Comparing Indians, Pakistanis, Bengalis, Afghans and Egyptians in the United States - Excellent arti

modern.fakir

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Ofcourse...their is no alternative for hard work.. we do need to get more institutions like Oxford, cambridge and Harvard and we also need to work more in R&D and technological areas and we are progressing but Alhamodlillah NEVER at the expense of our deen.

Thanks for your positive comments brother!


You rightly said it. Thats one of the factor, that puts us behind the indians, I work at Pwc London, i have seen this, the kind of mingling between the indians and british will make u surprise, drinking, get together and dating. Thats tells alot, the british love them for being socialized with them. But to some extent i also believe that if you are technically good enough at your job or creative in your field. You can overcome that issue as a muslim. There is only one solution to that we as Pakistani need to work hard in education and R&D.Pakistan need houndreds of new universities advanced in hightech. With the likes of IIT, if we have that kind of institutions and without any political interference i believe we have very talented students in our country, all we need is commitment, dedication, hardwork and most importantly we need to have more R&D centers.
 

-CSIS-

Voter (50+ posts)
Indians and their culture is taking over the west specifically US. - Read This


We Are All Hindus Now - Lisa Miller

Aug 14, 2009 8:00 PM EDT

America is not a Christian nation. We are, it is true, a nation founded by Christians, and according to a 2008 survey, 76 percent of us continue to identify as Christian (still, that's the lowest percentage in American history). Of course, we are not a Hindu—or Muslim, or Jewish, or Wiccan—nation, either. A million-plus Hindus live in the United States, a fraction of the billion who live on Earth. But recent poll data show that conceptually, at least, we are slowly becoming more like Hindus and less like traditional Christians in the ways we think about God, our selves, each other, and eternity.


The Rig Veda, the most ancient Hindu scripture, says this: "Truth is One, but the sages speak of it by many names." A Hindu believes there are many paths to God. Jesus is one way, the Qur'an is another, yoga practice is a third. None is better than any other; all are equal. The most traditional, conservative Christians have not been taught to think like this. They learn in Sunday school that their religion is true, and others are false. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father except through me."

Americans are no longer buying it. According to a 2008 Pew Forum survey, 65 percent of us believe that "many religions can lead to eternal life"—including 37 percent of white evangelicals, the group most likely to believe that salvation is theirs alone. Also, the number of people who seek spiritual truth outside church is growing. Thirty percent of Americans call themselves "spiritual, not religious," according to a 2009 NEWSWEEK Poll, up from 24 percent in 2005. Stephen Prothero, religion professor at Boston University, has long framed the American propensity for "the divine-deli-cafeteria religion" as "very much in the spirit of Hinduism. You're not picking and choosing from different religions, because they're all the same," he says. "It isn't about orthodoxy. It's about whatever works. If going to yoga works, great—and if going to Catholic mass works, great. And if going to Catholic mass plus the yoga plus the Buddhist retreat works, that's great, too."

Then there's the question of what happens when you die. Christians traditionally believe that bodies and souls are sacred, that together they comprise the "self," and that at the end of time they will be reunited in the Resurrection. You need both, in other words, and you need them forever. Hindus believe no such thing. At death, the body burns on a pyre, while the spirit—where identity resides—escapes. In reincarnation, central to Hinduism, selves come back to earth again and again in different bodies. So here is another way in which Americans are becoming more Hindu: 24 percent of Americans say they believe in reincarnation, according to a 2008 Harris poll. So agnostic are we about the ultimate fates of our bodies that we're burning them—like Hindus—after death. More than a third of Americans now choose cremation, according to the Cremation Association of North America, up from 6 percent in 1975. "I do think the more spiritual role of religion tends to deemphasize some of the more starkly literal interpretations of the Resurrection," agrees Diana Eck, professor of comparative religion at Harvard. So let us all say "om."


http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2009/08/14/we-are-all-hindus-now.html
 
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bhaibarood

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
DAWN.COM Blog Archive Dollars and sense of American desis


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Immigrants born in India outdo others in achieving economic success in the United States. Pakistan-born immigrants, while trailing behind Indians, do better than the native-born Americans.

The estimates reported in the 2010 American Community Survey revealed that the median salaried household income of India-born immigrants was around $94,700. In comparison, the median household income of native-born Americans was estimated at $51,750. Unlike the Pakistan-born immigrants in Canada, who lagged behind others in economic prosperity, Pakistanis in America are relatively thriving where the median household income of Pakistan-born immigrants is 18 per cent higher than that of the native-born Americans.

The American Community Survey for 2010 (latest data available from the US Census Bureau) reveal that amongst South Asians living in the US, India-born immigrants are far ahead of Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, and Afghanis. Even when compared with immigrants from Egypt, a country known for supplying highly educated immigrants to the US, Indians report exceptionally higher indicators of economic progress.

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Source: American Community Survey, 2010


Indian-born immigrants also reported one of the lowest poverty rates at 4 per cent. Afghanistan-born immigrants reported the highest poverty rate where one in five Afghan immigrants was deemed below the poverty line in the US. While Pakistan-born immigrants reported higher median household incomes than the native-born Americans, surprisingly 14 per cent of the Pakistan-born immigrants were below the poverty line compared to only 9.4 per cent of the native-born Americans.

Another indicator of financial distress amongst households in North America is the percentage of household income spent on gross rent. Households spending 30 per cent or more of household income on rent are considered financially distressed. Amongst households who live in rental units, 57 per cent of the immigrants from Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Egypt spent more than 30 per cent of the household income on rent compared to only 24 per cent of immigrants from India.

murtaza_blog_2.jpg

Source: American Community Survey, 2010


These poverty statistics raise several questions. For instance, despite having similar South Asian heritage, Pakistan-born immigrants report a 2.4-times higher rate of poverty than their Indian counterparts.
Furthermore, poverty among younger cohorts (18 years old or younger) is even worse amongst immigrants from Pakistan than from India. At the same time almost 50 per cent of under-18 Afghan immigrants are reportedly below the poverty line in the US. These statistics necessitate the need to explore the reasons behind disparities amongst immigrants from South Asia.

I am presenting here a socio-economic comparison of South Asians in the US. I have restricted the reporting to immigrants from India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Afghanistan. This is done because India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, and to some extent Afghanistan have more in common in culture and recent history than other countries in South Asia. I have thrown in Egypt for good measure to serve as a control for immigrants from another Muslim country with a different cultural background.

The purpose of this comparative review is to determine what are the reasons behind the success of India-born immigrants in the US. Could it be that the immigrants from India had luck on their side, or could it be that Indian immigrants possessed the necessary ingredients to succeed in the highly competitive labour market in the United States. More importantly, one needs to explore why immigrants from Pakistan and Bangladesh lag behind those from India in achieving the same levels of economic success.


Sizing the South Asians
:
With approximately 1.8 million individuals, India-born immigrants form the largest cohort amongst South Asians in the US. The American Community Survey (ACS) in 2010 estimated Pakistan-born immigrants at 300,000, Bangladesh-born immigrants at 153,000, and Afghanistan-born immigrants at 60,000. Egypt-born immigrants totalled 133,000. Immigrants from India were approximately five-times the size of Pakistan-born immigrants. The relatively large size of Indian immigrants leads to larger social networks, which help with searching for better employment prospects.

Despite their large size, most India-born immigrants in the US are recent arrivals. Whereas 47 per cent of the India-born immigrants arrived in the US after 2000, only 36 per cent of the Pakistan-born immigrants arrived after 2000. This suggests that the economic success of immigrants from India is driven by the recent arrivals. Relatively speaking, immigrants from Afghanistan have enjoyed the longest tenure in the US of all South Asian countries discussed here. Notice that while 42 per cent of immigrants from Afghanistan arrived in the US before 1980, only 25 per cent of the Indian immigrants accomplished the same.

murtaza_blog_3.jpg

Source: American Community Survey, 2010



Pakistanis have larger families:

With 4.3 persons per households, immigrants from Pakistan and Afghanistan reported significantly larger family sizes. In comparison, the native-born population reported a household size of 2.6 persons whereas the size of India-born immigrant households was around 3.5 persons. The difference between immigrants from India and other South Asians is more pronounced when one looks at the per capita earnings. Owing to their smaller household size, immigrants from India reported significantly higher per capita incomes than the rest. For instance, Bangladesh-born immigrants reported 50% less in median per capita income than those from India. And while immigrants from Pakistan reported higher household incomes than the immigrants from Egypt, the larger household size of Pakistan-born immigrants brought their per capita incomes lower than that of Egyptians.

Larger household size results in overcrowding, especially amongst low-income households, who often live in rental units. The average household size of rental households from Pakistan was found to be 33 per cent larger than the same from immigrants from India. Fifteen per cent of households from Pakistan were found to have more than one occupant on average per room compared to only 6 per cent of those from India.


Women in the labour force:
A key source of distinction between the immigrants from India and other South Asians is the higher participation of Indian women in the labour force. A much higher integration of women in the labour force is one of the reasons why immigrants from India have fared much better than others in the United States. Consider that only 42 per cent of the women from Pakistan were active in the labour force in the US compared to 57 per cent women from India. In fact women from Pakistan reportedly the lowest participation in the labour force in the US falling behind women from Egypt, Afghanistan , and Bangladesh.


Education matters the most:
It should come as no surprise that immigrants from India are one of the most educated cohort in the United States. Almost 42 per cent of immigrants from India over the age of 25 reported having a graduate (Masters) or a professional degree. In comparison, only 10 per cent of the native-born adults reported having a graduate or professional degree. Approximately 23 per cent of adult immigrants from Egypt and Pakistan reported having a graduate or professional degree.

The correlation between higher education attainment and higher median household incomes is explicitly presented in the graph below. India-born immigrants with professional degrees also reported significantly higher incomes than the rest. In comparison, immigrants from Afghanistan with one of the lowest incidence of professional degrees reportedly the lowest median household incomes.

murtaza_blog_4.jpg

Source: American Community Survey, 2010


The gender divide is again instrumental between immigrants from India and the rest. Whereas 70 per cent of the India-born female adults reported having a Bachelors degree or higher, only 46 per cent of adult females born in Pakistan reported the same in the US. At the same time only 28 per cent of the native-born female adults in the US reported completing university education.


Better education better careers:
The education attainment levels amongst adult immigrants determine, to a large, extent their career choices. University education resulting in professional or graduate degrees allows immigrants to qualify for well-paying jobs in the US. Immigrants from India have been able to use their high-quality education to make inroads in the high-paying employment market. One is therefore hardly surprised to see that of the adult employed population, 70 per cent immigrants from India are working in occupations focusing on management, business, science, and arts. In comparison, only 44 per cent of immigrants from Pakistan ad 33 per cent immigrants from Bangladesh are employed in similar occupations.


What have we learnt:
Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!
In 1883, Emma Lazarus asked for the tired, the poor, and the wretched refuse. India instead sent its very best to the United States. Instead of the huddled masses, graduates from Indian Institutes of Technology and Management arrived in hundreds of thousands at the American shores. These immigrants were products of a sophisticated higher education system whose foundations were laid by Pandit Nehru in early fifties.

In the rest of South Asia, especially in Pakistan and Bangladesh, education has never been a national priority. The results of such conflicting priorities are obvious. Graduates from Indian universities are outdoing others in competitivelabour markets at home and abroad.

If education is not made a national priority, the gap between Indians and other South Asians will grow at home and in diaspora.

Murtaza Haider, Ph.D. is the Associate Dean of research and graduate programs at the Ted Rogers School of Management at Ryerson University in Toronto. He can be reached by email at [email protected]
YAR APP KA HAR ARTICLE BARA ZABADAST HOTA HAI! TOO MUCH OBJECTIVE AND FOCUSED!
NO BS IS EVER FOUND IN YOUR ARTICLES ,DONT YOU CONSIDER THAT I AM BUTTERING YOU UP! AS YOU ARE NOT A CHICK :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
REALLY NICE WORK BRO ! KEEP IT UP! BTW YAR YEH LANATI WALI BAAT KO HATADO ,EVEN THOUGH HE IS LANATI BUT YOUR OBJECTIVITY AS WRITER IS DAMAGED BY THAT NOTION,OR YOU SHOULD WRITE AN ARITCLE ABOUT WHY HE IS LANATI ,WITH GOOD HOME WORK .
 

Unicorn

Banned
You guys remember that scene from the movie "300" where the old wise man checks the baby for deficiencies & if found, the baby would be tossed out.. I wish there was a way to find mental retardation in adults and maybe we could toss them out in front of a bus.. like literally.

This whole idea of exponential growth as an economic model is a scam. Natural resources do not grow exponentially. Land doesnt get cultivated exponentially. These are limited resources. Sure, they played this "growth" game to keep their monetary debt from going bad. Rent-seekers piggy backed on growth as collateral for the validity of debt. The uneducated have walked right into their trap.

What Unicorn shared, is very similar to scenes in the US slums. single mothers with kids. on welfare. no education. They will continue to produce till they drop dead. Someone forgot to tell them we are humans and not rabbits.

Very wise response. We as individuals have much more responsibility to act wisely than to rely on the state to solve our problems most of the broblems should not be there to begin with.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
There is another factor in the mix which the writer did not include in his blog which is networking. Indians are united and we are divided. Instead of helping each other we pull each others leg.

The writer did take this into account when he mentioned that larger population size allows more net working,Just for the record.
 

Unicorn

Banned
Okay - you made me break my promise to myself. I had promised that I will never engage in a conversation with you given what happened the last time.

I would like to keep it short and sweet.

To begin with, what you have written shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. If history is any indication then I am not at all surprised at the narrow and biased views that you presented.

I can elaborate - break it down and sprinkle it with first hand personal experiences debunking your wildly fantastical theories but I know that it will have no impact and you will take the conversation in a completely different direction which would have nothing to do with the topic we are discussing.

I am going to give you a brotherly advice - stick to the topics that you have first hand knowledge about.

In fact could you explain whats so haraam about cooped up in a cube developing software? In case you are wondering why am I asking you this - it would explain that you have no grasp of the topic you are talking about.

@AsifAmeer

[MENTION=13572]modern fakir[/MENTION] is a deck of cards with missing aces. He is a cheap vacuum cleaner that makes lot of noise but no suction.[hilar]
 

only_truths

Minister (2k+ posts)
I am sure if you look at the detailed breakdown of fertility rates of families in different income strata in India and among the educated vs uneducated the ones with higher income levels and who are educated definitely have smaller family sizes. The Indians in the USA are educated and well off and hence you see "do bachay he achay" :-)

The new Indians have no time to .......and make bachay, because all the time they are thinking of how to make more money?
 

mrk123

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Not sure if thats the reason but since you are an indian I wouldn't argue with you about this - you would know better ;-)

The new Indians have no time to .......and make bachay, because all the time they are thinking of how to make more money?
 

desicad

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
The new Indians have no time to .......and make bachay, because all the time they are thinking of how to make more money?

Not sure if thats the reason but since you are an indian I wouldn't argue with you about this - you would know better ;-)
Man its not about time........:)........they believe in small families.......chota parivaar sukhii parivaar......
 

only_truths

Minister (2k+ posts)
YAR APP KA HAR ARTICLE BARA ZABADAST HOTA HAI! TOO MUCH OBJECTIVE AND FOCUSED!
NO BS IS EVER FOUND IN YOUR ARTICLES ,DONT YOU CONSIDER THAT I AM BUTTERING YOU UP! AS YOU ARE NOT A CHICK :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
REALLY NICE WORK BRO ! KEEP IT UP! BTW YAR YEH LANATI WALI BAAT KO HATADO ,EVEN THOUGH HE IS LANATI BUT YOUR OBJECTIVITY AS WRITER IS DAMAGED BY THAT NOTION,OR YOU SHOULD WRITE AN ARITCLE ABOUT WHY HE IS LANATI ,WITH GOOD HOME WORK .

According to my feeling the first generation Pakistanis who have immigrated to West are far more wealthier and educated than the second generation Pakistanis who have migrated for work with less proper education (not the kind of degree tho degree hote hain?)

I do not know this statistics include only naturalized Americans or include those with H1B or any other work permit visa in US?
 
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Imranpak

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Many if not most Pakistanis are overtly religious giving priority to Islamic activities even if they don't understand it's significance. Before anything else when a child comes from school our kids are told to get ready for Masjid or memorise the Qur'an.

Indian's in the west who are majority non-Muslim give priority to education so when a kid comes from school they're told to do their homework then study even more if need be. Religion for them is well down the list which is no bad thing!

It's not that Indian's are more intelligent but their priorities are different, they want to excel in this world so leave worrying about the afterlife when they have attained a meaningful qualification. By comparison Muslim's as a whole including those in India are overtly religious thereby suffer in other spheres of life, especially education.

We are too ritualistic having forgotten the words of our Prophet to "seek knowledge from the cradle to the grave". There is no lack of imam's or practising Muslim's in Pakistan or our expat community yet our country is a complete mess partly due to a lack of mainstream education, much isn't right in our society. Tell this to a Mullah and he'll accuse you of all sorts, there is much more to Islam then memorising the Qur'an or making prayer.

Good education will help you attract a great job that means money and wordly success!:)
 
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AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
You can butter me all you want. You see I dont do drugs and I dont do men. ;)

Bro, I am no writer or a professional public figure. Just a regular guy who enjoys financial matters. I share my 2 cents. People read it and make their own mind.

Honestly the reason why I started writing on PK economic affairs is because.
1. I was sick of PK media's incompetency and the lack of decent financial and economic journalism in Pk media.
2. Pakistan economy is easier to understand and analyze than the highly complex US financial and global markets.
3. Wanted Pakistanis to see a Libertarian point-of-view in social and economical aspects.

Other than that, I just a regular guy!

But if you insist, I can change the "Laanti" to this like

"Dhobhi ka Zardari - na ghar ka, na ghaat ka!"

Approved?

YAR APP KA HAR ARTICLE BARA ZABADAST HOTA HAI! TOO MUCH OBJECTIVE AND FOCUSED!
NO BS IS EVER FOUND IN YOUR ARTICLES ,DONT YOU CONSIDER THAT I AM BUTTERING YOU UP! AS YOU ARE NOT A CHICK :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
REALLY NICE WORK BRO ! KEEP IT UP! BTW YAR YEH LANATI WALI BAAT KO HATADO ,EVEN THOUGH HE IS LANATI BUT YOUR OBJECTIVITY AS WRITER IS DAMAGED BY THAT NOTION,OR YOU SHOULD WRITE AN ARITCLE ABOUT WHY HE IS LANATI ,WITH GOOD HOME WORK .
 
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AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
Yes you rubbed the shoulders the wrong way. Why do you have to bring religion in this matter?



Have i nipped it at the bud ?...Come on dude ..you cant knock us down by playing the race card for every argument you cant answer !.you want to know how many "Patels" own strip clubs ? and adult stores ?..I can turn around and call you a racist for picking on pakistanis from certain muslim sects and pinning down their actions on the silent majority !. But im not going to do that,owing to your bad perception of Muslim history.

The article is discussing people who have migrated to the US in the past decade ?...Isnt it a fact that people of other faiths dont have Muslims ethical issues ??...If this is construed as racist then so be it - a fact is a fact. I know so many things which people of other faiths can do which a Muslim cant, that doesnt mean their arent bad apples !

You need to understand that when a Boss calls his employee to go have beer with him a momin MUSLIM will never do that, and that has CONSEQUENCES - does this make sense to you ?

We cant open strip clubs - some idiots have ...but not the major majority. Also the main activity in a which a person indulges has to be Haram for an work to be construed so. Theirs a difference in driving a taxi and owning a strip club... the problem with you is a completely myopic understanding of religion coupled with general media bias ...which makes for poor arguments.

Their is moral superiority because Islam has forbidden all other activities considered as "fun". Now whether you accept it or not is YOUR PROBLEM- but the facts remain !
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
whats wrong with Indians making more money?

Honestly.. from personal experience.. I think there is this chunk of Pakistani community that is INSANELY rich.. and there is this huge chunk of Paki community that never leaves the American slums... Its the human culture and a mindset that doesnt change in 1 generation
Asif mein abb to bilkul comment nahi kia keroonga.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
here.. lemme help ya..


Freaky-Suicide-Handgun-Design-Looks-Very-Wrong-2.jpg


Ur welcome!

Its my promise to myself and I have the prerogative to annul it anytime I like it - thanks for your advice though. As you said you are writing in a public forum then I have the right to comment as I see fit. If you don't like it then pay heed to your own advice and ignore it.

I would gladly let @AsifAmeer handle it and pull his hair out in the end - I guess calling someone racist and distasteful has no effect on them. Do a favor to the general public on the forum and tell them that they are not allowed to respond to your comments unless you specifically address them. I don't see that you asked for permission to speak from Asif before you jumped in on the conversation. Do as you preach....
 

IndiaGuy

Senator (1k+ posts)
There is another factor in the mix which the writer did not include in his blog which is networking. Indians are united and we are divided. Instead of helping each other we pull each others leg.

Having said that, Indias are working hard to achieve that goal too..... look at Indian Politicians..
 

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