mangoes and melons was TAS 2000 used?!??! It makes the person every more dodgy. You selective stupidity when it comes to Imran Love in matter like this one make me question why do I even bother.


3. :doh: - that's all I have to say for such a smart person like you chosing to lie so blatantly. :doh: :doh: :doh:


4. O bhai, that's how tax evaders do their dirty deed. And IK justifies it. Imagine a property developer cheating the taxpayers in exactly this manner at the place whereever you're living. You'll never condone it, but when IK does it, it's all perfect.


5. I think overseas funding should be allowed from resident Pakistanis when amounts are disclosed. End of. If you think otherwise, then you're enemy of Pakistani people.


But my friend I salute you for your selective naivety. I think rather than trying to be so overclever, you should just say it simply like any other patwari or jayala that whatever my leader does, I accept it and consider it perfection. Just to praise your leader, why put on this fake act of some 16yo innocent girl who doesn't know anything about how the world works?

 

[Will_Bite]

1. IK was not tax resident in Pakistan between 1992 to 2000 - that's news to me. Or, or, you're just lying out of your true Imran Love.

Where did I say that? I was talking about 70s till mid 80s.
IK was a tax resident in the 90s, and ACCORDING TO PAKISTAN TAXATION LAWS, if you earn money overseas, and buy property with that money overseas, it DOES NOT HAVE TO BE DECLARED IN PAKISTAN because of DOUBLE TAXATION TREATY between UK and Pakistan.
The reason I used caps is to highlight the relevant clause of the law, not to shout.

2. Only an idiot will buy car insurance for a car he doesn't own. Likewise, only an idiot will use TAS 2000 if and when he has nothing to hide. Your simplicity is admirable. Rather than question your beloved leader on why he used TAS 2000, your comeback is that there was nothing taxable. The question than is for which mangoes and melons was TAS 2000 used?!??! It makes the person every more dodgy. You selective stupidity when it comes to Imran Love in matter like this one make me question why do I even bother.

Its obvious that because of lack of relevant arguments, you have to resort to using words like stupid, idiot etc. Really, if you cannot debate with logic or arguments using relevant laws as a backdrop, then perhaps its best to debate with the likes of those who will respond to you in kind. AT least you can then curse your heart out.
Imran sold his London flat in 2003, and declared it in 2003 since he was remitting the proceeds of the sale back to Pakistan. When you remit funds back to Pakistan, you have to legally show a source. Imran declared it for that purpose. Tax was not applicable on his flat because of my previous point, and tax is not applicable on remittances to Pakistan according to FBR rules. TAS 2000 was applied across the board to whoever filed their taxes in Musharraf era, even you, if you filed taxes. So whether or not you could benefit from it, you fell under that rule. Please read up on facts, and history before debating, otherwise it becomes a silly politically oriented shouting match.

. :doh: - that's all I have to say for such a smart person like you chosing to lie so blatantly. :doh: :doh: :doh:

I am very well aware of Pakistan's taxation laws. According to law, property tax is paid based on the purchase price, not market price, because market price can be manipulated. This is what the FBR register says. If you have information to the contrary, state it.

4. O bhai, that's how tax evaders do their dirty deed. And IK justifies it. Imagine a property developer cheating the taxpayers in exactly this manner at the place whereever you're living. You'll never condone it, but when IK does it, it's all perfect.

Comparing a property developer who builds for a living, and an individual who builds a house for residence is awkward. If a father bequeaths his son his home, do you think he will list the price of the house at the current market rate? If you will your home to your son, will you list the price of the home at the current market rate and burden him with x100 times property tax? These are common sense laws that exist in every country of the world, and are done to protect families, not developers. A developer cannot 'gift' a property to his client. He always sells it. See the difference.

5. I think overseas funding should be allowed from resident Pakistanis when amounts are disclosed. End of. If you think otherwise, then you're enemy of Pakistani people.

For political parties, these amounts should be disclosed. And PTI has the most transparent disclosure mechanism. To be audited by KPMG is not a joke.

But my friend I salute you for your selective naivety. I think rather than trying to be so overclever, you should just say it simply like any other patwari or jayala that whatever my leader does, I accept it and consider it perfection.

I didnt praise IK anywhere. I stated facts, laws from the FBR register, and with relevant scenarios. If you can debate those, fine. If your arguments are limited to 'oh youre lying.......oh youre just an iK lover.........oh youre being stupid.....' then you can list your name in the long line of status quo followers who have nothing valid to add to a discussion.

Again, if you want to respond, please do so relevant to the facts I quoted above regarding FBR property laws. I know these laws, because I have read them and applied them. If you have counter information, most welcome.

 

[updates]

Life is not easy

 

[دوسرا_سوال]

Where did I say that? I was talking about 70s till mid 80s.
IK was a tax resident in the 90s, and ACCORDING TO PAKISTAN TAXATION LAWS, if you earn money overseas, and buy property with that money overseas, it DOES NOT HAVE TO BE DECLARED IN PAKISTAN because of DOUBLE TAXATION TREATY between UK and Pakistan.
The reason I used caps is to highlight the relevant clause of the law, not to shout.


Its obvious that because of lack of relevant arguments, you have to resort to using words like stupid, idiot etc. Really, if you cannot debate with logic or arguments using relevant laws as a backdrop, then perhaps its best to debate with the likes of those who will respond to you in kind. AT least you can then curse your heart out.
Imran sold his London flat in 2003, and declared it in 2003 since he was remitting the proceeds of the sale back to Pakistan. When you remit funds back to Pakistan, you have to legally show a source. Imran declared it for that purpose. Tax was not applicable on his flat because of my previous point, and tax is not applicable on remittances to Pakistan according to FBR rules. TAS 2000 was applied across the board to whoever filed their taxes in Musharraf era, even you, if you filed taxes. So whether or not you could benefit from it, you fell under that rule. Please read up on facts, and history before debating, otherwise it becomes a silly politically oriented shouting match.


I am very well aware of Pakistan's taxation laws. According to law, property tax is paid based on the purchase price, not market price, because market price can be manipulated. This is what the FBR register says. If you have information to the contrary, state it.


Comparing a property developer who builds for a living, and an individual who builds a house for residence is awkward. If a father bequeaths his son his home, do you think he will list the price of the house at the current market rate? If you will your home to your son, will you list the price of the home at the current market rate and burden him with x100 times property tax? These are common sense laws that exist in every country of the world, and are done to protect families, not developers. A developer cannot 'gift' a property to his client. He always sells it. See the difference.

For political parties, these amounts should be disclosed. And PTI has the most transparent disclosure mechanism. To be audited by KPMG is not a joke.


I didnt praise IK anywhere. I stated facts, laws from the FBR register, and with relevant scenarios. If you can debate those, fine. If your arguments are limited to 'oh youre lying.......oh youre just an iK lover.........oh youre being stupid.....' then you can list your name in the long line of status quo followers who have nothing valid to add to a discussion.

Again, if you want to respond, please do so relevant to the facts I quoted above regarding FBR property laws. I know these laws, because I have read them and applied them. If you have counter information, most welcome.

Just the part in RED shows you're biased.


Before Mush, the overseas income needed to be declared as well. If tax was paid, then relief was allowed at the same time of filing the return, just like any double taxation treaty.


But declaration was a must, which IK didn't.


Your second part with father gifting son a property isn't a good example because IK purposefully used the benami to avoid the tax related to bani gala. I would appreciate him if he pays the taxes due on them today which they aren't because of getting it as a gift.


Secondly, IK always says himself that he purchased bani gala from the sale proceeds of his london flat. The small matter was that he took some "bridging loan" from Jemima because time of sale of london flat and bani gala purchase were not coinciding. That's all acceptable, but when bani-gala shows up as "gift" even today then it all makes it dodgy all over again.


IK says that he used proceeds from london flat to purcahse bani-gala, then the price of bani-gala should be shown and not "Rs. 0 (gift)" in his tax returns or ECP papers.


Can you answers this simple thing please?

 

[Will_Bite]

Just the part in RED shows you're biased.

Lol. I guess you are comparing it to Sharif. Well, the whole case surrounding Sharifs is that the properties were bought in the 90s, when none of the SHarifs were non residents. Why do you think SHarifs are trying so hard to prove that properties were bought in 2006 and not 1993? Compare apples and apples, not apples and oranges.

Before Mush, the overseas income needed to be declared as well. If tax was paid, then relief was allowed at the same time of filing the return, just like any double taxation treaty.

Please dont make up rules as you go just to negate me. Before or after Musharraf, overseas income generated through overseas sources DOES NOT have to be declared in Pakistan. Any expats working in UAE, Saudi, etc dont need to file taxes in Pakistan. The existence of a NICOP gives you that right.
When you remit money to Pakistan, you do not have to pay tax on that money.
Only when you invest that money in Pakistan and generate income from it, do you have to pay taxes.
And the double taxation treaty between UK and Pakistan exists since the 80s. I posted the relevant laws from FBR somewhere on this forum. I even posted the UK side of the law which is specific to Pakistan. Cant be bothered to search it up.

Your second part with father gifting son a property isn't a good example because IK purposefully used the benami to avoid the tax related to bani gala. I would appreciate him if he pays the taxes due on them today which they aren't because of getting it as a gift.

Not sure if you understood the process. Tax is payable on any property that is retained. As far as taxing the price of a property is concerned, it does not happen in case of a transfer between family members, whether it is in the form of inheritance, or gift. Dont muddle laws that are in place. Its not a good practice.

Secondly, IK always says himself that he purchased bani gala from the sale proceeds of his london flat. The small matter was that he took some "bridging loan" from Jemima because time of sale of london flat and bani gala purchase were not coinciding. That's all acceptable, but when bani-gala shows up as "gift" even today then it all makes it dodgy all over again. IK says that he used proceeds from london flat to purcahse bani-gala, then the price of bani-gala should be shown and not "Rs. 0 (gift)" in his tax returns or ECP papers.
Can you answers this simple thing please?

The contents of your query are oddly funny. I have adequately explained the situation regarding Bani Gala that I believe satisfies me, since I have based my satisfaction on past and current taxation laws in Pakistan, not based on whether I like Imran Khan or not. If it doesnt satisfy you, that is something you have to reconcile with.




But your query is about spending all this time and effort in questioning a transaction that involves no illegal money, and no off the books maneuvering. That makes is oddly funny.
On the other hand, NAwaz Sharif's transactions are all, as accepted by them, 'parchi based', and there are strong allegations of money laundering on them.


Imran is an MNA, while NS is the PM. And you are more focused on the clerical and cosmetic issue surrounding IKs bani gala, as opposed to a person in power, who has definitely misused power and authority to launder money using stolen funds. Salute to your bias. (Now please dont try to wash it off by saying "Nawaz /Zardari are the most corrupt people on earth......but lets talk about Bani Gala." That would just make it more whimsical.)


ANd please, regarding taxation laws, please debate with relevant clauses, not based on what suits PMLNs money laundering. We cant make rules as we go.

I oppose IK fiercely on many other things involving PTI and perhaps even his personal life, but at the end of the day, his personal life is not my business, so I keep it to myself. Politically, I have criticized him on many issues, but one thing I have not found fault with is his financial practices.