Musharraf is fighting Pakistan's Case on CNN - A must watch

Aijazahmed

Minister (2k+ posts)
[video]http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=r6qqCQ8aof8[/video]

[video]http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=men0SfdYL4s[/video]

[video]http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=NiHjd5ZGmyU[/video]
 

cmq07md

Voter (50+ posts)
Very good reply. I still believe he was better than Zardari. Pakistan didn't have at least 'day to day' isssues like loadshedding, hunger etc. Economic growth was also good.
 

absolute.zeero

Voter (50+ posts)
@cmq07cd

Husn e zan hay janab ka :P, i not totally but partially agree with you , nicely handled interview and no doubt sardari should ever be an option , but one thing i would also say is i still remember watching the news on GEO people killing there children because of hunger , man eating magnet and get opertaed because of hunger ,in musharraf tenuor. loadshading was always an issue it got worst only because of musharraf couldnt handle it properly in his 8 yr time span , aatay ka bohran , wrong policies of shortcut aziz exported more then expectd growth. and no matter how worst zardari is i am sure he wont bomb mosques like musharraf did, Musharraf is a nationalist but his problem is his arrogance and his stubbornness which gets out of hand sometimes to make them worst. In the end kisi k aik interview se khush ho k us ki khaamiyon ko yakser bhool nahee jaana chaheeay , coz your words really matter, as he might be reading them ,and also this is how you help creating a public opinion

Thanks
 

Aijazahmed

Minister (2k+ posts)
Off course no one is perfect. Blamming any one is the easiest thing but just think about if we were there in his place then what would we do. He was way better than PPP or PML(N).
Though his biiggest mistake was LAL MASJID. I agree on that.
His greatest accomplishment was Kargill front. That, unfortunately, Nawaz Sharif lost on the breakfast table of Bill Clinton at White House. And then as a reward, Mr. & Mrs. Sharif got a family photo with Clinton.
 

cmq07md

Voter (50+ posts)
Well said Aizaz miyan, Kargil was almost a success till Sharif got cold feet. Zardari is known as 'Mr. 10% ' as he (in)famously used to take his share in the deals. Nawaz Sharif is a big opportunist and he came back to this country thanks only to Musharraf. things were going fine till 'Lal Masjid' incident happened and then growing US pressure made Musharraf doing what he dint want to do.
If China can grow superbly under communism, why can't Pakistan?? Democracy is a myth in Pakistan and both Benazir and Sharif were corrupt during their tenure. Both PPP and PML(N) indulge in petty fight for power.
We must accept that army is running pakistan for past 60 years and only because of army, pakistan has survived as a nation. Had it not been Army, India would have dictated us.
 

adnanax

Voter (50+ posts)
to cm & aijaz!

brothers i like ur replies i certainly disgaree with them....as we are from a sovern state i hope u will respect my opnion and wont be ill mannered like our politicians.

my frend as patriate i love my country as can any pakitani do.....but we have clear our record. well about pakistan army i must say i ll have to disagree with u........every war we faced was the reaction of our operations in india performed by our army. every threat to our country was generated by our army. 1965 war was due the failure of 'operation gibralter'. since then we continued our operations in india .......in form of empowering sikh movement in india when in return india fought back and created conflict of pakhtonistan we cried. if u r wise enuff and u knw some facts u must knw that after chief of army staff jahangeer karamet mushraf was appointed and since then he strated bullshiting abt nawaz sharif and took all the generals in confidence about any civilian firing any general. kargil was one issue which was launched by musharaf himself and nawaz sharif was un aware of it and he was in favour of continueing peace dialogues wid india. army interfered indirectly and strated kargil operation. dont u think it was a double standard by pakistan.PM is talking about peace and army is running an operation.

i have all my facts cleard and for refrence u can ask me ...........

army has nothinig to do with politics their duty is to serve the nation and defend the country for which they always had 80% of pakistanz total budget.

well i want to talk more but i am afraid my frends we can not bear the fact because we are guilty.

if u are wandering for justification plz let me knw as well cos i am also confused abt what our army has done in past and what they are doing now.
 

Aijazahmed

Minister (2k+ posts)
Adnan
Yes at some extent you are right that Army has nothing to do with politics. But mind it is not army who coupes every time. These are the politicians who always invite the army to take over. Just for your record
1- In 1977, with the help of US Dollars, politians (PNA Movements) created anarchy in Pakistan and then Asghar Khan wrote Generals to get rid off Bhutto's govt. When Zia took over, all PNA leadership including Jamat - e - Islami made JASHAN and they distributed Mithai. I am the eye witness.
2 - Later, Nawaz Sharif became the spiritual son of General Zia.
3 - In 1990s, Nawaz Sharif and Benazir both played PING PONG of power and both, when in opposition, tried to destroy the other's govt. Is it not true?
4- On one hand, Nawaz Sharif lost the Kargill and on the other hand, Aitezaz Ahsan (then Enterior Minister of Benazir Govt. and a key activist now in lawyer's movement) gave all the proofs about Khalistan Tehreek to Rajiv Gandhi and de-estabilize the eastern borders of Pakistan.
Please consider these facts.
And as far democracy as concern in Pakistan it will never flourish until we have feudal system in Pakistan. We have hundreds of dictators in every part of Pakistan and unfortunately, in almost every political party (with some exceptions of MQM and Jamat -e- Islami etc.)
So, you decide who is to blame???
 

Nabeel

Citizen
salam o alikum brothers and sisters of pakistan

i read your comments about the political system and army take over.

according to me i think that army do his job better than our polticians
consisder that if pakistani army is not powerful enough to defend u guys think india keep silence on 26 11 i dont think so
After Allah who take care of our country i think it is pakistani army and atlast please donot blame the whole department because this is the department who give alot of scrifices to defend our country . please do not use desrepect wards to the army bcz it also includes our nation heroes.

about the wars with india i think these fought by the cause for kashmir. and kashmir is our may you guys forget the speach of Quaid azam but iam not so please remeber that speech and if we faught 1000 wars for kashmir we will faught. and it is gone happened when we make our country strong and instead of saying that iam right and ur wrong we have to start work hard to make our country might and when we got that power of that sentence which is below


" might is right "

and when we are capable of that power every thing gone right



Pakistan Zindabad
Pakistani Army Zindabad
i support our troops and please u to
and love your fellow Citzens
 

adnanax

Voter (50+ posts)
dear nabeel!

nobody is fighting here my frend i respect my friend aijaz's openion he certainly does mine and i am really thankful to him for giving me such facts. well i do agree with u aijaz that there are dictators in almost every political party in pakistan. from my above stated arguments u might think that i was defending nawaz sharif which is not a fact my frnd they are as corrupt as anyone else. i dont like most of my polititions as well but i am also in great favour of democracy.as for as giving the list of sikhs to india my frend we have no right to interfer in indiaz internal matters as were doing at the time of zia ul haq or before or after.

we say that there is indiaz hand in pakhtunistan's movement and we say that india is involved in cross border terrorism but dont u think that we started all this first when we supported and helped khalistan movement. i have no intensions to defend india either but my frend all the politicians we have seen were on payroll of our agencies. there were not much independent political leaders in pakistan. what they did was what they were asked to do by army.

i respect my countries army. i love my soliders. i would do whatever it takes to defend my country. i will fight till the last drop of my blood for respect of my country.

but i am aginst the intervision of army into the politics. armies belongs to countries but pakistan belongs to army. that is were i contradict.

hope to hear from u guys soon.
 

mubeen

Citizen
In my OPINION all you are saying the right things to some extent.
Democracy doesn't have once face and cannot be run in the same form and model in all the countries. Foundation of our democracy system is very weak and that's why other including army and external powers intervene in our political system. We have to work hard to make our self educated and strong and that is the only and only way towards better life and security. To date all parties are corrupt to the level that you cannot even imagine and I strongly believe that the next take over by the army or group of patriotic (not taliban) will be bloody and I said it again it will be very bloody. All the politicians are corrupt to very disgusting level that you cannot even imagine. Army's training is to defend the territory and get those who were the cause of the problem in a very short and managed way, and to do this they would have to get the subject or kill it. They are always invited to take over the power and when they come they can do few things better which they are trained in and other not that require political solutions.
I would blame army only for one thing, whenever they are in power they couldn't establish the long lasting governing system and could not provide the unbreakable structure/platform for political parties to operate on without corrupting the system and as soon as the army general is gone the whole system fall down. Then I say I shouldn't be blaming them because arm general in power take recommendations from those who are favorable to him i.e. politicians or bureaucracy and they are from the same breed of corrupt womb who take advantage of the army general and make him fool and indulge him into some non relevant tasks. These people work like agents for other parties and for other countries and enjoy the governmental positions all the time regardless of the person or party in power.

Our problem is if we belong to one party then we cover up all the mistakes and corruptions of our party leaders even though we were never given any explanation and proofs of any wrong doing by any party leader or by their offices. All we think like dumb idiots that we have to praise our party senior in order to stay in the party and to get some benefits. Unless the party workers speak out about the party policies, activities and corruptions. they are not going to get better and govern better. How one politician can get better when he has multimillion several houses, cars, zero producing offices just for show offs and other things. He/she is very much indulge into his/her other personal work and just working on increasing his/her personal wealth. In this situation where he needs so much money to maintain his status, he cannot focus on governmental responsibilities and will find the sources to gain benefits and money only and only for him self. And this is not possible without doing the corruption.

Look in the matter of newly made minister from Maulana Fazal ur Rahman's party, he is holding on to the rented house in Islamabad and is not vacating, and top on that court is giving him more and more time, for what, renter does not have any right to file the case against the landlord and here the court is giving decision in favor of the renter, why, just because of the corruption. And this minister is not ashamed for not even one minute and not resigning and even the government is not asking him to step down.

The whole Pakistan doesn't have to come on the street and show their anger, only party workers can make this system better by not supporting blindly to their leaders and not raising the voice on corruption and the other things that damage Pakistan as a country.

Here we see ppp party people/ministers on the talk shows and praising their leadership and explaining what is party doing, their decisions and the governmental achievements and future plans, here is the reality, these people are not even allowed to see the big boss and if in case or by mistake they are part of the group to see big boss they are sitting in the last line and come back without communicating even one word. It is on record that some ministers don't even say a word during meetings and only say yes sir yes sir and come out of the meeting and give impression to the media and public that they know every thing and they have the authority to do any thing related to his/her ministry.

So to those who bring the facts here and claim to know the right things should understand that we all including you guys and me will have to raise voices on the issues without favoring the party or their Karta Dharta's because we are the problem and they are taking advantage of our stupidity.

We talk about India and say they have long running democracy and their army never intervene their system, well it good but here is the reality, Indian parliament has the most corrupt and criminal elected representatives compare to the rest of the world. Indian army never interfere because army knows whom they will order to do things because everyone is so corrupt and the only option will left for them is either to get the culprit or kill it, they don't want to kill 50-60 thousand politicians there and hoping that the system will self correct. They might self correct themselves but because our country is small and don't have much resources and come close to bankruptcy very soon therefore we have to act fast to correct our system and to weed out those who have corruption cancer and cannot be treated in any way.
 

Aijazahmed

Minister (2k+ posts)
Very well said Mubeen that "we have to act fast to correct our system and to weed out those who have corruption cancer" Wouldn't it be better if you also suggested any solution as how a very poor common Pakistani can correct this corrupt system.
Actually we all know the porblem, we know the theives and decoits in our society, but they are so much powerful that we as common deprived Pakistanis can not fight with them.
Can a HARI fight with a JAGIRDAAR?
Can a MILLWORKER fight with a SARMAYADAAR?
No, not even able to think about it.
SO, WHAT IS THE SOLUTION THEN?????
ANYONE HAS ANY IDEA.........
PLS.SHARE
Thanks
Aijaz
 

adnanax

Voter (50+ posts)
hi mubeen !!!

i agree wid u to the extent of having problem in ourselves. look the reason for evrey political and non political problem is not us. the solution lies in the polictics. democracy is the best solution. once the people will knw that this party officials are corrupt they wont let them come to the power next time. the taking over by army cannt be justified in any way.

there is a thing in pakistan which is called establishment. it the bunch of agencies governed by army they are larger than life and untouchables. no politician can come into power without their go. all the politicians werer puppets in their hands. the only solution remains is the judiciary but unfortunately our establishment has also corrupted the judiciary. look i m living in europe for quite a long time and over here every thing is so fair. no one is above the law here. the only reason one can qoet is because judiciary is independent and empowered here. these people are not angles that they cannot do wrong. but they cannt do wrong cos law doesnot allow them to do so.

in my openion the only solution to the problems is the empowerment of judiciary. all the ill legal thinngs are made legal by corrupt judiciary. once we will have honest judges who will make fair decisions no one can do anything wrong.

look what happened in justice iftikharz case. establishment wanted to have the supreme power and challanged the power of judiciary and created all the mess. the current govt. is so much afraid of the fair judiciary that they are not restoring the prev. ones becaurse they themselve are corrupt.

in conclusion i must say i dont hate pakistani army but the only political wing of army which causes are problems.


peace!
 

ashfak143

Voter (50+ posts)
mr musharraf ! u r responsible for all the problems pakistan is facing at the moment. zardari is one of the biggest problems in pakistan and if i m not wrong musharraf paved the way for him to be the president of this country. it makes me laugh " musharraf is fighting pakistan's case on CNN"........