Limitations of Capitalism. An amazing 10 min Interview with Michael Hudson - My star economist

guest

Councller (250+ posts)
i agree with you. Hudson's view on capital is half way to minsky's cyclical capital investent theory. i am sure if he is asked in more detail, he will fully endorse minsky's view which i think is the most relevant view. and of course who can forget bill clinton, phil grhamm and lawrence summers and robert rubin. in fact the fincnacial services modernization act was even called grahmm leach bliley act.

but exactly here is where my inner marxist kick in. I think wahtever act you make, as long as the power is concentrated in the hands of a small few, there will always find a way to monopolize the system and take all power in their hands. so in the lingo of marx, capitalism is a system destined to monopolization due to concentration of wealth in the hands of the "capitalists". as a result arguing about how one act or two were alone the major blunders which caused all the trouble is disingeneous. as slavoj zizek points out, any ideology/politics is responsible for all its consequences, those intended and those not intended.


The way Dr Hudson explains it is that there r 2 types of Credits - Good and bad. Credit issued for industrial and production use is good credit and credit issued for consumption or existing capital is called bad credit. This is a bit similar to Minsky's view of debt.

And that Futures modernization act you spoke of, the douche Phill Gramm allowed the banks to treat commodities as an investment asset class, allowing them to buy or sell more than x % of the daily volume. This wasnt the case before 1999. Now Oil was an asset glass, so was Gas and grain and corn... Plus they dropped the Glass Steagal act which allowed I-Banks to access deposits to further leverage their bets. Notice how this new credit falls in the category of "financing existing capital"...
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
U read Alchemy of Finance by Soros? You are going to LOVE it! He talks about his theory of reflexivity and explains that in social science, there is no such thing as an EQUILIBRIUM or a Fix. He backs up his views using Karl Popper's philosophy. There is never a permanent solution. Wish ppl realized it and not b that self-righteous.

I love Nassim Taleb's technical approach, you can only minimize risk. You can only only play around with the shades of grey but never eliminate them. And deal with the impact of the worst case scenario. He's got an interesting take on reality. But hes too full of himself.

i agree with you. Hudson's view on capital is half way to minsky's cyclical capital investent theory. i am sure if he is asked in more detail, he will fully endorse minsky's view which i think is the most relevant view. and of course who can forget bill clinton, phil grhamm and lawrence summers and robert rubin. in fact the fincnacial services modernization act was even called grahmm leach bliley act.

but exactly here is where my inner marxist kick in. I think wahtever act you make, as long as the power is concentrated in the hands of a small few, there will always find a way to monopolize the system and take all power in their hands. so in the lingo of marx, capitalism is a system destined to monopolization due to concentration of wealth in the hands of the "capitalists". as a result arguing about how one act or two were alone the major blunders which caused all the trouble is disingeneous. as slavoj zizek points out, any ideology/politics is responsible for all its consequences, those intended and those not intended.
 

only_truths

Minister (2k+ posts)
The way Dr Hudson explains it is that there r 2 types of Credits - Good and bad. Credit issued for industrial and production use is good credit and credit issued for consumption or existing capital is called bad credit. This is a bit similar to Minsky's view of debt.


I can understand credit issued for consumption, how come credit issued for existing capital be bad credit? What is the presumption of creditors in such cases?
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
good question.

Credit for existing capital only bids up prices for the existing capital. Let me give you can eg.

Suppose I sell you my house for $100k. You buy it and in a few months sell it back to me for $110k. Then I sell it back to you for $120k.. We do this back and forth till the house price becomes $500k. All these transactions are financed. So when u sell the house back to me for $110k, I borrow that money from the bank. You make a nice profit of $10k and I end up with an extra $10k debt loan on the house which i didnt have before. Fast forward to the $500k. Remember the house was worth only $100k few months ago. The rest of the price is reflecting speculative debt, the $400k. Anyone who owns that house will have to pay interest on that extra $400k.

Apply the same concept with Factory equipment, raw material, etc etc. Financing existing asseting doesnt add value to the economy but bloats the the financial sector which doesnt produce anything real.

kapeesh?

I can understand credit issued for consumption, how come credit issued for existing capital be bad credit? What is the presumption of creditors in such cases?
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
@asifameer, I was listening to Tom ... senator from Oklahoma, I think his book titled Debt Bomb is worth reading.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
i usually dont enjoy reading a book written by a politician or a bureaucrat

There have been 2 books that I bought, read half of it and put it back on the shelf..
On the Brink by Hank Paulson
and Fault Lines by Ragaram Rajan at IMF

I'll add this book to my list of read. Are you on goodreads.com?
@asifameer, I was listening to Tom ... senator from Oklahoma, I think his book titled Debt Bomb is worth reading.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
i usually dont enjoy reading a book written by a politician or a bureaucrat

There have been 2 books that I bought, read half of it and put it back on the shelf..
On the Brink by Hank Paulson
and Fault Lines by Ragaram Rajan at IMF

I'll add this book to my list of read. Are you on goodreads.com?

The part of brain which works brilliance in financial matters is underdeveloped in me, so I was hoping you will read it and give me the synopsis,I guess I will have to wait.;)

Nope I am not on goodreads.com but sometimes I will try it though.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
u sound like a woman.. hena? Women are better in financial matters! I m serious. Women are very rational in terms of finance and dont let their egos get in the way. God kinda messed up our design in that sense.

The part of brain which works brilliance in financial matters is underdeveloped in me, so I was hoping you will read it and give me the synopsis,I guess I will have to wait.;)

Nope I am not on goodreads.com but sometimes I will try it though.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
u sound like a woman.. hena? Women are better in financial matters! I m serious. Women are very rational in terms of finance and dont let their egos get in the way. God kinda messed up our design in that sense.

Just because I sound like one does not mean I am one, not that I am trying to spoil the fun of a guessing game!

I certainly believe that a lot of money is a huge test, again that I am not apposed to the idea of owning it :P

As long as we understand the use of money, and as long as we can make it without having to twist laws or raising false hopes.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
Ur a woman! I bet u 1 dolla ur a woman!

I know this guy.. a big shot right.... He buys bullion gold for his clients. So he deals with ALOT OF GOLD. One time i see him surrounded by gold bricks and accounting the numbers and inventory.. So I ask him "Mike... thats it man.. That gold.... This is it! the whole world is after this.." And he said something very interesting "U know Asif, when u hold that brick, in reality the Gold is holding you!"

That my friend sums up the human nature... We are all animals from within.
Just because I sound like one does not mean I am one, not that I am trying to spoil the fun of a guessing game!

I certainly believe that a lot of money is a huge test, again that I am not apposed to the idea of owning it :P

As long as we understand the use of money, and as long as we can make it without having to twist laws or raising false hopes.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Ur a woman! I bet u 1 dolla ur a woman!

I know this guy.. a big shot right.... He buys bullion gold for his clients. So he deals with ALOT OF GOLD. One time i see him surrounded by gold bricks and accounting the numbers and inventory.. So I ask him "Mike... thats it man.. That gold.... This is it! the whole world is after this.." And he said something very interesting "U know Asif, when u hold that brick, in reality the Gold is holding you!"

That my friend sums up the human nature... We are all animals from within.

Firstly, there is a 50% chance that you are right.Unfortunately it is Mendelian transmission!

Of course we are animals, but how is it that we become different? That my friend is the real secret revealed to us by the Holy Prophet SAWW.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
Comon admit it ... Nothing to be ashamed of... No one's perfect! ;P

We humans are UNINTENTIONALLY ruled by our animal instincts. There's a whole field of science in it called "Cognative Science". It explains our irrational behavior. Its not about morality. Its BEYOND morality.

We are all animals. And its not faith that makes us humans but CONSCIOUSNESS. Without CONSCIOUSNESS, faith is pointless.
Firstly, there is a 50% chance that you are right.Unfortunately it is Mendelian transmission!

Of course we are animals, but how is it that we become different? That my friend is the real secret revealed to us by the Holy Prophet SAWW.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Comon admit it ... Nothing to be ashamed of... No one's perfect! ;P

We humans are UNINTENTIONALLY ruled by our animal instincts. There's a whole field of science in it called "Cognative Science". It explains our irrational behavior. Its not about morality. Its BEYOND morality.

We are all animals. And its not faith that makes us humans but CONSCIOUSNESS. Without CONSCIOUSNESS, faith is pointless.

here is the crux. Consciousness is Faith.In cognitive science Super ego which generates guilt, in Faith it serves to make us humble. Before we get into this eternal question would you care to pin point where consciousness resides and where does Faith reside? can not but they are functions of our mind. Read "Reconstruction of Islamic thought", by Allama Iqbal.
 

AsifAmeer

Siasat.pk - Blogger
This is a deep subject in which I do not hold enough knowledge to comment on your I see consciousness as a vessel that CAN carry faith within it. Here's my reasoning, I can be greed while having or not having any faith. I can be forgiving with or without faith. Its the consciousness that gives vibrant colors to the faith, not the other way round.

My 2 cent..
here is the crux. Consciousness is Faith.In cognitive science Super ego which generates guilt, in Faith it serves to make us humble. Before we get into this eternal question would you care to pin point where consciousness resides and where does Faith reside? can not but they are functions of our mind. Read "Reconstruction of Islamic thought", by Allama Iqbal.
 

Star Gazer

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
This is a deep subject in which I do not hold enough knowledge to comment on your I see consciousness as a vessel that CAN carry faith within it. Here's my reasoning, I can be greed while having or not having any faith. I can be forgiving with or without faith. Its the consciousness that gives vibrant colors to the faith, not the other way round.

My 2 cent..

You are right if we think like a scientist, but Faith is being used at a superficial level. Faith means to believe in dictates in their entirety, not just bits and pieces as I like or which suite me. If we believe in Allah but then go on to do things which are forbidden then we really do not believe in Allah.
It is a deep topic and very interesting. Requires a lot of effort and thinking. None knows it full well.
 

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