Like it or Not: About MQM

Night-Hawk

Senator (1k+ posts)
Most of the link u shared are not working, the one working proves my point, dont you see how state was used against civilian of karachi in past and you expect no resistance will come, dont u remember y BANGLADESH was seperated from us? Open ypur eyes to reality you simply cannot rule or ruleout some1 on Force if u want them out come forward with something people need. About Canadian Court decision i believe if u really want to demolish MQM y not put case in your own country when we are of a opinnion our courts are free.......i can assure u no one will initiate that coz every party here has dark past...Please come out state of denial!!!

I have refreshed the links --- go ahead and browse them. And please let me know which link is not working? We 'll talk about Bangladesh later. Your style reminds me of a die hard MQM worker switching immediately to Bangladesh as a possible consequence. Go ahead and try to dismember this country to the best of your efforts. After all you will not ask me when and how to balkanize this Mamlekat e Khudadad.
Canadian courts are important and sacred because your organization doesn't believe in the sanctity of our courts. Just surf the threads related to judiciary and you will find the answer.
 
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shiningstar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Most of the link u shared are not working, the one working proves my point, dont you see how state was used against civilian of karachi in past and you expect no resistance will come, dont u remember y BANGLADESH was seperated from us? Open ypur eyes to reality you simply cannot rule or ruleout some1 on Force if u want them out come forward with something people need. About Canadian Court decision i believe if u really want to demolish MQM y not put case in your own country when we are of a opinnion our courts are free.......i can assure u no one will initiate that coz every party here has dark past...Please come out state of denial!!!
State was not used against civilian of Karachi rather it was used against GANG of Target Killers (MQM) because they were playing same bloody game that they have played some days back killing approx 92 innocent people. I remember at that time people of Karachi feel relaxed after this operation against GANG because it was a source of continouous headache for them in the form of Bhaata Khori and killing.
In case of Bangladesh, I would say that there is only one basic difference between traitor Sheikh Mujeebur Rehman and traitor Master of GANG of Target Killers, Sheikh Mujeeb has succeeded in his dirty act of dividing Pakistan and this Master of GANG is still weeping outside Pakistan because of his unsuccessful attempt. I agree with you that approx all the parties have dark past but this GANG of target Killers also has a dark present and future INSHALLAH because of his bad act of killing innocent people.
 

khipk

Senator (1k+ posts)
State was not used against civilian of Karachi rather it was used against GANG of Target Killers (MQM) because they were playing same bloody game that they have played some days back killing approx 92 innocent people. I remember at that time people of Karachi feel relaxed after this operation against GANG because it was a source of continouous headache for them in the form of Bhaata Khori and killing.
In case of Bangladesh, I would say that there is only one basic difference between traitor Sheikh Mujeebur Rehman and traitor Master of GANG of Target Killers, Sheikh Mujeeb has succeeded in his dirty act of dividing Pakistan and this Master of GANG is still weeping outside Pakistan because of his unsuccessful attempt. I agree with you that approx all the parties have dark past but this GANG of target Killers also has a dark present and future INSHALLAH because of his bad act of killing innocent people.

I am sorry but Civilians of Karachi supports and Supported MQM, People killed were civilians,
this should be evident from the fact that IN 1993 Elections MQM won almost all the seats contested by it in Karachi for provincial Assembly, (The elections were held under Army in KArachi. and the wasnt a single campaign launched in the city , because of Illegal Operation.)

Facts speak my dear friend.
 

khipk

Senator (1k+ posts)
I have refreshed the links --- go ahead and browse them. And please let me know which link is not working? We 'll talk about Bangladesh later. Your style reminds me of a die hard MQM worker switching immediately to Bangladesh as a possible consequence. Go ahead and try to dismember this country to the best of your efforts. After all you will not ask me when and how to balkanize this Mamlekat e Khudadad.
Canadian courts are important and sacred because your organization doesn't believe in the sanctity of our courts. Just surf the threads related to judiciary and you will find the answer.


The evidences used by |Canadian Courts were the Press Release of Govt of PAkistan during 90s,
do i need to say any further??
 

Mujtaba Zaidi

Voter (50+ posts)
I have aswered all the questions thoroughy in my post and if anyone of you has any solid point left in your mind in favour of this GANG then come up as all of these misconceptions should be rectified. As far as belonging to the party is concerned I think all of us should belong to some party as we have to select our representatives in the elections and we should be sincere to this duty. Moreover, I would like to congratulate ftaj1 that he belongs to a party rather than GANG of Target Killers.

You know what your problem is??
You are a fascist..You are not even ready to accept the ground realities..Cuz you are afraid that if...if you accept the reality you will be proved wrong...
 

Night-Hawk

Senator (1k+ posts)
You know what your problem is??
You are a fascist..You are not even ready to accept the ground realities..Cuz you are afraid that if...if you accept the reality you will be proved wrong...


اگر ایم کیو ایم کے ممبر ہو کر آپ دوسروں کو فاشسٹ کہ رہے ہیں تو یقیننا یہ چراغ تلے اندھیرے والی بات ہوئی
 

shiningstar

Minister (2k+ posts)
I am sorry but Civilians of Karachi supports and Supported MQM, People killed were civilians,
this should be evident from the fact that IN 1993 Elections MQM won almost all the seats contested by it in Karachi for provincial Assembly, (The elections were held under Army in KArachi. and the wasnt a single campaign launched in the city , because of Illegal Operation.)

Facts speak my dear friend.
persons killed in the operation were members of the GANG because they were busy in packing dead bodies of their opponents and common men, common men who has no relation with this GANG were very happy after this operation because this operation has made their life peaceful.
Two ways GANG of Target Killers (MQM) used to get vote from people of Karachi, firstly, because they have never allowed any other party to settle there and they have even killed their activists brutally like Taliban used to treat their opponents in Swat and Waziristan area. for example approx 2 years back their gangsters have even stopped head of the party Imran Khan to enter the city, look at the activities of these criminals as this city is their father's property. second they even used to force people to vote in their favour as feudals used to do, look at the feudal mind of so-called moderate gangsters.
Remove these hurdles and let other parties present their point of view freely and fearlessly, you will see that people are so sick of these serial killers that they will hate them and many better options would be generated for them. These criminals have ruined business and life of the people of Karachi and the city remains close for weeks.
 

shiningstar

Minister (2k+ posts)
You know what your problem is??
You are a fascist..You are not even ready to accept the ground realities..Cuz you are afraid that if...if you accept the reality you will be proved wrong...

Reply posted by me above is based on facts, there is nothing self made. If you have any argument then that can be discussed otherwise no one would appreciate this baseless blame.
Actually the problem is that you have only seen one GANG governing Karachi since 20 years, so your mentality is very narrow, soon INSHALLAH when there would be a democrative enviroment in the city of Quaid where every party is presenting his manifesto and having an open debate then you will be attracted by a lot better options and you will not blame anyone as facist.
 

ftaj1

Citizen
I never said that Canadian courts are non-sacred they may be sacred but if they are and if you put cases against any PAK party m sure they will be banned as well...Like it or not your country politics is dirty thats y ppl like IK are left behind......On other side stop hostility against karachi this wont help....Let ppl of karachi decide what they want!! Dont try to enforce your opinion coz it might lead to serious consequences that might threat Nation integrity...Ppl of khi are quiet aware of situation on ground ppl staying 1000 miles away can easily be distorted. So if u really want to legitimate your opinion come up with facts.
 

mehwish_ali

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
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khipk

Senator (1k+ posts)
Vow !!! What a nice way to reply ----- Just brush it off or laugh it off.(clap)

this is no brushing off of laughing off matter,
Everybody from Army general to Nawaz shareef and PP have admited that the allegation levelled against MQM were false, and countless citizens of Karachi were extra judicially killed. Its a widely accepted fact.

But sadly indifferent people like you still believe otherwise.
 

khipk

Senator (1k+ posts)
Reply posted by me above is based on facts, there is nothing self made. If you have any argument then that can be discussed otherwise no one would appreciate this baseless blame.
Actually the problem is that you have only seen one GANG governing Karachi since 20 years, so your mentality is very narrow, soon INSHALLAH when there would be a democrative enviroment in the city of Quaid where every party is presenting his manifesto and having an open debate then you will be attracted by a lot better options and you will not blame anyone as facist.


My dear friend, Karachi is governed by Sindh Govt, not any single party, every party has held its convention here, JI, MQM , PPP, ANP, PML F, PML Q and Sindhu Nationalists groups, openly. Karachi was only given under CDGK's control (excluding law and order and Traffic police) in 2001, from 2001-2005 JI ruled KArachi, because MQM boycoted the elections of an illegal Chief executive, only after 2005 MQM got control of KArachi, and what happened after that everybody knows and everybody has acknowlegded.

Nawaz Shareef in mid 1990s used the tactic of scaring PAkistani peoiple of MQM, and now the same tactic is employed by PTI, to get vote.
 

shiningstar

Minister (2k+ posts)
My dear friend, Karachi is governed by Sindh Govt, not any single party, every party has held its convention here, JI, MQM , PPP, ANP, PML F, PML Q and Sindhu Nationalists groups, openly. Karachi was only given under CDGK's control (excluding law and order and Traffic police) in 2001, from 2001-2005 JI ruled KArachi, because MQM boycoted the elections of an illegal Chief executive, only after 2005 MQM got control of KArachi, and what happened after that everybody knows and everybody has acknowlegded.

Nawaz Shareef in mid 1990s used the tactic of scaring PAkistani peoiple of MQM, and now the same tactic is employed by PTI, to get vote.
Whenever asked about the control of Karachi this GTT(GANG of Target Killers) proudly used to accept that they have 80% control of Karachi and when asked about the killing and law and order problem they just used to isolate themselves from it and try to put all the responsibilty on Sindh Govt. Remember that this GTT has been in all govenments since its abnormal birth, and now they are in Sindh Govt and Central Govt, and they have also got ministries what are they doing there? They can divide Hyderabad using Govt power and can get all the political benefits but they cannot stop killing of innocent people, GANGSTERS. In the previous era of Arbab Ghulam Rahim they have had a Interior Ministry of Sindh, at that time they should be solving law and order problem, cleaning city from the weapons rather than regularizing their illegal lands, what they have done so far? nothing but strengthing their hold on Karachi using weapons.

None of the party you have mentioned goes to Karachi fearlessly, these GANGSTERS are moving there like wolves, just recently one of the leader of JUI has been attacked, ANP and PPP workers are also saving their lives, this is the result of Klashankof culture introduced by their Master, now not even in the country. So many famous ulamas and leaders has been killed in Karachi, no one has even asked about them but when the MPA of the GTT has been killed they have turned the city into a hell killing 92 innocent people and burning their shops and stalls. Has anyone asked for the compensation of those people up to now?? PTI is exactly right that public office holder is decided keeping in view criminal history of that GANGSTER, e.g. look at the IshratulIbad.
 

aftabshah

Councller (250+ posts)
Being a Sindhi and being a Karachite for almost 20 years, I have observed closely MQM through thick`n`thin and am able to compile following facts and comments:


  • MQM before the Musharafs era was scattered with some uncontrolled workers and fame hungry people if you have heard about extortion in the name of MQM I could'nt deny it completely. But once MQM got the chance in Musharraf era they rapidly improve their image in this aspect, they have successfully organized the party and are able to cope with such workers/elements.


  • Militant Wing as MQM is always associated with has also been there and for understandable reason, the thing is when you are living among Feudal Lords that have their own private prisons and army what options do you have and no one can deny PPP consist of 80% Feudal Lords and Also having Don as Pir Pagarah living around you can expect what are circumstances. Incase of other Party I dont need to mention about ANP the party which consider weapons as their honor what could be worst than this about PML (N) claiming to be liberal is far from the fact the party was associated with establishment and it is a bitter truth establishment has been their Militant wing as one refer if terrorizing people.


  • If we talk about Leadership looking at other parties feels like one man show considering PML-N, PPP, PTI or even PMLQ, only MQM and JUI are the only parties with electoral structure having said so JUI will be crossed out with reference to Religious/Political combination they represent plus lack of visionary. So it comes to MQM who has Rabita Committee as their think tank and are able to come up with sound decisions and vision as we have seen one of its reflection in the shape of NazimeKarachi.


  • Talking about MQM joining every other Government, this sound bad as it is heard but the ground reality can be judged by looking at PTI, Imran Khan is truly loyal and visionary person but his problem comes when he thinks he is the only one and this left him out alone so the party has been left as an Internet Party. The thing is in order to win or loose you have to stay in the ground.

The Bottom line is MQM may not be the best party but looking at the others it is better for sure.

remove bandwagon effect from your comments and situation will be very clear for every sindhi
 

Night-Hawk

Senator (1k+ posts)
No concrete argument has so far been put forth by MQM's apologists to prove my allegations wrong. All I have heard is the same rhetoric of "agencies" , "past discrimination against mohajirs" etc etc --- the things of past, but "strong enough to legalize and justify" their criminal past, felonious present and possibly thuggish future.

The same story has so far been repeated with twisted language and re-furbished terms. What I was expecting here was a comprehensive and thorough negation of stuff published against them in the newspapers other than "the london post", "Jasarat" , "takbeer" and "Ummat" (which in your words are not credible). Of course no one would expect martians to descend upon Karachi and expose you.

Regarding Canadian Federal Court's decision, I have always maintained that the court may have limited bounds within Canada (different provinces and territories have different legal systems and constitution), but it certainly deals with immigrants related issues and is next to the Canadian Apex Court. Any decision here (which happened twice or thrice) reflects something wrong with MQM. It is only because of the same bandwagon that Canada shares with USA now a days, that MQM keeps its offices in Canada. Problem also exists in our political system in which killers, thugs, feudal lords, smugglers, and butchers come in power time and again and even start representing our country, like we see the case of Mr. Zardari. He was demonised in the Western (English) Press by calling him and his wife the late prime minister "The princess and the playboy" for his corruption, illegal money and kickbacks, but every time they came in power they were given state protocol in UK. Secondly MQM per se is not harmful to Canada, however the previous decision was made in the light of its criminal acts back at home purely keeping in the view organization's bad human rights record. So this Calgary photo session is quite conceivable and impresses no one.

Human rights record of MQM, illustrated by a list organizations other than government of Pakistan are a testimony to MQM's criminal past and brutal killings. No one comes up from MQM's camp with solid rebuttal of these charges.
 
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ftaj1

Citizen
No concrete argument has so far been put forth by MQM's apologists to prove my allegations wrong. All I have heard is the same rhetoric of "agencies" , "past discrimination against mohajirs" etc etc --- the things of past, but "strong enough to legalize and justify" their criminal past, felonious present and possibly thuggish future.

The same story has so far been repeated with twisted language and re-furbished terms. What I was expecting here was a comprehensive and thorough negation of stuff published against them in the newspapers other than "the london post", "Jasarat" , "takbeer" and "Ummat" (which in your words are not credible). Of course no one would expect martians to descend upon Karachi and expose you.

Regarding Canadian Federal Court's decision, I have always maintained that the court may have limited bounds within Canada (different provinces and territories have different legal systems and constitution), but it certainly deals with immigrants related issues and is next to the Canadian Apex Court. Any decision here (which happened twice or thrice) reflects something wrong with MQM. It is only because of the same bandwagon that Canada shares with USA now a days, that MQM keeps its offices in Canada. Problem also exists in our political system in which killers, thugs, feudal lords, smugglers, and butchers come in power time and again and even start representing our country, like we see the case of Mr. Zardari. He was demonised in the Western (English) Press by calling him and his wife the late prime minister "The princess and the playboy" for his corruption, illegal money and kickbacks, but every time they came in power they were given state protocol in UK. Secondly MQM per se is not harmful to Canada, however the previous decision was made in the light of its criminal acts back at home purely keeping in the view organization's bad human rights record. So this Calgary photo session is quite conceivable and impresses no one.

Human rights record of MQM, illustrated by a list organizations other than government of Pakistan are a testimony to MQM's criminal past and brutal killings. No one comes up from MQM's camp with solid rebuttal of these charges.

Mr.Hawk according to your defination MQM is militant and all other parties are innocent victims: What world on earth you are living ? Once again i will remind you let people of karachi decide Fate of MQM....Ground realities speaks more than the words uttered. So if MQM keeps on going u should give up!!!!
 

YAHYA87

Senator (1k+ posts)
No concrete argument has so far been put forth by MQM's apologists to prove my allegations wrong. All I have heard is the same rhetoric of "agencies" , "past discrimination against mohajirs" etc etc --- the things of past, but "strong enough to legalize and justify" their criminal past, felonious present and possibly thuggish future.

The same story has so far been repeated with twisted language and re-furbished terms. What I was expecting here was a comprehensive and thorough negation of stuff published against them in the newspapers other than "the london post", "Jasarat" , "takbeer" and "Ummat" (which in your words are not credible). Of course no one would expect martians to descend upon Karachi and expose you.

Regarding Canadian Federal Court's decision, I have always maintained that the court may have limited bounds within Canada (different provinces and territories have different legal systems and constitution), but it certainly deals with immigrants related issues and is next to the Canadian Apex Court. Any decision here (which happened twice or thrice) reflects something wrong with MQM. It is only because of the same bandwagon that Canada shares with USA now a days, that MQM keeps its offices in Canada. Problem also exists in our political system in which killers, thugs, feudal lords, smugglers, and butchers come in power time and again and even start representing our country, like we see the case of Mr. Zardari. He was demonised in the Western (English) Press by calling him and his wife the late prime minister "The princess and the playboy" for his corruption, illegal money and kickbacks, but every time they came in power they were given state protocol in UK. Secondly MQM per se is not harmful to Canada, however the previous decision was made in the light of its criminal acts back at home purely keeping in the view organization's bad human rights record. So this Calgary photo session is quite conceivable and impresses no one.

Human rights record of MQM, illustrated by a list organizations other than government of Pakistan are a testimony to MQM's criminal past and brutal killings. No one comes up from MQM's camp with solid rebuttal of these charges.
What else CONCRETE you want against MQM when MQM havent been convicted in any of those cases which they are accused of????They do have violence but all of that was REACTIONARY in which they were left no other choice to anything except ciolenec and that is what creator of this thread has tried to explain...I can understand that you dont want to believe any of those things associated with MQM as two things comes between you people EGO and HAVING NO EXPERIENCE OF ARMY OPERATION....both of these things wont allow you to believe anything as everyone knows that their is only ONE PROVINCE where no Army operation of 1992 Karachi and Baluchistan magnitude operation ever happened, you never saw curfews outside your house for weeks so you have no idea about all that that is why you only perceived this as RHETORIC but here for a Karachiite that was worse nightmare...And even your EGO against MQM also dont allow you to have iota of understanding what they went through and what shaped them like that....

Have you ever read 90% of posts from MQM bashers in this website or ain any other website????OK if not every MQM bashers then at least your owned posts just tell me what new have you ever posted against MQM???Same old repeated excuse that they are militants and another Naseerulah Baber stuff posted over and over and over...At one point you people argue that MQM Controls Karachi but on the other hand you people have no exp*****ion of HOW IN THE HELL AN ORGANIZATION COULD CONTROL 20MILLION PEOPLE WITHOUT HAVING NO SUPPORT OF AMONG THEM???You people called us Paid agent but look around in this website you wont find many people who arent MQM supporter+Karachiite...So first check your own posts before saying that we repeat all those crap....Talking about Umaat, Jisarat type News paper then in journalism everyone knows their affiliations with Jamatees and that is why their reports are just perceived as "Jamatee Propaganda" due to that they have no credibility...Their are two channels which have exact same position in media like METRO ONE and DHOOM TV they are perceived as MQM's media now tell me have you ever seen MQM supporter quoting those two Channel's report????Because this would also be not credible like Umaat and Jisarat type propaganda that is why no MQM supporter quote those reports and also ask you people of same thing as quote from some unbiased and reliable and credible media source instead of one sided propaganda.....


Regarding Canadian Court then Canadian court had problems with two MQM workers not whole organization for some reason so applying that Canada has banned organization is totally Baseless...If you know about British Influence on Canada then you would acknowledge Canada Justice system is almost same as British Justice system and if MQM's cheif is allowed to stay in Britain then how can they ban them in Canada when they are practicing almost same laws????Another question is that if MQM is terrorist according to their court then what should be Canada's position for Govt. of Pakistan in which MQM is part of???That is very simple stuff for even a lay man to understand only if he get rid of EGO and BIAS from his head their is no rocket science required but simple removal of Bias and EGO....Talking about PPP then PPP have never cared about such things because they have got good personal contacts with many most influential people of those countries while on the other hand MQM dont have such thing as just name me one British most influential personality which Altaf Hussain has contacts of???So things are different for MQM in this regard they have only one way around and that is clear their names from cases which were filed against them...That is the only reason why they went against NRO despite they were most beneficiaries of that...Further that they have also proved themselves from Good Governance as well as their efforts in development during previous Govt. had been praised by whole world Mustafa Kamal a moyor of Karachi was Given State Protocol in his visit to USA...So they have always been trying hard to prove themselves best people for administration of Pakistan unlike PPP which has no concern with anything about Pakistan except POWER....Talking about Human rights record then everyone knows about the reality of those records that were compiled back in 1990s BY THE HELP FROM GOVT. OF PAKISTAN....So you should better dont speak about those things as those arent impartial due to help of a party(Govt. of Pakistan) which was against them....BTW they are THIRD ARTY sources which means they are COMPILED through Media reports and other SOURCES which are directly Involve in REPORTING(First Party) and you know back in 1990s scenario regarding Media and Govt.'s position against MQM and based on that you are quoting those reports then what else could I say....
 

mehwish_ali

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
No concrete argument has so far been put forth by MQM's apologists to prove my allegations wrong. All I have heard is the same rhetoric of "agencies" , "past discrimination against mohajirs" etc etc --- the things of past, but "strong enough to legalize and justify" their criminal past, felonious present and possibly thuggish future.

ان صاحب کا دعوی ہے کہ کوئی ٹھوس ثبوت نہیں پیش کیا گیا۔

اور میرا دعوی ہے کہ ان کے دل و آنکھیں نفرت میں اندھی ہو چکی ہیں اور انہیں کوئی ثبوت نظر ہی نہیں آ سکتا۔

اگر اُن ہزاروں معصوم مہاجروں کی ارواح خود اتر کر نیچے آ جائیں اور اس ماورائے عدالت قتل کی گواہی دیں تب بھی یہ اسے بطور ثبوت ماننے سے انکار کر کے یہی جھوٹے الزامات دہراتے رہیں گے۔

اگر اللہ تعالی سہراب گوٹھ میں موجود لاکھوں کلاشنکوفوں اور راکٹ لانچروں کو قوت گویائی دے دے، اور وہ بھی اٹھ کر گواہی دیں، تو بھی ان حضرت کو یہ سب فتنے ہرگز ہرگز نظر آنے والے نہیں۔

انکی آنکھیں ایسی اندھی ہیں کہ انہیں آج تک کئی دھائیوں پر محیط سہراب گوٹھ کا اسلحہ نظر نہیں آ سکا، تو بھلا اور ثبوت کیا نظر آئیں گے۔

اتنے سالہا سال گذر جانے کے بعد حیدر آباد جانے والی ریلی میں شہید ہونے والے شہدا نظر نہیں آئے، قصبہ کالونی اور علی گڑھ کالونی میں جو سہراب گوٹھ کے جرائم پیشہ افراد نے قتل عام مچایا اور 300 سے زائد معصوم مہاجروں کو قتل کر دیا تو آج تک انکے اندھے دل کو وہ نظر نہیں آیا۔ تو پھر انکو اور کونسے ثبوت نظر آ سکتے ہیں؟

انکو تو یہ بھی نظر نہیں آیا کہ جب مشرف حکومت میں حقیقی جیسے قاتل دہشتگردوں کی پشت پناہی ختم ہوئی تو کراچی میں ایک گولی چلائے بغیر امن قائم ہو گیا حالانکہ پہلے چار سال جماعت اسلامی چار فیصد ووٹوں کی خیران سے حکومت بنائے بیٹھی تھی۔

یہ رو لیں، پیٹ لیں، مگر ان سوالات کے جوابات نہیں دے سکتے۔ زیادہ اسے زیادہ ایسی ہی منافقتیں دہراتے رہیں گے اور اپنے جھوٹے الزامات کو بار بار یونہی پیش کرتے رہیں گے۔

 
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