1 Question for PTI - Imran trash talks IMF & World Bank but his budget suggests otherwise

[Nice2MU]

Mein sirf itna keh raha houn that Imran should come clean and level with the people in an honest way. Either balance the budget, if not, then he should go out in the public and claim "We will kick out the IMF"

He is lying! You dont have a problem with that?

What is his lie?

If he says the deficit would be reduced to 4.5% (in their whole term) but on the same times he says that they would raise the tax net (without increase in Tax rate and I think every sincere & honest person can do it because Pakistanis want to give tax but not to the looters) and foreign investments especially Foreign Pakistanis.

 

[UKPakistani]

Mein sirf itna keh raha houn that Imran should come clean and level with the people in an honest way. Either balance the budget, if not, then he should go out in the public and claim "We will kick out the IMF"

He is lying! You dont have a problem with that?

If what you say is true, and for the sake of Pak,
I hope people relevant pay attention and find a way to deal with this possible deficit

Okay so tell us also. Is Pakistan's economy such a black hole that it is beyond recall.
There must be ways round this $10 bill deficit.

Surely there are alternative ways to raise this money,
AND supposing corruption was to be tackled,
is there a solution in that direction,


Put it into perspective though, of ALL the Parties in power or in opposition,
has anyone else made porposals which make any more sense ?

 

[Dengue]

Since Rupee is not a stable currency, Pakistan's economy is measured in dollars.

You suggesting that FDI and local borrowing and money printing be used to fill the hole? Coz PTI's saying they wont do local borrowing as that discourages private investment and they are targetting inflation so they dont have the option of money printing either. FDI and remittances help cover the Balance of Payment which continues to swell in red.

Pakistan borrows in SDR from IMF and dollars from the world bank. Hope you didnt find my answer "too technical"

lol phir nooron wali baat .. mere bhai budget Pakistani Rs main hota hai US dollars main nahi .. if u r talking abt budget deficit then talk in RS .. and u said PTI said they wont do local borrowing .. and thats the most stupid thing u ever said .. PTI never said that .. PTI said they wont do as much borrowing as PPP is doing and not leaving a penny for private businesses .. so even after 1 trillion .. there will much money left in the kitty on pvt banks to lend pvt businesses .. remittances also help in budget filling gap of budget deficit .. because more remittances more local spending/consumption and more revenue for govt .. u need to study abt economics first .. FDI also help in generating more taxes because of investments ..

 

[Bangash]

اگر خودمختاری گھاس کھانے سے بھی ملتی ہے تو وہ بھی غلامی کی زندگی سے بہتر ہے- اپ ایمانداری اور ایمان کی طاقت نہیں جانتے اس لئے آپکے حساب سے یہ نظر آرہا ہے انشاللہ اپ دیکھ لینگے عمران خان کی مدد کے لئے لوگ کیا کچھ کرسکتے ہیں​

 

[salaudin]

Since most of us do not have strong finance-related background, a majority of us cannot answer it anyways. You could contact Asad Umer or Jahangir Tareen (perhaps) to answer your concerns.

 

[AsifAmeer]

Pakistan needs alot more than 1 leader. If this country expects to see change, every single person has to think and sacrifice per their ability. Check ur inbox.

Yes Asif, its OK...practical proposals are always debatable & can be discussed irrespective of difference of viewpoint but in my thread http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthrea...try-MUST-WATCH

...I was much interested to know if there is really any political leader having practical vision towards solving economic problems of country at least but I have not yet received any response from any supporter of true leaders including Imran khan but only mere claims...its the ground reality... unfortunately every leader of political leader pursues blames & allegation game about their rivals or plays with sentiments of public without presenting solution to problems......leaders can't talk of issues theirself but with the help of hired experts ...!

 

[AsifAmeer]

I just showed you that there is a deficit of around $10 Billion per year IF things turn out exactly the way PTI Economic team wishes (this includes, GDP growth, tax net growth, FDI growth, remittance.. everything!)

Either Imran comes out and says "We will balance the budget" or he should stop lying that he isnt going to BEG FROM THE IMF.

What is his lie?

If he says the deficit would be reduced to 4.5% (in their whole term) but on the same times he says that they would raise the tax net (without increase in Tax rate and I think every sincere & honest person can do it because Pakistanis want to give tax but not to the looters) and foreign investments especially Foreign Pakistanis.

 

[desicad]

@AsifAmeer
All this discussion is no use.....pti will most likely not contest the elections on one pretext or the other as usual fearing defeat......so where is the need for debate on their economic policy and controlling fiscal deficit.......:lol:

 

[gazoomartian]

[MENTION=28008]Dengue[/MENTION]

.....and if we are still short, we can always (and we must) freeze the accounts of the elites (YES including the generals) and let them first report their source of that huge account.

I am sure it will not be easy. it has to be done thru legislation and courts.

Also, if I were IK, I would demonetize the notes next day of office. Depositors must account for the source of huge income. Details need to be worked out.

These two steps would take care of illegally obtained money and the counterfeit money that have been floating around. printed

 

[Nice2MU]

اگر خودمختاری گھاس کھانے سے بھی ملتی ہے تو وہ بھی غلامی کی زندگی سے بہتر ہے- اپ ایمانداری اور ایمان کی طاقت نہیں جانتے اس لئے آپکے حساب سے یہ نظر آرہا ہے انشاللہ اپ دیکھ لینگے عمران خان کی مدد کے لئے لوگ کیا کچھ کرسکتے ہیں​

Brother So called Liberals and Seculars don't believe on such things. So don't hit your head against the wall.

 

[AsifAmeer]

Here is their side of the argument - "But the economy is slow, and the private sector is not picking the tab. So the Govt needs to step in and stimulate the economy" This is pure Keynesianism. Remember, I told you that there is no difference b/w Keynesianism and Incest - either way ur f.ucking your own ppl"

Its thru this budget deficit -financing, govts make love with its citizens.

And that $10 billion figure. Just google up PTI's Economic policy and Pakistan's GDP. Its 1 simple calculation. Lekin dekho.. no one.. NO ONE.. folks like Farooq Timrizi and Khurram Hussain.. no one brought up this point. Why? Blame the academia! They only teach Keynesianism there. Why can I see this as a problem? because I went thru another 50 books on Economics after I graduated. Many of them were neo-classical and Austrian economics.

Solution. You gotta tax land.

If what you say is true, and for the sake of Pak,
I hope people relevant pay attention and find a way to deal with this possible deficit

Okay so tell us also. Is Pakistan's economy such a black hole that it is beyond recall.
There must be ways round this $10 bill deficit.

Surely there are alternative ways to raise this money,
AND supposing corruption was to be tackled,
is there a solution in that direction,


Put it into perspective though, of ALL the Parties in power or in opposition,
has anyone else made porposals which make any more sense ?

 

[Ali_Economist]

Dear Asif

I wonder why you put this post here because you could discuss this with PTI economic committee , however as It was mentioned by Asad during presentation and its well known fact that the deficit reduction is often not without pain, Therefore we cut the deficit over a few fiscal years keeping in mind global economic conditions.

About your question the how the 4.5% deficit would be funded, I think there is a Bond market if you remember? IMF and World bank are not for normally lending, they are for bailouts, I wonder if I need to tell you the difference between a bailout and Deficit/debt financing I think you were working in Investment banking??, I might be wrong.

Most of the countries adopt smooth, so Inshallah we would.

 

[Nice2MU]

@AsifAmeer
All this discussion is no use.....pti will most likely not contest the elections on one pretext or the other as usual fearing defeat......so where is the need for debate on their economic policy and controlling fiscal deficit.......:lol:

یہی خوش مہمی مروائیگی تم لوگوں کو۔


اگر 30 اکتوبر 2011 کا جلسہ نہ ھوتا تو آپ لوگ مفت میں مارے جاتے اور پھر الزام لگاتے کہ پی ٹی آئی کو آئی ایس آئی نے جتوایا ھے۔ ​

 

[Nice2MU]

I just showed you that there is a deficit of around $10 Billion per year IF things turn out exactly the way PTI Economic team wishes (this includes, GDP growth, tax net growth, FDI growth, remittance.. everything!)

Either Imran comes out and says "We will balance the budget" or he should stop lying that he isnt going to BEG FROM THE IMF.

I will convey your message to IK and he would say thank to you on TV as well. Don't worry because IK forgot that he has missed one "Economic Genius" who use to come on siasat.pk and wasting time here and IK doesn't know him.

 

[Mansur]

It's true you have to give solutions on how your going to make possible what you claim. So far PTI hasn't given anything substantial in this regard.

 

[UKPakistani]

Solution. You gotta tax land.

Bingo,

$10 bill is not so large for any Gov which can manage that

Land itself, ie you are taxed on land you own and occupy, or
say a Factory or workshop or a processing plant of some sort which is let out

or just an agricultral tax,
ie on what you produce and how much,
as opposed to how much land you own and earn from it


or both

Either way $10 billis easy to overcome in a Country the size of Pak

PS Some folk in the UK are still big on JMK, in view of our current economic "plight"

 

[AsifAmeer]

Its better to be quiet and be doubted as a fool rather than speak and confirm the doubt...

Fiscal deficit was measured as % of GDP by PTI
GDP of Pakistan is measured in USD.

You dont measure the scale by the same scare you are trying to measure. Thats called circular logic.

lol phir nooron wali baat .. mere bhai budget Pakistani Rs main hota hai US dollars main nahi .. if u r talking abt budget deficit then talk in RS .. and u said PTI said they wont do local borrowing .. and thats the most stupid thing u ever said .. PTI never said that .. PTI said they wont do as much borrowing as PPP is doing and not leaving a penny for private businesses .. so even after 1 trillion .. there will much money left in the kitty on pvt banks to lend pvt businesses .. remittances also help in budget filling gap of budget deficit .. because more remittances more local spending/consumption and more revenue for govt .. u need to study abt economics first .. FDI also help in generating more taxes because of investments ..

 

[AsifAmeer]

I honestly want Asad to lead this Political party. He is a no BS guy. I have a problem with Imran. He needs to speak less and listen more.

Since most of us do not have strong finance-related background, a majority of us cannot answer it anyways. You could contact Asad Umer or Jahangir Tareen (perhaps) to answer your concerns.

 

[AsifAmeer]

If I am making them think, I have done by task. Solutions have to come from within and not imposed. When the crowd wakes up and realizes its power, I am gonna take a popcorn with a smile on my face.

@AsifAmeer
All this discussion is no use.....pti will most likely not contest the elections on one pretext or the other as usual fearing defeat......so where is the need for debate on their economic policy and controlling fiscal deficit.......:lol:

 

[sab_ka_dost]

Totally crap post.. IK have mentioned 100 times how he is going to generate money by increasing tax brackets on rich people, reduce corruption and cut spending.. But paid people probably do not even listen to him or intentionally ignore just to promote Noora leagure & PPP agenda. They do not realize if same people comes back, their children future will be dark. For the sake of our generation, even if you believe IK will not do any good, still give him a chance, you have at least tried others and nothing good has happened.