Heaven is a fairy tale, says physicist Hawking

jahanzaibi

Senator (1k+ posts)
I agree with you but i want to add something there is a verse in quran the meaning of translation is something like "leave me and to whome i created alone" you cant image what is the tone of this verse if you read it in arabic and you know it ... the thing is that every one will be answer to his own deeds.. you have quran and hadith and there are mullas who have real knowledge see if we involve ourself in those currpt mulla then we are the one who will be looser because on the judgement day the question will be ask alone.

as far as this reactionay to theism is concern .. there is a verse in quran the meaning of translation is something like "this is a reminder for all worlds" it means that if they
are not listing then no problum someone else will listen and he will get benifit from it.
Dear jahanzaibi, the truth is that atheism is reactionary to theism and theism is not result of divine revelation but make belief.

If people turn deen in to religion and then turn religion in to matter of blind faith then no wonder that educated people are not going to accept it and religious people cannot convince them otherwise because they have no ground to stand upon.

This is why we muslims are to blame for being so silly that we have accepted the quran as explained by the uneducated people on the rendering of imperial mullas.

Unless we rethink our own position regarding the quran we are not fit for condemning anyone else for being wrong about the quran. After all who wants to accept a childish book full of fairy stories as divine message?

The quran is rendered into childish book by none other than muslims. Pick up any translation or interpretation of the quran we have the very same propblem in almost all of them. On top of this if anyone tries to change this state of affairs then he is picking a fight with mullas.

The question is how to get out of this state of affairs? Only when people have the proper rendering of the quran that reflects its actual message that world will come to see the quran for what it really is.

May be till then we can keep on condemning kaafirs for our failures just to make ourselves feel better.

regards and all the best.
 

Jack Sparrow

Minister (2k+ posts)
Quran has revealed absolute facts about Universe in its true perspective some 1400 years ago. This can be a fruit of thought for us. Surrah Al-Mulk - THE SOVEREIGNTY- No. 67- Verse:3-4 (If you want to see how wonderfully this programme functions and how His sovereignty and protection work in absolute harmony, then take a look at the gigantic machinery of the universe.) He has made the various heavenly bodies in outer space in a way that they can maintain complete conformity (and not collide) with each other.Have a good look all around. You will not find any defect or disproportions in the creation of 'Ar-Rahman'. Not once. But look again and again and reflect deeply over it. You will not see any flaws or fissures anywhere. Nothing will be out of sequence or incomplete. verse 3


Turn your vision again towards the vastness of the universe. Do so yet again; and everytime your gaze will fall back upon you, dazzled and tired. (This is the scenario of Our universe which is working according to Our Laws. If the Divine System is introduced in your own society, you too will find such harmony, instead of chaos and disorder.) verse 4
Surrah An-Naml - THE ANT - No. 27- Verse:93 And tell them, "(You can go on opposing it to any extent, but the Divine System will be established.) This will be a living example for praise and appreciation of God. It will bring its clear signs before you in such a way that you will yourself recognize (that this is the same society, about which you were being told). (On the other hand the destruction that will befall you will be the result of your own doing, because) The Divine Law of Mukafat, knows very well all your deeds."
verse 93
Surrah Nh - NUH - No. 71- Verse:15 &16 - 19 & 20 (You should observe the balance and harmony that is created when the Divine Laws are followed!) Do you not see how Allah Almighty the Almighty has created various celestial bodies in outer space and how they move in harmony and discipline. They remain firm in their orbits inspite of the tremendous speed with which they move. This is because they do not exist individually. The pull of one becomes a source of stability for the other and in this way the entire celestial system can continue functioning without a clash. On the contrary, visualize your own life and see how your individual interests clash with each other. verse 15


And then how (among these bodies) He has positioned the moon amongst them, as a (reflected) light and the sun as a (radiant) lamp. (But look how dark your life is. Should you also choose to follow the Divine Law, then not only would it brighten your path but you will also become a beacon for others.) verse 16


(He created you on this earth and at the same time, produced a variety of subsistence for you. Firstly) Just think of the earth which, inspite of it being spherical, He made it into a wide expanse so that you may go out wherever you like on its open and spacious paths. verse 19-20
Surrah An-Naba'-THE ANNOUNCEMENT-Verse:12-13 &17 And over your head, in the vast open space, We have distributed celestial bodies which are firm and stable. verse 12


Amongst these look at the brightly burning lamp (the Sun) and see how We have made it a simultaneous source of light and heat. verse 13


(When you see how wonderfully Our Laws operate in the outer universe, you should understand that Our Law of Mukafat is similarly functioning in your world. Therefore) It is absolutely certain that the Revolution that will sift falsehood from truth, is bound to happen. Consider it to be the day for harvesting the crop which your deeds had sown. Just like how the time for the ripening of a crop is certain and determined, the time of this Revolution is also fixed. It will occur when its predestined time comes. verse 17
Surrah Al-Furqn -THE STANDARD - No. 25- Verse:61-62 (Now who should tell them that) The God who in order to provide you natural light has in some parts in the sky placed constellations of heavenly bodies which look like chandeliers of shining stars; and at another place put a candle in the shape of sun; and the light-reflecting moon at yet another; is the same God who has provided Wahi for the guidance of human intellect and wisdom. verse 61


And that God has made arrangements in the outer universe that night and day succeed each other, and that light continues to follow darkness. (Similarly, in the human world, He has made arrangements that no nation would remain in darkness forever and that the light of Wahi should reach everyone.) Whoever wants to follow the right path in the light of Wahi should be able to do so and thus receive full reward for his efforts and deeds. verse 62
Surrah Y*Sn - YA-SEEN - No. 36- Verse:38-40 & 45 Also ponder how the sun is moving unhampered in its course. All this is happening according to measures determined and set by the One Who is Almighty and all-knowing. All His Laws are based on knowledge. verse 38


And see the moon for which We have determined various stages. (It appears like a beautiful crescent and then gradually becomes the full moon, after which it starts waning till it becomes like an old date stalk, dried up and curved.) verse 39


All these huge heavenly bodies are not static in space, but are in continuous motion. However, all their movements are according to a discipline based on set measures and calculations. It can never happen that the sun, by speeding up, can overtake the moon; or that the night lingers on beyond the point where the day had to start (meaning that the sun rises little after the appointed time). No, this never happens. Each and every one of them keeps moving through space, in its own orbit, according to the speed and course set for it (21:33). verse 40


(Just as there are unchangeable Laws for things in the universe, laws are also fixed for mankind. But contrary to other things in the universe, man has been given the freedom of choice. He could, out of his free will, either obey or go against them.)Keeping this discretion in mind, they are advised to lead their lives according to the Divine Laws, so that their present life would become better; and also to adopt the same attitude for the future. In this way both your physical life as well as your own ‘self’would develop nicely. This is what is meant by the pleasantries of the present and the future.
verse 45

Surrah Ibrahm - ABRAHAM - No. 14 - Verse:32-34 (32-34) In this way that Niz’am-e-Rabubiyyat shall be established in the human world the means for which have already been provided by Allah Almighty in the outer universe. He has created the heavens and the earth and poured rain from the skies whereby grow fruits for your subsistence. He has subjected to you the ships which sail in the seas according to His Laws and also the rivers. Also subjected to you are the sun and the moon which move in their constant courses as well as the day and the night. He has provided you with all that was necessary for your development. In short, Allah’s bounties are so numerous that it is not possible to count them. But those who do not follow Allah’s Laws hide these bounties from others and also seize what others have. verse 32-34
Surrah Ynus - JONAH - No. 10 - Verse: 5 & 7-10 He has designed the sun as shining glow and the moon which reflects light and appointed stages for the moon so that you may reckon time and mark the number of years. Allah Almighty has not created this otherwise than in accordance with truth (to fulfil a definite purpose according to His plans). He explains His laws clearly to a people of understanding.
verse 5


(7-10) Human beings may be divided into three categories. (1) The first two are those who have no knowledge of the universality of the laws of Allah, and (2) those who acquire this knowledge and conquer the forces of nature but believe that life is only of this world and are content with this life. The ultimate destination of those who belong to these two categories is Jahannam. The third category comprises people who believe in Allah Almighty and the life hereafter, conquer the forces of nature and utilize them for the benefit of mankind in accordance with eternal values prescribed by Allah. These people will lead the blissful life of Jannat wherein streams flow. Their lives will be a living testimony that Allah Almighty has not created the universe in vain or for destructive purposes (3/189-191). In their society each person will desire the welfare of all others. This is how they will proclaim the Hamd of Allah Almighty - the Nourisher of all humanity (1/1). verse 7-10
Surrah Ash-Shams - THE SUN - No. 91 - Verse:1-2 & 9 Consider the sun and its radiant brilliance. verse 1


The moon and its pursuit of the sun to receive its light. verse 2


(The total programme functioning in the cosmic world and human self stand testimony to the fact that) Whosoever nurtured and developed his self, did indeed attain success. verse 9
Surrah Al-Baqarah - THE COW - No.2 - Verse:116 - 117 116-117 Ask the Christians: “How can you justify your belief in Allah Almighty when you conceive Him as having a son. You have brought Allah Almighty to the level of human beings who stand in need of progeny as helpers. Nay, He is far above this concept. His is, all that is in the heavens and the earth and everything therein devoutly follows His Laws. Allah Almighty is Omnipotent and has brought such a colossal universe into existence from nothingness. His manner of creation is that when He decides to create a particular thing, the process of its coming into existence begins at once.” The possessor of such powers has no requirement for a son.
verse 116-117
Surrah Al-An'm - THE CATTLE - No.6 - Verse:14 - 15 14-15) Ask them: “Do you want that I should take as protector and helper anyone other than Allah Almighty - Allah Almighty who has brought the entire universe into being from nothingness; who provides nourishment to all but Himself needs none.” Say: “I have been commanded to be the first of those who surrender before Allah’s laws and not to be one of the Mushrikeen. Tell them: “If I revolted against Allah’s laws, I too would be fearful of chastisement on the Day of Reckoning” (10/15, 39/13).
verse 14-15 Surrah Fussilat - EXPLAINED IN DETAIL - No.41 - Verse:11-12 In this way the Almighty turned towards the celestial bodies. At that stage they were all in the form of gas (nebula). We told them, "You must obey Our Laws willingly or perforce." They replied, "Why perforce? We shall obey these Laws most willingly.1" (3:82; 13:15)
verse 11


(As has been said above ~ in 41:9 ~ that in two stages the Almighty created celestial bodies in the form they were designed to be; and He imparted to them the physical law which they were bound to follow through Wahi (i.e. the Laws they had to follow were integrated within them). The visible space (the sky) has been adorned with scattered bodies that appear to you like shining lamps. He has made them safe and secure so that they neither clash with each other nor fall down on you. All this has been decided with measures set by that God, Who is all-powerful, all-knowing. verse 12
Surrah Al-Anbiy -THE PROPHETS-No.21-Verse:30 -31 & 33 (Out of their sheer ignorance some people take natural phenomena as deities or divinities. This is despite the fact the entire continuum of the universe has been created by Allah Almighty and remains fervently in action according to His given programme. At present various phenomena in the universe appear to them as functioning separately from one another, but) Do they not seriously understand that in the initial stages of creation all of them were one mass which We then parted, so that the various celestial bodies started floating in their own orbits (21:33; 36:40). (Take for example the planet earth. In its initial stages it separated from the original mass, just like a stone thrown out from a catapult ~ 79:30.) Later (when the earth became ready to bear or produce living things) We started life from water. (All living things are created from a mixture of water ~ 24:45. And over this fountain of life Allah Almighty has kept His own control ~ 11:7.)It is strange that even after all this explanation, they do not believe that only Allah Almighty wields absolute sovereignty over everything in the universe. verse 30


And We have made earth such that as it continuously revolves, people live on it undisturbed (16:15). Furthermore on it we made firm mountains (which function like water reservoirs and hold minerals for your use); and valleys and ravines which are used as passageways.
verse 31


It is Allah Almighty Who has made night and day follow each other (due to the revolution of the earth) and created the sun and the moon, each one floating through space in its own orbit. verse 33
Surrah Al-A'rf - THE HEIGHTS - No.7 - Verse:54 O Messenger! tell them that your Rabb is the One who has created the universe in six aeons and kept His control over it (10/3). In accordance with His laws, the planets revolve in such a way that day and night succeed each other in quick succession. The sun, moon and other stars also obey His orders. Take note! The domains of Khalq and Amr both belong to Allah, Who is the source of all blessings and Rabb of all the worlds. verse 54 Surrah Ash-Shra - COUNCIL- No.42 - Verse:29 (His Laws of nature are not confined to earth. They encompass the whole universe. That is why) Among His signs are the very creation of earth and other celestial bodies, as well as other living creatures which He has spread over them. At present these habitations are separated from one another but when He so wishes, Allah Almighty The Almighty has the power to bring them together. (It is possible that creatures living on different planets can establish contact and meet with each other ~ 116:49.) verse 29 Surrah Al-Anbiy - THE PROPHETS - No.21 - Verse:16 (They thought that) We have created this heaven and earth and all that is in between (the universe) just for fun; an idle play. No, not at all! We have created all this for a great purpose. And the purpose is that no work would be done without producing a result, whether it involves a person or a nation. All actions will continue producing very accurate results (11:71; 45:22 ; 53:31). verse 16 Surrah Al-Jthiya - CROUCHING - No.45 - Verse:22 They do not know that Allah Almighty has created the universe for a purpose (and not as a useless and destructive thing. The purpose is that) Every human being is fully recompensed for what he has done; and no harm is done to anyone. verse 22 Surrah Y*Sn - YA-SEEN - No.36 - Verse:38-40 Also ponder how the sun is moving unhampered in its course. All this is happening according to measures determined and set by the One Who is Almighty and all-knowing. All His Laws are based on knowledge. verse 38


And see the moon for which We have determined various stages. (It appears like a beautiful crescent and then gradually becomes the full moon, after which it starts waning till it becomes like an old date stalk, dried up and curved.)
verse 39


All these huge heavenly bodies are not static in space, but are in continuous motion. However, all their movements are according to a discipline based on set measures and calculations. It can never happen that the sun, by speeding up, can overtake the moon; or that the night lingers on beyond the point where the day had to start (meaning that the sun rises little after the appointed time). No, this never happens. Each and every one of them keeps moving through space, in its own orbit, according to the speed and course set for it (21:33). verse 40 Surrah Al-Anbiy - THE PROPHETS - No.21 - Verse:32-33 And over the earth We created an atmosphere which is safe in itself and which keeps the inhabitants protected[2] (from the destruction caused by meteors falling from above). These are all open visible signs (pointing to the reality that all physical things are working under the Divine Laws; and that no one else has any power or authority over them). Inspite of this, people insist on turning away from these facts.
verse 32


It is Allah Almighty Who has made night and day follow each other (due to the revolution of the earth) and created the sun and the moon, each one floating through space in its own orbit.
verse 33 Surrah Az-Zumar - THE TROOPS - No.39 - Verse:5 He created the heavens and the earth in true and perfect proportions, to bring out positive and constrictive results. He made the earth revolve in such a manner that the night blankets the day and the day covers the night. He has made the sun and the moon subservient to His Laws. Each heavenly body follows a set course, up to a limited time. All this is happening according to the Laws of Allah, Who has absolute control and supremacy and has the provisions for protecting everything. (So why should He have a son?) verse 5 Surrah Luqmn - LUQMAN - No.31 - Verse:29 Just as your limited vision sees individuals separately and not humanity at large, you see every event on its own and not as a single, indivisible whole. For instance, you see night as one unit and day as another; but you do not reflect on how Allah's Law (of rotation) merges the night into day and the day into night. (Thus day and night become one indivisible unit.) Like the rotation of day and night, He has also subjected the sun and the moon to His Laws, each running its course for a set term (13:2). verse 29 Surrah ’Ale-Imran-THE FAMILY OF IMRAN-Verse:189-190 In the creation of the earth and the heavens and the alternation of night and day, there are signs for those gifted with understanding. These people keep Allah’s Laws in mind whilst standing, sitting or reclining. After reflecting upon the creation of the heavens and the earth, they cry out, “O our Sustainer! You have not created this Universe in vain or for destructive purposes. Your Schemes of things are much above flaw. Grant us the insight to understand the functioning of these things, so that we benefit from them and remain safe from suffering.”
verse 189-190
Surrah Ar-Rahmn - THE BENEFICENT - No.55 - Verse: 5 - 7 And for human guidance there are unchangeable laws in the Quran; just as there are laws in force in outer universe according to which (for example) the sun and the moon follow their determined orbits. verse 5


And on earth, whether they are large trees or small bushes or shrubs, everything is subjected to His Laws.
verse 6


Moreover the Divine Law according to which He maintains such precise balance, mutual discipline and order amongst all heavenly bodies placed in the huge outer space was set in way that it never changes. verse 7 Surrah Az-Zriyt -THE WINNOWING WINDS -No.51-Verse:4 7 (This is Our Law of Mukafat, under which earlier communities came to such an end. Everything in this universe is busy making the Divine Law effective. That is why) With Our power and strength We have built the universe that is spread out in the cosmos. The expanse of Our power has no boundaries. verse 47
 

Imranpak

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
The man's reaction is obviously due to his anger over his illness! Many people of all religion's in the world become atheists after having seen great suffering, war, hate and hardship. They question that why is the merciful God as he calls himself so cruel to his beings!!?

As a Muslim i believe in what we've been told in the Holy Qur'an that there will be "many trials and tribulations in life". It's not as if atheists are exempt from disease or other forms of suffering. He's in no position to comment on the existence of a heaven or hell until he's passed on to the next life.
 

Narcissist

Banned
A gentleman had posted the definition of heaven on this forum. It says people there will be 60 feet tall, they will all look the same, diner will be served by 70 boys, dates will be foot long, will not pass stool or urinate it will come out of skin as fragrance. It will have rivers of Honey, Milk, alcohol and water.

He said there are eight different levels of it.

And people will ride unicorn there, too. Heaven is fairy tale for elders who think they will turn into gold some day in future. Ultimate peace is in non existence not in heavens.
 

Narcissist

Banned
For a simple mind, religion is umbrella to cover difficult questioning,... that's why Lenin's analogy of religion with opium is right in a sense. So easy way to go, invent a all powerful agency that can do all the thing one cannot understand...and call that agency ''God'' as James ***** says.
Medically soul is not proven, so I don't know what part of us will go to heavens.

 

shamsheer

Senator (1k+ posts)
The problem with athiests is they like to beleive everything that their ancestors have proved without going deep into it, but when it comes to religion they start questioning everything. The divine concepts whether they belong to any religion apparently comes from a source that is incomprehensible for human being with their normal senses. Take from example physics. There are numerous concepts in physics that are based on mere theories and yet we believe them because we can somehow capture them in our mathematical formulas or based on some complex observations we can convince our minds that those theories are indeed OK.
Take for example the LHC experiment. Billions of dollars have been spent to prove the existance of Higgin's particles with the expectation that those particles will behave exactly as explained by Higgin. Has any body on earth ever seen them or felt their existance?
However, an athiest can argue that we do not care much about them becuase they do not dictate us how to live our life, but they are mere steps towards exploration of the reality.
The concepts of Heaven and Hell are similar concepts. We are not muslims becuase we believe in heaven or hell, we are not muslims becuase we keep beard, do not eat pork, do not drink or pray five times a day. Muslims are muslims becuase of their belief in Quran as Prophet Muhammad PBUH is not with us any more. We cannot physically see him to believe him. Quran it self poses the biggest challenge to the present day scientist or athiest to prove that anything scientifically or logically is incorrect in that book. If they review it unbiased they can found out the following

1- Nothing that quran said scientifically was ever proved wrong
2- It has not changed in the last 1500 years as claimed by the book it self

What ever is given in Quran is way above and beyond the mental capabilities of human being of that time. So how could Muhammad PBUH come up with such a master piece? For the starters take him as the smartest person ever existed on earth and follow him. Some anti islamist argue that he took most of the sceintific concepts from Greeks and romans. How he was succesfully able to eliminate their wrong scientific concepts and only took the right ones, if they had those? If any body remember greeks beleive that the universe is made up of earth, water, air and fire and the existance of ether in the outer atmosphere. Once we believe that Quran is a divine book, that is from where we accept and believe the other concepts without questioning them.
Since Einstein was a greatest scientist of all times, we tend to believe everything that he said but it turned out that not everything that he said was correct. But one the other hand we have incessantly observed that what ever quran said always proved to be correct. At every new juncture of human progress/development we point figures at different concepts laid out by the Divine book and we later on see that the Book was correct and human knowledge was limited. But still the athiest or anti Islamists keep doing it.
In my opinion Muslims are responsible for this dilema. They have failed to convey the message and explain the book to the humanity. They are more interested in having fun, passing remarks, proving one self better than other muslims in a daily conversation, hoarding more money, eating better food, running after beautiful ladies etc. Our job was to understand the Quran, earn the knowledge and be able to answer the questions beings raised by scientifically smarter human race. Muslims have a battle at hand, earn the wordly knowledge and learn the concepts of quran and then prepare themselves to be the true ambassadors of Islam.
 

fahid_asif

Senator (1k+ posts)
science believes on facts and causes. It has explained so much about facts of life but never talked on the causes life on earth. Why there is life? On the other hand religion, mainly Islam, explains so much about Cause of life on earth. So i want to ask that science is unable to explain the life in terms of its origin, so why you interfere about its end? Science is systematic subject. And about this theory, what are observations, hypothesis, deductions, etc? Direct theory? It is injustice both with religion and science. You use a bit of religion to explain the start of life ( A vital force is present in universe which controls it) and when you come to an end, you use science?
I read a post that presence of soul has been rejected. I would say science is still unable to talk about this. You know there was a time when people say that living matter cannot be produced artificially, but now everything is under production. So wait for upcoming time.




MONH NA PAI, THO KAURI. (GRAPES ARE SOUR)
 

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