Poll: Pakistan: secular, moderate Islamist or Islamic Modernist???

  • Thread starter Thread starter حکایت جنوں
  • Start date Start date

Pakistan should be?

  • Islamic

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • Moderate Islamic

    Votes: 3 33.3%
  • Secular

    Votes: 1 11.1%

  • Total voters
    9
ح

حکایت جنوں

Guest
What should be the political identity of Pakistan

Secular
Moderate Islamism (like in Turkey and Tunisia)
Islamic modernism

What is your opinion????
 

SalmanKhanN

MPA (400+ posts)
Islamic republic of pakistan is the current title.. Quran and Sunnah should be our way.. this country was made for the freedom of muslims.... away from hindus.. lets fulfill the struggle of Quaid e Azam and Allama iqbal.
 

Saeed

MPA (400+ posts)
What should be the political identity of Pakistan

Secular
Moderate Islamism (like in Turkey and Tunisia)
Islamic modernism

What is your opinion????

A true independent Pakistan.

We dont want to label it.

Label makes the country slave of that slogan.

We need a country , where eveyone could live easily with dignity.
 

Benito

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
What is your opinion????

Independent Republic of Pakistan,
We are not Islamist, we are not secular
We hold a flag With the Green, which represents majority of Muslims and white stripe represents religious minorities. And the crescent and star in center symbolize progress and light respectively.[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Pakistan#cite_note-flagsig1-4[/SUP] The flag symbolizes Pakistan's commitment to Islam, the Islamic world, and the rights of religious minorities.[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Pakistan#cite_note-basicfacts-5[/SUP]
And this is definition of Pakistan.....
 

usman6062

MPA (400+ posts)
I believe your question is wrong.
Pakistan is an islamic state......Now islam is only one. There is no moderate islam and old islam.

I would recommend to stop it here as it is not necessary debate and I don't want to indulge myself and others on this thing.
 

Unicorn

Banned
" There is no compulsion in religion " this is a purely secular and clear statement. If this is the statement of faith you live by than can anyone quote me a statement that is as clear is mine that contradicts it? an implied statement is not acceptable.
 
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Benito

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
It should be what it was aimed to be by it's Founders.

The another speech, may broke your heart, "The constitution of Pakistan has yet to be framed by the Pakistan Constituent Assembly. I do not know what the ultimate shape of this constitution is going to be, but I am sure that it will be of a democratic type, embodying the essential principle of Islam. Today, they are as applicable in actual life as they were 1,300 years ago. Islam and its idealism have taught us democracy. It has taught equality of man, justice and fairplay to everybody. We are the inheritors of these glorious traditions and are fully alive to our responsibilities and obligations as framers of the future constitution of Pakistan. In any case Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic State to be ruled by priests with a divine mission. We have many non-Muslims — Hindus, Christians, and Parsis — but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan" - Muhammad Ali Jinnah - [February, 1948]

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Despite the fact that very few people know the real ideology behind Pakistan Movement I would like you people to recall at least what we all agree upon and have studied in our schools. Sir Syed Ahmad Khan began the period of self-awakening and identity; Allama Muhammad Iqbal provided the philosophical explanation and Mr. Jinnah translated into a political reality of a nation-state and many unknown names struggled hard to help them achieving this objective. But what was this movement for? Different people have different answers to this question but I feel that this movement was very similar to the one raised in Arab 1400 years ago, zakavision,

"I know there are people who do not quite agree with the division of India and the partition of the Punjab and Bengal. Much has been said against it, but now that it has been accepted, it is the duty of every one of us to loyally abide by it and honorably act according to the agreement which is now final and binding on all." [First presidential address to the constituent assembly of Pakistan on 11th August 1947]

"The great majority of us are Muslims. We follow the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed (may peace be upon him). We are members of the brotherhood of Islam in which all are equal in rights, dignity and self-respect. Consequently, we have a special and a very deep sense of unity. But make no mistake: Pakistan is not a theocracy or anything like it." [19th February, 1948]

"The constitution of Pakistan has yet to be framed by the Pakistan Constituent Assembly. I do not know what the ultimate shape of this constitution is going to be, but I am sure that it will be of a democratic type, embodying the essential principle of Islam. Today, they are as applicable in actual life as they were 1,300 years ago. Islam and its idealism have taught us democracy. It has taught equality of man, justice and fair play to everybody. We are the inheritors of these glorious traditions and are fully alive to our responsibilities and obligations as framers of the future constitution of Pakistan. In any case Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic State to be ruled by priests with a divine mission. We have many non-Muslims --Hindus, Christians, and Parsis --but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan." [February, 1948]

"You will no doubt agree with me that the first duty of a Government is to maintain law and order, so that the life, property and religious beliefs of its subjects are fully protected by the State....... The second thing that occurs to me is this: One of the biggest curses from which India is suffering --I do not say that other countries are free from it, but, I think, our condition is much worse --is bribery and corruption. That really is a poison. We must put that down with an iron hand.... Black marketing is another curse....... The next thing that strikes me is this: Here again it is a legacy which has been passed on to us. Along with many other things, good and bad, has arrived this great evil --the evil of nepotism and jobbery. This evil must be crushed relentlessly". [On August 11, 1947]

But when I see around I found everything same as it was in 1947. Nothing has been changed even became worse than that. The same happened to Pakistan that happened to Islam. Islam went into the hands that did not deserve it and then Pakistan too.

Everybody had to play his/her role in the development of this country but unfortunately nobody did what anybody could have done. People completely forgot the ideology behind Pakistan or misinterpreted it. They actually had no time to discuss this and when they discussed they always discussed non-issues. I gave you an example that I came across few months ago. We all have heard about three words of Mr. Jinnah "Unity, Faith, Discipline" but you will find different sequence of these three words on different national logos, in government offices and on hilltops. As per my knowledge first time Mr. Zia-ul-Haque rewrote this sequence to "Faith, Unity and Discipline". Obviously for this he would have to reprint all government stationary. He might have considered "Faith" as "Islam' but don't you think Mr. Jinnah could have said "Islam" himself instead of "Faith" in his motto if he wanted to? Mr. Jinnah gave no importance to the sequence as it can be identified from an excerpt from his speech in which he used both sequences.

"We are going through fire: the sunshine has yet to come. But I have no doubt that with unity, faith and discipline we will not only remain the fifth largest State in the world but will compare with any nation of the world. Are you prepared to undergo the fire? ..... We are passing through a period of fear, danger and menace. We must have faith, unity and discipline." [December 28, 1947]
 
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حکایت جنوں

Guest
[MENTION=6273]usman6062[/MENTION] Though I like your straightforwardness, simplicity and your conviction to achieve the ideal for political change decided either by your conscious or by your leader but it is not at all an unnecessary question. Today this question is being asked in every Muslim country including Pakistan. This question is also related to our cultural identity and the answer to this question will show how much we are related to this cultural consciousness and what should be the limits of this consciousness in the modern conditions according to you. However with due respect I want to point out a dangerous totalitarian tendency in your message (I don't want to indulge myself and others on this thing.). You can decide for yourself about your indulgence in any matter but not for others. You are not "Khudai faujdaar"
 
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usman6062

MPA (400+ posts)
@usman6062 Though I like your straightforwardness, simplicity and your conviction to achieve the ideal for political change decided either by your conscious or by your leader but it is not at all an unnecessary question. Today this question is being asked in every Muslim country including Pakistan. This question is also related to our cultural identity and the answer to this question will show how much we are related to this cultural consciousness and what should be the limits of this consciousness in the modern conditions according to you. However with due respect I want to point out a dangerous totalitarian tendency in your message (I don't want to indulge myself and others on this thing.). You can decide for yourself about your indulgence in any matter but not for others. You are not "Khudai faujdaar"
What I was trying to say is that Islam is same in every day and in every age. you are confusing islam with culture. Everything that is in our culture should be according to islam. So if , for instance, Mehndi is a rasm people do during weddings, but it is not part of islam. So I am a person who will not follow culture but my religion i.e. Islam.
Therefore, we should have our own identity, our culture shows our identity but that should not be beyond our islamic values.
 

Paki1

Banned
Admin pls post my post, few people using internet can not make a change in Pakistani people Mentality. neither they can make some one Prime Minister or not. Thanks
At least most of posts i am telling them to follow Allah and his Nabi. I hope they come out of IDOL worshipping.
 

wellwisher

Citizen
If In Pakistan Muslims are in majority why they should Not follow and implement the Islamic rules acording to Quran and Sunna, as In democracy the majority has right to make and choose rules best for them , and for the minority according to Quaid;s statement
"We have many non-Muslims Hindus, Christians, and Parsis but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan" -

This statement does not conflict with Quran and Sunna .

In this way you can say for muslims it is a Islamic State and for The minorities it is a secular state .But if you asked for the secular state without religion and a non muslim ruler can rule the muslims majority. then I have question for you , " why muslims of india asked for a separate state in the past ? what was the need to make pakistan ?
 

atensari

(50k+ posts) بابائے فورم
" There is no compulsion in religion " this is a purely secular and clear statement. If this is the statement of faith you live by than can anyone quote me a statement that is as clear is mine that contradicts it? an implied statement is not acceptable.
 

Unicorn

Banned

He talks about this quote during first two minutes. He did not present any quote explicit or implicit that contradicts the statement that I brought forward. On its face value it applies to Muslims and Non Muslims. Mr. Ahmed has tried to explain it. His position is that " Nizam" must be Islamic. If the law of the land is Islamic and people of the land Muslim and Non-Muslim must follow the law or face punishments than there is " Jabar " involved and the statement becomes irreverent. What he says is simply back door to " compulsion in religion ".
 

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