Question about Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto's Hanging

[Raaz]

Hello Brothers,
Honest to Allah (SWT) I'm glad that you all had a healthy/most authentic and impartial debate on 'our' past history. Above all, there is no argument for the sake of argument. Some learn from "history" other's from their own experience. By stroke of luck; I, happened to be a part of almost all, that "you" stated/quoted. Still, a lot more remains undisclosed but then, it will become too much complex to draw a 'solid and precise' conclusion. Let me make a correction, ZAB was hanged in Adiala Jail, Rawalpindi and not in "Kot-Lakhpat' Jail, Lahore. I'm witness to most crucial events since "Ayub Khan" and "Zulfi" (Earliest) era. I was in "Murree" when Zia landed there (Agency) in a helicopter and proceeded in a black car to the 'house' where ZAB was kept. He was seen almost by all those present on the road by a distance of only 2-3 feet (both sides). Other political persons were kept in "Punjab/Sindh" houses, nearby. In conclusion, nothing mentioned by these 3-4 members is fabricated. Such posts are most 'meaningful' and can help the 'youngsters' to get apprised of their unseen! Looking forward to refresh the memory further.

Then what is next?

Zia landed , people saw him.. he talked to Bhutto and when he came out , He was even more harder in his tone..

So carry on...please.

 

[Raaz]

what was Zia ul haq? it is almost a hidden fact from nation. the day his true planing comes into lime light, i can assure u that people of Pakistan may worship him. Zia was killed (the moment his planing came into their information) by those forces who wish to rule the world and India is part of them. we r impressed or have developed an opinion based on opposition of Zia and propaganda of those countries and people who still like to disband Pakistan. Please remember my words. brother Gazoo has some info about Zia but it is just not enough at all.

U better go and worship Zia...as usual.

 

[chitra]

Then what is next?Zia landed , people saw him.. he talked to Bhutto and when he came out , He was even more harder in his tone..So carry on...please.

Sure; I'll share a lot more but by PM. It will be received 'negative' if some fan/lover/admirer read the real attributes of their leader. Bhai "Dignity is neither purchased nor, manufactured. It's a 'reward' reserved for those who labor with diligence".

 

[Raaz]

Sure; I'll share a lot more but by PM. It will be received 'negative' if some fan/lover/admirer read the real attributes of their leader. Bhai "Dignity is neither purchased nor, manufactured. It's a 'reward' reserved for those who labor with diligence".

I will be waiting

 

[chitra]

I will be waiting

I'll double check and verify the things again before any submission. Similarly, please let me 'learn' of your observations on other crucial issues/subjects for my personal understandings. Take Care!PS: I had come across some "Most" disturbing 'attachments' regarding "Islam and our religious" norms but can not share them publicaly as it contains 'objection-able' (adullts) stuff in writing/pics. Henceforth, only PM.

 

[AMagsi]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

Can I Ask what part of Pakistan you are from?

we will, once we recapture the East Pakistan. Repatriation of the pro-Pak people form Bangladesh into Pakistan is a part of manshoor of my party, Patriots. they will be settled in northern Bluchistan. Because BL needs Population so it can be better represented in the capital and also it can collect more taxes because of mass influx of the people from the East.

BL is hungry for population paying taxes, and for representation in the politics of Pakistan.

 

[cefspan]

I will be waiting

I'll double check and verify the things again before any submission. Similarly, please let me 'learn' of your observations on other crucial issues/subjects for my personal understandings. Take Care!PS: I had come across some "Most" disturbing 'attachments' regarding "Islam and our religious" norms but can not share them publicaly as it contains 'objection-able' (adullts) stuff in writing/pics. Henceforth, only PM.

JO bhi PM kraen , do PM me also , I AM 19 NOW!(bigsmile)(bigsmile):P;)

 

[chitra]

JO bhi PM kraen , do PM me also , I AM 19 NOW!(bigsmile)(bigsmile):P;)

Sure! mature 'kids' are much better than ideotic elders. It's matter of time otherwise, our country's past events and rulers (historical) background is an outstanding "feast" to read and watch. Writing a composite manuscript takes a lot of time but it's most essential to educate our youth. It also prevents a lot of "stupidity" in approach and behavior!.

 

[jujuju]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

stop this gazoo. defending low lifw criminals like zia. all you idiot pakistanis who still swear by palestine, have you read this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_September_in_Jordan

Zia was the bigget killer of palestinian activists (who zaid hamid cliams cried tears of joy when pakistan tested nuclear bomb), and in a single day killed more palestinians than israel ever could or did. all under the active encouragement of Amrika and its stooge in jordan, King Hussein.

Zia may have been a lots of thing but GHADDAR he wasn't like ZAB and AZ and BB.

Zia wasnt a politician but a army man therefore he did few things that caused great damage to the country even though he may not have estimated that. As far as I know, he did not drink (ZAB was sharabi), he was the only one perhaps to read Quran in the UN. he thought about Pak as an Islamic state. He helped mujahedeen rid the USSR from Afghanistan.

The only and major mistake he made:

1. he did not call elections. he listened to his selfish assistants and continue martial law (just like Mush)

2. He created MQM to put down PPP. He may have meant well but wasnt well thought off.

the only thing good would have been to call elections and retire as a hero

 

[gazoomartian]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

stop this gazoo. defending low lifw criminals like zia. all you idiot pakistanis who still swear by palestine, have you read this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_September_in_Jordan

Zia was the bigget killer of palestinian activists (who zaid hamid cliams cried tears of joy when pakistan tested nuclear bomb), and in a single day killed more palestinians than israel ever could or did. all under the active encouragement of Amrika and its stooge in jordan, King Hussein.

Look who is talking. India has killed millions in East Pakistan, 60,000 so far in Kashmir, over 2000 Sikhs in 84 in temple, 3000 Sikhs throughout India, in the aftermath of temple invasion, 1000's burnt killed in Gujrat. not to mention systematic killings of minorities by abusing them, like untouchables.....

Before opening your dirty mouth, look into your conscience, if you have any

Oh I forgot, millions Muslims killed in 1947 by Hindus

 

[jujuju]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

gazoo, india is a generic thing, not a single person. and i am guilty as charged (atleast india is). you are a muslim, arent you. you have higher standards than us coward dirty hindus. dont you? answer for zia then. dont say india did this india did that. unlike the way you defend zia, i never waste my time defending india.

Look who is talking. India has killed millions in East Pakistan, 60,000 so far in Kashmir, over 2000 Sikhs in 84 in temple, 3000 Sikhs throughout India, in the aftermath of temple invasion, 1000's burnt killed in Gujrat. not to mention systematic killings of minorities by abusing them, like untouchables.....

Before opening your dirty mouth, look into your conscience, if you have any

Oh I forgot, millions Muslims killed in 1947 by Hindus

 

[gazoomartian]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

Can I Ask what part of Pakistan you are from?

I am from East Pakistan

 

[gazoomartian]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

gazoo, india is a generic thing, not a single person. and i am guilty as charged (atleast india is). you are a muslim, arent you. you have higher standards than us coward dirty hindus. dont you? answer for zia then. dont say india did this india did that. unlike the way you defend zia, i never waste my time defending india.

you are smart in that you know that India's slate is so marred with blood and dirt that even you cant think of defending her.

Congratulations! You have now earned a place in the ignore bin of Gazoo. I will pour some Cow Cola to quench your thirst. Good day

 

[Temojin]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

I'll double check and verify the things again before any submission. Similarly, please let me 'learn' of your observations on other crucial issues/subjects for my personal understandings. Take Care!PS: I had come across some "Most" disturbing 'attachments' regarding "Islam and our religious" norms but can not share them publicaly as it contains 'objection-able' (adullts) stuff in writing/pics. Henceforth, only PM.

hmm! what kind of attachments are you talking about here? Would like to discuss

Generally Pakistanis keep shut during martial law. Zia had a tight control of who could say what, only one TV channel, PTV (I wish it was still the same), he made it sound like, and in some instances it was true, Bhutto was just an other man committed a crime of murder and he was hanged at late night in koth lakhpat, thats it

Dont forget that CIA had spread hatred against him in Pakistanis because his stance of Islamic Bomb. This slogan was his trademark and he paid heavy price for being so outspoken about Islamic Bomb. We would have nukes long ago if he only knew how to keep mouth shut and do it secretly

Zia was no good, even army didn't like him and that is why he was assassinated by army itself (Aslam and Hameed, the main men) . He was the closest of ally with the house of saud and the CIA and there is no second thought about it. His and akhtar's sons are rich as richie rich because of all afghan funding as well as the ojri camp selling which was then blown up to cover it. Did you know the zia and hasan nisar are close relatives? The things like nuclear program were and are not in any general's hands but somewhere else and the can't stop it all even if they want to. MQM was totally supported by Zia during his regime though JI helped him stay in power. All the politics of firearms was initiated by bhutto but got to peak during zia's regime. He in fact used Islam's name to justify his actions. His bicycle stunt was itself hilarious as ahmedi nejzad's offering prayers on roadside or imran khan's offering prayers in sweat soaked clothes in a masjid.

 

[gazoomartian]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

hmm! what kind of attachments are you talking about here? Would like to discuss



Zia was no good, even army didn't like him and that is why he was assassinated by army itself (Aslam and Hameed, the main men) . He was the closest of ally with the house of saud and the CIA and there is no second thought about it. His and akhtar's sons are rich as richie rich because of all afghan funding as well as the ojri camp selling which was then blown up to cover it. Did you know the zia and hasan nisar are close relatives? The things like nuclear program were and are not in any general's hands but somewhere else and the can't stop it all even if they want to. MQM was totally supported by Zia during his regime though JI helped him stay in power. All the politics of firearms was initiated by bhutto but got to peak during zia's regime. He in fact used Islam's name to justify his actions. His bicycle stunt was itself hilarious as ahmedi nejzad's offering prayers on roadside or imran khan's offering prayers in sweat soaked clothes in a masjid.

OH Boy!, Where did you learn that Zia was killed by his own men?

Read this:

On August 17, 1988, General Zia and five of his generals visited a test site to observe a demonstration of the M1 Abrams main battle tank, which the US was trying to persuade Pakistan to buy. He and his entourage flew to Bahawalpur, about 330 mi (530 km) south of Islamabad in the president's C-130 Hercules aircraft, then flew to the test site by helicopter. Afterwards, they returned to Bahawalpur for lunch, then boarded the C-130 for the return flight to Islamabad.[SUP][1][/SUP]
The aircraft departed Bahawalpur early, ahead of a storm. The president's C-130 had been fitted with an air-conditioned VIP capsule where Zia and his American guests were seated. It was walled off from the flight crew and a passenger and baggage section in the rear. The plane was packed with Pakistani army officers, including General Akhtar Abdur Rehman, chairman of the Pakistani Joint Chiefs of Staff, as well as American Ambassador to Pakistan Arnold Raphel and General Herbert M. Wassom, the head of the U.S. Military aid mission to Pakistan.
Shortly after takeoff, the control tower lost contact with the aircraft. Witnesses cited in Pakistan's official investigation said that the C-130 began to pitch "in an up-and-down motion" while flying low shortly after take-off before going into a "near-vertical dive", exploding on impact, killing all on board.

source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Muhammad_Zia-ul-Haq

 

[BulandPak]

The reason why Pakistani People did not protest and went to the streets against hanging of Ex Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto are :

1. Zulfiqar Ali bhutto had Sindi Background. Most of his support was from his home province. The rest of the provinces were either not too supportive of him or decided to play neutral.

2. Pakistani People as whole with the exception of Pakhtuns are timid / submissive and its very unlikely that they will go against an armed force like Pakistan Army or any other army

3. The few handful of people who planned the protests on his hanging were jailed and tortured by Pakistan army headed by General Zia.

The Conclusion is Pakistani Civilians lack the Courage and Capacity to Protest against any injustice inflicted on them by a superior force like Pakistan Army. At the end of the day " One who has the Gun in Pakistan is more powerful...and that is Pakistan Army and not the Civilians"

 

[Temojin]

Re: I have a question regarding the Z A BHUTTO hanging..........

OH Boy!, Where did you learn that Zia was killed by his own men?

Read this:

On August 17, 1988, General Zia and five of his generals visited a test site to observe a demonstration of the M1 Abrams main battle tank, which the US was trying to persuade Pakistan to buy. He and his entourage flew to Bahawalpur, about 330 mi (530 km) south of Islamabad in the president's C-130 Hercules aircraft, then flew to the test site by helicopter. Afterwards, they returned to Bahawalpur for lunch, then boarded the C-130 for the return flight to Islamabad.[SUP][1][/SUP]
The aircraft departed Bahawalpur early, ahead of a storm. The president's C-130 had been fitted with an air-conditioned VIP capsule where Zia and his American guests were seated. It was walled off from the flight crew and a passenger and baggage section in the rear. The plane was packed with Pakistani army officers, including General Akhtar Abdur Rehman, chairman of the Pakistani Joint Chiefs of Staff, as well as American Ambassador to Pakistan Arnold Raphel and General Herbert M. Wassom, the head of the U.S. Military aid mission to Pakistan.
Shortly after takeoff, the control tower lost contact with the aircraft. Witnesses cited in Pakistan's official investigation said that the C-130 began to pitch "in an up-and-down motion" while flying low shortly after take-off before going into a "near-vertical dive", exploding on impact, killing all on board.

source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Muhammad_Zia-ul-Haq

Aaaaaah!!!! Good old wikipedia!!!! Mate, I have said that army itself got rid of him so wikipedia wouldn't ever tell you that which almost never tells anything except citations from people. Anyway, leave it. I wouldn't watch to get some other lives in jeopardy too after telling it all on a public forum. I know the thing from someone really close and by close, I mean really really close.

 

[Temojin]

The reason why Pakistani People did not protest and went to the streets against hanging of Ex Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto are :

1. Zulfiqar Ali bhutto had Sindi Background. Most of his support was from his home province. The rest of the provinces were either not too supportive of him or decided to play neutral.

2. Pakistani People as whole with the exception of Pakhtuns are timid / submissive and its very unlikely that they will go against an armed force like Pakistan Army or any other army

3. The few handful of people who planned the protests on his hanging were jailed and tortured by Pakistan army headed by General Zia.

The Conclusion is Pakistani Civilians lack the Courage and Capacity to Protest against any injustice inflicted on them by a superior force like Pakistan Army. At the end of the day " One who has the Gun in Pakistan is more powerful...and that is Pakistan Army and not the Civilians"

First of all, mate why are you such a racist? Bhutto's support came from punjab as a majority, surprise for you??? check history again. His uprising and his campaign was more successful in punjab than anywhere else (he was of course successful, throughout western Pakistan)

Mate, you have no idea how many protested against it all so don't be surprised when you check it again or for the fact, check it for the first time.

Your remark about Pakistani people, mate so hateful and racist. The last time I checked, the pushtoons fighting against army are ttp and are highly disliked amongst their peers. Moreover, Balochistan has a longer history of insurgency so your theory is wrong in the first place (though it is totally wrong)? Or those who kill army men are the bravest Don't discredit my pushtoon brothers like this please.

 

[BulandPak]

First of all, mate why are you such a racist? Bhutto's support came from punjab as a majority, surprise for you??? check history again. His uprising and his campaign was more successful in punjab than anywhere else (he was of course successful, throughout western Pakistan)

Mate, you have no idea how many protested against it all so don't be surprised when you check it again or for the fact, check it for the first time.

Your remark about Pakistani people, mate so hateful and racist. The last time I checked, the pushtoons fighting against army are ttp and are highly disliked amongst their peers. Moreover, Balochistan has a longer history of insurgency so your theory is wrong in the first place (though it is totally wrong)? Or those who kill army men are the bravest Don't discredit my pushtoon brothers like this please.

Lets not make it an issue of confrontation , The idea is to share views and opinions. Lets move foward and answering to your counter argument which was " Support of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto in Punjab "..............I would remind you that Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto was an ethnic Sindi . He did enjoy initial support from Punjab specially during the time of ousting the Military Dictator Ayub Khan. But then , his support got confined only to Southern pakistan. The truth of my argument can be verified from the current and past election results.

I also stand by my presented postulate i.e " Most Ethnic Entities of Pakistan are Timid/Submissive and have no historical record of resisting any army or forces superior to them Examples British Conquest of India, Moghul Empire and so on........

Prove me Wrong and I will retreat my argument.

Thank you

 

[Temojin]

Lets not make it an issue of confrontation , The idea is to share views and opinions. Lets move foward and answering to your counter argument which was " Support of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto in Punjab "..............I would remind you that Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto was an ethnic Sindi . He did enjoy initial support from Punjab specially during the time of ousting the Military Dictator Ayub Khan. But then , his support got confined only to Southern pakistan. The truth of my argument can be verified from the current and past election results.

I also stand by my presented postulate i.e " Most Ethnic Entities of Pakistan are Timid/Submissive and have no historical record of resisting any army or forces superior to them Examples British Conquest of India, Moghul Empire and so on........

Prove me Wrong and I will retreat my argument.

Thank you

Mate, I am not here to prove things or make anyone agree. Would only say that I personally know many things due to some factors so I don't have to rely upon distant or printed sources but very close acquaintances from power echelons who tend to speak truth only in private meetings. I have seen it numerous times when an anchorperson comes to a certain editor's office after hosting a show and says, "Yaar kia jhoot bolne aur dekhne pertey hain, aur asal mein to.........". Lahore was called peoples partys' stronghold till uprising of nawaz sharif and I again don't need any references for that because incidentally I know it.

Your comment about ethnicities is racist as my family too is from an area, people of which don't like punjabis yet the bravest man I have ever met till date is a punjabi so it doesn't matter which ethnicity you belong to. As a matter of fact pushtoons were the first ones amongst the tribals who accepted the political agency system and accepted british superiority very smartly. And the theories that afghans/pushtoons could never be conquered while it was always occupied by various forces throughout history including but not limited to khwazimids, various persians, mongols etc. without much resistance for much time............. anyway leave it. So leave it aside and try not to talk about cast and creed. I don't know if you believe in Islam and Ahadith but according to a Hadith, "Badtareen shakhs voh hai jo kisi ke nasb pe ta'an kere". So my mate, your comment too in a way goes directly towards that so I am trying to save you from it only.

And yes! I too don't want to get into a verbal conflict so leave it here.