Kasab's Israeli connection-Terror on tape, Kasab giggles

[Nepali Pandit]

Terror on tape, Kasab giggles
A tape played in court in Mumbai on Tuesday drove home some spine-chilling truths about the Mumbai attacks.

The scariest part of the 16-minute tape, played out during the trial of lone arrested terrorist Ajmal Kasab, is a conversation during the 26/11 attack between one of the other terrorists and their Pakistani handler. "This is just the trailer. The government should see what's coming," says the handler.

The tape also has a conversation, between an Israeli negotiator in Washington and one of the terrorists at Nariman House. Even as the NSG was being called in, the Israeli government was apparently willing to negotiate - as long as their hostages were unharmed.

Israeli negotiator: We have contacted the Government in New Delhi, but they need two hours and to arrange for someone to call you. But this is on the condition that they (the hostages) are not harmed.

Terrorist: Tell them that two hours is too long.

http://www.ndtv.com/news/india/terror_on_tape_kasab_giggles.php

Israeli negotiator: We have heard rumours that they are unconscious

Terrorist: They are not just conscious, they are fine. We have not even slapped them.

The Israeli official even asked the terrorists for demands. They asked for the release of their friend, Kasab, who had just been nabbed by the Mumbai Police. Kasab giggled in court, when this portion of the tape was played out.

The Pakistani handlers were also monitoring the Indian media to guide their operation.

Pakistani handler: We want you to talk to the media. Tell them that we want to negotiate. We want to solve this problem. But don't tell them how many hostages we have, or how many of us are here.

Hostage: Ok

Pakistani handler: This will give you a chance to live.

Hostage: When will you release us?

Pakistani handler: As soon as they meet our demands

Hostage: Can I talk from my heart?

Paksitani handler: Ok. Tell me what you want to say

Hostage: (Do) Nothing that will make anybody lose. After all, we have already lost enough.

The conversations underline the role of Pakistani nationals in the 26/11 attacks, and are critical evidence in court.

 

[sarbakaf]

pandit geee
can you tell me was kassab in mumbai for a phot shoot or terrorist attack...u hardly got any pictures of any other terrorist but mr kassab is every where posing for ur "hidden cameras".

and isn't that a coincidence that he was the one who was caught ....??

by the way ....
look at evidence given by indian officials......a pakistani news paper, chewinggum wrap,rubber boat , a call from pakistan.....what a load of bullshit

so pandit gee..indian public needs to open its mind and think....( i doubt tough ....it needs brain and balls to think and dare)

any way ...carry on with ur terrorist bullshit....
we are not bothered at all ....

 

[Nepali Pandit]

pandit geee
can you tell me was kassab in mumbai for a phot shoot or terrorist attack...u hardly got any pictures of any other terrorist but mr kassab is every where posing for ur "hidden cameras".

and isn't that a coincidence that he was the one who was caught ....??

by the way ....
look at evidence given by indian officials......a pakistani news paper, chewinggum wrap,rubber boat , a call from pakistan.....what a load of bullshit

so pandit gee..indian public needs to open its mind and think....( i doubt tough ....it needs brain and balls to think and dare)

any way ...carry on with ur terrorist bullshit....
we are not bothered at all ....

I didn't want to convince you because whole world knows about this. You like it or not your country ( by that i mean agencies, military and some elites) is the biggest supporter of terrorism in the world. There are few things which you guys don't believe in such as 9/11, mumbai carnage and common sense.

 

[hassam]

Look at the Saffaron Band in Kassab's hand. Does it tell us something?

 

[dynamic5]

hahahahahaha,,yeh pandit ji,,common sense,,,,first ask your ministry what they have handed over to us on the name of EVIDENCE...,,and yeh he was right ,,,why kasab is in every photo,,,looks like a bollywood movie,,,man if pakistan did that than u r not also SEEDHAY SADHAY SADHU OR PANDIT,,,u have done more in balochistan and waziristan ,,than what pakistan (what you believe) did in india .

What pakistan is bearing now,,,u and shining india cant bear my friend,,for that u need resilience ,,,,which u dnt have ,,saw on 26/11 ,,,,took 72 hours to unfold this blockbuster bollywood flick.

Its a matter of time,we will be out of this mess,,,which you and your well wishers created for us ,,though we are partly responsible for that as well .

 

[desicad]

Look at the Saffaron Band in Kassab's hand. Does it tell us something?

Can you let us know what does it tell? Thanks.

 

[sher_khan]

pandit geee
can you tell me was kassab in mumbai for a phot shoot or terrorist attack...u hardly got any pictures of any other terrorist but mr kassab is every where posing for ur "hidden cameras".

and isn't that a coincidence that he was the one who was caught ....??

by the way ....
look at evidence given by indian officials......a pakistani news paper, chewinggum wrap,rubber boat , a call from pakistan.....what a load of bullshit

so pandit gee..indian public needs to open its mind and think....( i doubt tough ....it needs brain and balls to think and dare)

any way ...carry on with ur terrorist bullshit....
we are not bothered at all ....

I didn't want to convince you because whole world knows about this. You like it or not your country ( by that i mean agencies, military and some elites) is the biggest supporter of terrorism in the world. There are few things which you guys don't believe in such as 9/11, mumbai carnage and common sense.

TO N"PANDIT AND DESICAD:

Talking about common sense, linked below is my post regarding the unanswered questions and facts of Mumbai attacks. I posted this analysis of mine long time a go. No indian is yet to respond to it. Clearly there were pakistani nationals involved but there were people from other countries, including india, also involved. It is my strong believe that the number of the attackers was more than what Indian government has told us and Indians were among them. Hence putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent.

I would like to hear your views on the video clips in the post.

http://siasat.pk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=901

 

[desicad]

TO N"PANDIT AND DESICAD:

Talking about common sense, linked below is my post regarding the unanswered questions and facts of Mumbai attacks. I posted this analysis of mine long time a go. No indian is yet to respond to it. Clearly there were pakistani nationals involved but there were people from other countries, including india, also involved. It is my strong believe that the number of the attackers was more than what Indian government has told us and Indians were among them. Hence putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent.

I would like to hear your views on the video clips in the post.

http://siasat.pk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=901

Don't know what you are trying to prove here dy posting an old thread dated Jan 2. 2009. After that a lot of ground has been covered and India has said that there were couple of Indian nationals involved. And Pakistani govt has admitted that the attack was masterminded and carried out by Pakistan based militant group LET. You need to come out of the denial mode, sooner the better.

 

[sher_khan]

TO N"PANDIT AND DESICAD:

Talking about common sense, linked below is my post regarding the unanswered questions and facts of Mumbai attacks. I posted this analysis of mine long time a go. No indian is yet to respond to it. Clearly there were pakistani nationals involved but there were people from other countries, including india, also involved. It is my strong believe that the number of the attackers was more than what Indian government has told us and Indians were among them. Hence putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent.

I would like to hear your views on the video clips in the post.

http://siasat.pk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=901

Don't know what you are trying to prove here dy posting an old thread dated Jan 2. 2009. After that a lot of ground has been covered and India has said that there were couple of Indian nationals involved. And Pakistani govt has admitted that the attack was masterminded and carried out by Pakistan based militant group LET. You need to come out of the denial mode, sooner the better.

Very convenient of you to cherry pick the items from my post. I already had mentioned that the post was an old one.
The point of inking it to this thread was that none of the questions were answered pertaining to the numbers of attackers and their nationalities.

You are trying to mislead the people when you say that the indian government has accepted that Indians were involved. Indian government has accepted the indians were involved in "assisting" the the attack. Not that thay actually physically conducted the attack by themselves, like Kasab did. One terrorist's telephone conversation with the anchor clearly shows the admission of the terrorist accepting that he was an indian. Yet the whole Indian media and Indian people have ignored it. Nor has Indian government accepted that Indians along with the pakistanis also conducted the attack.

Of course I meant that Pakistanis were also involved and that is why I said, "putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent."

Indian government has only covered as much of the ground in the investigation as it found was politically convenient. Or at least has disclosed as mush as it could only blame pakistanis. There were indians directly involved as depicted by one terrorist's personal communication in the video clip.

I can understand your government's selective disclosure of the facts but I don't understand your cherry picking from my post and not tackling the issue of number of terrorists involved and the direct involvement of Indians who conducted the attacks.

Please prove me wrong by showing a news article or a news clip, which shows that indian government disclosed that some Indians also directly conducted the attacks and killed people during Mumbai attacks. I have shown you a clip of a terrorist claiming that he and his accomplices were indians.

Open up your eyes. Follow logic. You don't have to help your government deceiving people, including indians. Get out of gullible mode.

 

[desicad]

Very convenient of you to cherry pick the items from my post. I already had mentioned that the post was an old one.
The point of inking it to this thread was that none of the questions were answered pertaining to the numbers of attackers and their nationalities.

The questions were answered and claims of the terrorist(attackers) that they were form Deccan Hydeabad were proved false. Only ten were directly involved in carrying out the attacks (9 of them were killed in the operation). Here is the list:
2 at Chhatrapati Shivjai Terminus and Cama Hospital: Ismail Khan alias Abu Ismail from Dera Ismail Khan, Mohammed Ajmal Amir Kasab alias Abu Mujahid from Okara
4 at Taj Hotel: Hafeez Arshad alias Bada Abdul Rehman from Multan, Javed alias Abu Ali from Okara, Shoaib alias Soheb from Sialkot and Nazeer alias Abu Umer from Faisalabad
2 at Jewish community centre (Nariman House): Nasir alias Abu Umar from Faisalabad and Babar Imran alias Abu Akasha from Multan
2 at Trident Oberoi hotel: Abdul Rehman alias Abdul Rehman Chhota from Multan and Fahadullah alias Abu Fahad from Okara

You are trying to mislead the people when you say that the indian government has accepted that Indians were involved. Indian government has accepted the indians were involved in "assisting" the the attack. Not that thay actually physically conducted the attack by themselves, like Kasab did. One terrorist's telephone conversation with the anchor clearly shows the admission of the terrorist accepting that he was an indian. Yet the whole Indian media and Indian people have ignored it. Nor has Indian government accepted that Indians along with the pakistanis also conducted the attack.

Its not me, but you are trying to mislead people by indulging in pure speculation and conspiracy therioies. Why will Indian Govt. accept something which is not true? The terrorist (first video) claimed that he is from Hyderabad, but if you listen to the conversation carefully you will hear that at one point he was asking his partner in Punjabi "dasso demand, demand kya hai". The other terrorist (second video) Imran Babbar was from Multan.

Of course I meant that Pakistanis were also involved and that is why I said, "putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent."
Indian government has only covered as much of the ground in the investigation as it found was politically convenient. Or at least has disclosed as mush as it could only blame pakistanis. There were indians directly involved as depicted by one terrorist's personal communication in the video clip.
I can understand your government's selective disclosure of the facts but I don't understand your cherry picking from my post and not tackling the issue of number of terrorists involved and the direct involvement of Indians who conducted the attacks.
Please prove me wrong by showing a news article or a news clip, which shows that indian government disclosed that some Indians also directly conducted the attacks and killed people during Mumbai attacks. I have shown you a clip of a terrorist claiming that he and his accomplices were indians..

I already answered that earlier that the terrorist's claim regarding they being Indian are false. Even Kasab in his testimony has said they were 10 who were selected after training and all from Pakistan. Now you will argue he was forced to, well then there is no end to this discussion in that case and I can't help it if you choose to live in denial.

Open up your eyes. Follow logic. You don't have to help your government deceiving people, including indians. Get out of gullible mode.

I think you actually need to open your eyes, mind and everything and accept the truth.
Having said all these I don't say that India doesn't have its share of terrorists as there were many other blasts last year (atleast 3-4) prior to Mumbai, but here we are discussing Mumbai attacks only.

 

[jimpack]

Look at the Saffaron Band in Kassab's hand. Does it tell us something?

He is Zaid Hamid Part -2.

All these guys are talking in Zaid Hamid's language because it is very easy to say that as it suits to their satisfaction and not to accept their own blunders and mistakes.

Pakistan is the international HUB of world Terrorism. This is the fact acknowledged by international community.

What the hell was then Rheman Malik saying in his press conference regarding Kasab and Pakistani connection.

If i wear a muslim skull cap - do i become a muslim. ?????

 

[sher_khan]

Very convenient of you to cherry pick the items from my post. I already had mentioned that the post was an old one.
The point of inking it to this thread was that none of the questions were answered pertaining to the numbers of attackers and their nationalities.

The questions were answered and claims of the terrorist(attackers) that they were form Deccan Hydeabad were proved false. Only ten were directly involved in carrying out the attacks (9 of them were killed in the operation). Here is the list:
2 at Chhatrapati Shivjai Terminus and Cama Hospital: Ismail Khan alias Abu Ismail from Dera Ismail Khan, Mohammed Ajmal Amir Kasab alias Abu Mujahid from Okara
4 at Taj Hotel: Hafeez Arshad alias Bada Abdul Rehman from Multan, Javed alias Abu Ali from Okara, Shoaib alias Soheb from Sialkot and Nazeer alias Abu Umer from Faisalabad
2 at Jewish community centre (Nariman House): Nasir alias Abu Umar from Faisalabad and Babar Imran alias Abu Akasha from Multan
2 at Trident Oberoi hotel: Abdul Rehman alias Abdul Rehman Chhota from Multan and Fahadullah alias Abu Fahad from Okara

This information was provided to you by the government of india. The same government which has not been able to obtain the information pertaining to the culprits of Sikh and Muslim massacres. No one significant has been arrested or punished for the massacres of Sikhs in Delhi, massacres of Muslims in Gujarat and the people involved in desecrating the Babari Mosque. What makes you think that the information stated above is "complete"? That is, there are no missing people on the list.

You are trying to mislead the people when you say that the indian government has accepted that Indians were involved. Indian government has accepted the indians were involved in "assisting" the the attack. Not that thay actually physically conducted the attack by themselves, like Kasab did. One terrorist's telephone conversation with the anchor clearly shows the admission of the terrorist accepting that he was an indian. Yet the whole Indian media and Indian people have ignored it. Nor has Indian government accepted that Indians along with the pakistanis also conducted the attack.

Its not me, but you are trying to mislead people by indulging in pure speculation and conspiracy therioies. Why will Indian Govt. accept something which is not true? The terrorist (first video) claimed that he is from Hyderabad, but if you listen to the conversation carefully you will hear that at one point he was asking his partner in Punjabi "dasso demand, demand kya hai". The other terrorist (second video) Imran Babbar was from Multan.

So i guess you are conveniently going to embrace what ever the terrorist says that fits your preconceived stance on the matter. You are OK if the terrorist says that he is a muslim, no problem there. You are OK if he says that he is doing Jihad. No problem their because it fits your stance. However, if he tells you that he is an indian then he is a liar because it does no fit your preconceived notion that only pakistanis can do it. You can't cherry pick the facts.

Also, there are lot muslims in India who are capable of speaking more than one language. Punjabi being one of them. Punjabi is not only spoken in Pakistan but also in Indian Punjab and Haryana. I reside in Toronto. There are IndianPujabis in Canada who have been living here for lat 30 years but still mostly communicate in Punjabi and are not fluent in english. Does this make them non-canadian?

Imran Babar may be from Multan, as per your government (he did not claim that in the video clip), but he did mention in the interview that there are five terrorists with him. Look at the list that you have stated above, it says only two people. Don't come up with the argument that he was telling the truth about being a muslim and the reasons he was upset about the things that were being done to Muslims in your country but he lied about other things. You can't cherry pick what ever is convenient for you from his statements.

[quote:2z5savyv]Of course I meant that Pakistanis were also involved and that is why I said, "putting the blame solely on Pakistani nationals is misleading and fraudulent."
Indian government has only covered as much of the ground in the investigation as it found was politically convenient. Or at least has disclosed as mush as it could only blame pakistanis. There were indians directly involved as depicted by one terrorist's personal communication in the video clip.
I can understand your government's selective disclosure of the facts but I don't understand your cherry picking from my post and not tackling the issue of number of terrorists involved and the direct involvement of Indians who conducted the attacks.
Please prove me wrong by showing a news article or a news clip, which shows that indian government disclosed that some Indians also directly conducted the attacks and killed people during Mumbai attacks. I have shown you a clip of a terrorist claiming that he and his accomplices were indians..

I already answered that earlier that the terrorist's claim regarding they being Indian are false. Even Kasab in his testimony has said they were 10 who were selected after training and all from Pakistan. Now you will argue he was forced to, well then there is no end to this discussion in that case and I can't help it if you choose to live in denial.

So let me see. You are going to deny the statements of one terrorist but will accept the other's. Mind you one terrorist knew that he was going to die with in next 24 hours or so while he was talking to the media, while the other is under your government's custody (exposed to torture and what not) and wants to get over with his trial and psychological stress, regardless of the result of the trial. Your logic is pedestrian at its best.

What I don't get is that why would indians be only involved in indirect way to these attacks? Why can't they conduct these attacks? In the past Indian Muslims were involved in terrorism on indian soil. Why is it such a far fetched idea that Indians along with the pakistanis were involved in this one?

Open up your eyes. Follow logic. You don't have to help your government deceiving people, including indians. Get out of gullible mode.

I think you actually need to open your eyes, mind and everything and accept the truth.
Having said all these I don't say that India doesn't have its share of terrorists as there were many other blasts last year (atleast 3-4) prior to Mumbai, but here we are discussing Mumbai attacks only.

I'll let the readers decide who needs to be open minded.

[/quote:2z5savyv]

 

[desicad]

The questions were answered and claims of the terrorist(attackers) that they were form Deccan Hydeabad were proved false. Only ten were directly involved in carrying out the attacks (9 of them were killed in the operation). Here is the list:
2 at Chhatrapati Shivjai Terminus and Cama Hospital: Ismail Khan alias Abu Ismail from Dera Ismail Khan, Mohammed Ajmal Amir Kasab alias Abu Mujahid from Okara
4 at Taj Hotel: Hafeez Arshad alias Bada Abdul Rehman from Multan, Javed alias Abu Ali from Okara, Shoaib alias Soheb from Sialkot and Nazeer alias Abu Umer from Faisalabad
2 at Jewish community centre (Nariman House): Nasir alias Abu Umar from Faisalabad and Babar Imran alias Abu Akasha from Multan
2 at Trident Oberoi hotel: Abdul Rehman alias Abdul Rehman Chhota from Multan and Fahadullah alias Abu Fahad from Okara

This information was provided to you by the government of india. The same government which has not been able to obtain the information pertaining to the culprits of Sikh and Muslim massacres. No one significant has been arrested or punished for the massacres of Sikhs in Delhi, massacres of Muslims in Gujarat and the people involved in desecrating the Babari Mosque. What makes you think that the information stated above is "complete"? That is, there are no missing people on the list.

Yes the information was provided by govt. of India. Who else do you think will provide the information? If govt. of Pakistan has any information then it should pass on that and if not then get the information from the persons arrested in the case and let the whole world know. Unless I have anything contarary from any other source I will naturally think that information given by Indian govt. is complete. Let me ask you why you think that information is incomplete and there were more than 10 attackers involved? If you have anything concrete then share it.

Its not me, but you are trying to mislead people by indulging in pure speculation and conspiracy therioies. Why will Indian Govt. accept something which is not true? The terrorist (first video) claimed that he is from Hyderabad, but if you listen to the conversation carefully you will hear that at one point he was asking his partner in Punjabi "dasso demand, demand kya hai". The other terrorist (second video) Imran Babbar was from Multan.

So i guess you are conveniently going to embrace what ever the terrorist says that fits your preconceived stance on the matter. You are OK if the terrorist says that he is a muslim, no problem there. You are OK if he says that he is doing Jihad. No problem their because it fits your stance. However, if he tells you that he is an indian then he is a liar because it does no fit your preconceived notion that only pakistanis can do it. You can't cherry pick the facts.

You are fond of this phrase' cherry picking'. Anyway I am not trying to cherry pick and also not going by what the terrorist says. I am just going by the proofs provided so far and the recorded conversation and that is accepted by Pakistan govt., atleast most part of it. It makes sense that all of them were told not reveal their real identity and pose as Indians so that LET does not come under fire and they can carry out attacks in future.

Also, there are lot muslims in India who are capable of speaking more than one language. Punjabi being one of them. Punjabi is not only spoken in Pakistan but also in Indian Punjab and Haryana. I reside in Toronto. There are IndianPujabis in Canada who have been living here for lat 30 years but still mostly communicate in Punjabi and are not fluent in english. Does this make them non-canadian?

Agreed they are capable of more than one languages, but the point is a terrorist claiming to be from deccan Hyderabad will not talk in Punjabi in the heat of the moment. A decccan muslim in very rare case will know Punjabi and even if he knows a little bit will not talk in that language in such a situation. Your Canadian example infact proves my point that a person's first insticnt is to speak in the mother tougue and more so under such circumstances.

Imrran Babar may be from Multan, as per your government (he did not claim that in the video clip), but he did mention in the interview that there are five terrorists with him. Look at the list that you have stated above, it says only two people. Don't come up with the argument that he was telling the truth about being a muslim and the reasons he was upset about the things that were being done to Muslims in your country but he lied about other things. You can't cherry pick what ever is convenient for you from his statements.

Ok I will not cherry pick here (your favourite), but why should I believe Imran and not Kasab. So the other three (assuming they were five in total) can be Indian or Pakistanis, right? We don't know that yet and Imran didn't clarify that. If the Kasab or Indian Govt. is lying about the total number of attackers then let the Pakistani govt. come out with something different.

I already answered that earlier that the terrorist's claim regarding they being Indian are false. Even Kasab in his testimony has said they were 10 who were selected after training and all from Pakistan. Now you will argue he was forced to, well then there is no end to this discussion in that case and I can't help it if you choose to live in denial.

So let me see. You are going to deny the statements of one terrorist but will accept the other's. Mind you one terrorist knew that he was going to die with in next 24 hours or so while he was talking to the media, while the other is under your government's custody (exposed to torture and what not) and wants to get over with his trial and psychological stress, regardless of the result of the trial. Your logic is pedestrian at its best.

I am not going to put my money on any of the statements by the terrorists. I think you are confused, there is a difference between a person who is going to die after 24 hrs or more and a dying person's statement. You want to say that Kasab was tortured not to name any Indians even if they were involved? The argument is laughable. He is enjoying himself at the trial, laughing, smiling, By the way the trial is open and not closed door. Does Pakistani govt. has the guts to conduct an open trial? The answer is no because then the ISI link will be exposed to the world.

What I don't get is that why would indians be only involved in indirect way to these attacks? Why can't they conduct these attacks? In the past Indian Muslims were involved in terrorism on indian soil. Why is it such a far fetched idea that Indians along with the pakistanis were involved in this one?

I have already said that Indians were involved in other attacks on Indian soil. The idea put forward by you is not a far fetched idea at all , but after all its still an idea and pure speculation and nothing to support except a statement by the terrorist. Even if we assume for the sake of argument that there 10 Pakistanis and 10 Indians involved and 19 were killed. And if the Indian govt. had lied and said that there were only 11 and one was Indian, it would not have made the case any weaker against Pakistan. Don't you think it makes sense?

I think you actually need to open your eyes, mind and everything and accept the truth.
Having said all these I don't say that India doesn't have its share of terrorists as there were many other blasts last year (atleast 3-4) prior to Mumbai, but here we are discussing Mumbai attacks only.

I'll let the readers decide who needs to be open minded.

[/quote]
The point is your whole argument is based on a statement from a terrorist. Are you 100% sure that the Indian govt. is lying or you just have fancy doubts to lessen your guilt? You can atleast wait for the findings from the trial in your country or you think it is never going to happen. And if you have something to prove your point then share it, if not then as I said earlier its speculation and conspiracy theories.
Yes let the readers decide.

 

[sher_khan]

The questions were answered and claims of the terrorist(attackers) that they were form Deccan Hydeabad were proved false. Only ten were directly involved in carrying out the attacks (9 of them were killed in the operation). Here is the list:
2 at Chhatrapati Shivjai Terminus and Cama Hospital: Ismail Khan alias Abu Ismail from Dera Ismail Khan, Mohammed Ajmal Amir Kasab alias Abu Mujahid from Okara
4 at Taj Hotel: Hafeez Arshad alias Bada Abdul Rehman from Multan, Javed alias Abu Ali from Okara, Shoaib alias Soheb from Sialkot and Nazeer alias Abu Umer from Faisalabad
2 at Jewish community centre (Nariman House): Nasir alias Abu Umar from Faisalabad and Babar Imran alias Abu Akasha from Multan
2 at Trident Oberoi hotel: Abdul Rehman alias Abdul Rehman Chhota from Multan and Fahadullah alias Abu Fahad from Okara

This information was provided to you by the government of india. The same government which has not been able to obtain the information pertaining to the culprits of Sikh and Muslim massacres. No one significant has been arrested or punished for the massacres of Sikhs in Delhi, massacres of Muslims in Gujarat and the people involved in desecrating the Babari Mosque. What makes you think that the information stated above is "complete"? That is, there are no missing people on the list.

Yes the information was provided by govt. of India. Who else do you think will provide the information? If govt. of Pakistan has any information then it should pass on that and if not then get the information from the persons arrested in the case and let the whole world know.

Since the information is provided by the indian government, wouldn't yo agree that the content is questionable? Doesn't indian government have a poor track record in solving the terrorist incidents perpetrated by the indians on there own soil? Evidently, there have been no significant resolutions for the people involved in Sikh (Delhi) and Muslim (Gujarat) massacres. After so many years passed, the investigations have yet not been able to give justice to the victims of these massacres. What gives you the impression that Mumbai attacks related investigation is complete and perfect?

Unless I have anything contarary from any other source I will naturally think that information given by Indian govt. is complete. Let me ask you why you think that information is incomplete and there were more than 10 attackers involved? If you have anything concrete then share it.

Didn't you see the video clips of your indian anchors talking to the terrorists? The terrorists announced that they were indians and their numbers that they disclosed is in direct contradiction with your government's number of terrorists. What other evidence do you want? Do you want the terrorists brought back to life and make statements? Let me ask you this; did you even consider this issue before? Did you even try to tie this statement from the terrorist to you government's numbers?


[quote:1lrnr9je]Its not me, but you are trying to mislead people by indulging in pure speculation and conspiracy therioies. Why will Indian Govt. accept something which is not true? The terrorist (first video) claimed that he is from Hyderabad, but if you listen to the conversation carefully you will hear that at one point he was asking his partner in Punjabi "dasso demand, demand kya hai". The other terrorist (second video) Imran Babbar was from Multan.

So i guess you are conveniently going to embrace what ever the terrorist says that fits your preconceived stance on the matter. You are OK if the terrorist says that he is a muslim, no problem there. You are OK if he says that he is doing Jihad. No problem their because it fits your stance. However, if he tells you that he is an indian then he is a liar because it does no fit your preconceived notion that only pakistanis can do it. You can't cherry pick the facts.

You are fond of this phrase' cherry picking'. Anyway I am not trying to cherry pick and also not going by what the terrorist says.

I like to say "cherry picking" when people are "cherry picking." You see when people are "cherry picking" they should accept the fact that other people observe their "cherry picking" and point out their "cherry picking." May be if you don't want other people to use this phrase then you should stop "cherry picking." :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I am just going by the proofs provided so far and the recorded conversation and that is accepted by Pakistan govt., atleast most part of it. It makes sense that all of them were told not reveal their real identity and pose as Indians so that LET does not come under fire and they can carry out attacks in future.

I am sorry but Pakistan has only accepted parts of the information forwarded by India. In fact Pakistan has repeatedly ask India to share more info which your country has declined. Pakistan has even made a request to have access to Kasab and conduct its own investigation in India, which your country has also declined. What is there that India is trying to hide? If there is nothing to hide then why not share the whole info?

Furthermore, your argument that the terrorists did not reveal their true identities holds no ground at all and directly contradicts the evidence you have provided on this thread. In the video Babar Imran revealed himself as Babar Imran, his actual name. Not by his alias Abu Akasha as your list of terrorists states. You are contradicting yourself.

Also, there are lot muslims in India who are capable of speaking more than one language. Punjabi being one of them. Punjabi is not only spoken in Pakistan but also in Indian Punjab and Haryana. I reside in Toronto. There are IndianPujabis in Canada who have been living here for lat 30 years but still mostly communicate in Punjabi and are not fluent in english. Does this make them non-canadian?

Agreed they are capable of more than one languages, but the point is a terrorist claiming to be from deccan Hyderabad will not talk in Punjabi in the heat of the moment. A decccan muslim in very rare case will know Punjabi and even if he knows a little bit will not talk in that language in such a situation. Your Canadian example infact proves my point that a person's first insticnt is to speak in the mother tougue and more so under such circumstances.

What are you talking about? Do you review your writing before submitting your post? How does my example fit your point? If a person is only fluent in Punjabi and has been living in Canada for 30 years and speaks Punjabi under pressure cooking situations because he is not flluent in english, does he become a non-canadian? Such a person is more Canadian than someone living in Canada for only 2 years and is fluent in english. Your point is not even comparable with my example.

Imrran Babar may be from Multan, as per your government (he did not claim that in the video clip), but he did mention in the interview that there are five terrorists with him. Look at the list that you have stated above, it says only two people. Don't come up with the argument that he was telling the truth about being a muslim and the reasons he was upset about the things that were being done to Muslims in your country but he lied about other things. You can't cherry pick what ever is convenient for you from his statements.

Ok I will not cherry pick here (your favourite), but why should I believe Imran and not Kasab. So the other three (assuming they were five in total) can be Indian or Pakistanis, right? We don't know that yet and Imran didn't clarify that. If the Kasab or Indian Govt. is lying about the total number of attackers then let the Pakistani govt. come out with something different.

You have raised very valid points. Pakistan government should be allowed to investigate in India but your goverment has declined Pakistan's repeated requests for access to people and sharing of other information.

I already answered that earlier that the terrorist's claim regarding they being Indian are false. Even Kasab in his testimony has said they were 10 who were selected after training and all from Pakistan. Now you will argue he was forced to, well then there is no end to this discussion in that case and I can't help it if you choose to live in denial.

So let me see. You are going to deny the statements of one terrorist but will accept the other's. Mind you one terrorist knew that he was going to die with in next 24 hours or so while he was talking to the media, while the other is under your government's custody (exposed to torture and what not) and wants to get over with his trial and psychological stress, regardless of the result of the trial. Your logic is pedestrian at its best.

I am not going to put my money on any of the statements by the terrorists. I think you are confused, there is a difference between a person who is going to die after 24 hrs or more and a dying person's statement. You want to say that Kasab was tortured not to name any Indians even if they were involved? The argument is laughable. He is enjoying himself at the trial, laughing, smiling, By the way the trial is open and not closed door. Does Pakistani govt. has the guts to conduct an open trial? The answer is no because then the ISI link will be exposed to the world.

What I don't get is that why would indians be only involved in indirect way to these attacks? Why can't they conduct these attacks? In the past Indian Muslims were involved in terrorism on indian soil. Why is it such a far fetched idea that Indians along with the pakistanis were involved in this one?

I have already said that Indians were involved in other attacks on Indian soil. The idea put forward by you is not a far fetched idea at all , but after all its still an idea and pure speculation and nothing to support except a statement by the terrorist. Even if we assume for the sake of argument that there 10 Pakistanis and 10 Indians involved and 19 were killed. And if the Indian govt. had lied and said that there were only 11 and one was Indian, it would not have made the case any weaker against Pakistan. Don't you think it makes sense?

There is and always was a solid case of the involvement of the Pakistani nationals. However, by omitting indians, your government is saving itself from the embarassment of its own muslims going after the government and its people because of the atrocities performed against the muslims in India. Don't forget that India is on religious freedomm watchlist. Also, by exposing only the Pakistani involvement India is trying to link ISI to Mumbai attacks via LET and JD. India is trying to offcially get ISI designated as a terrorist organization. Hence, India is trying to weaken Pakistan's security so that it can dominate the region.

I think you actually need to open your eyes, mind and everything and accept the truth.
Having said all these I don't say that India doesn't have its share of terrorists as there were many other blasts last year (atleast 3-4) prior to Mumbai, but here we are discussing Mumbai attacks only.

I'll let the readers decide who needs to be open minded.

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The point is your whole argument is based on a statement from a terrorist. Are you 100% sure that the Indian govt. is lying or you just have fancy doubts to lessen your guilt? You can atleast wait for the findings from the trial in your country or you think it is never going to happen. And if you have something to prove your point then share it, if not then as I said earlier its speculation and conspiracy theories.
Yes let the readers decide.

I don't have and fancy doubts. I actually have reasonable doubts about the truth in Indian government's reports and statements. Among the inetrantional matters nothing can be said for 100%.
There is no trial being condcuted in my country. The indian dossier has been thown out by the pakistani courts as being non-credible. That is exactly why India should co-operate with Pakistan if it thinks that HAfiz Saeed was involved. This lack of co-operation is simply an excuse to hide the lack of credible evidence.
I have already proved my point and shown you the video clips contradicting your government's reports regarding the number of terrorists and their nationalities. I have also highlighted where you are contradicting yourself.

It is interesting that you have pointed out that my whole argument is based on a terrorist's statement. But you did not highlight the fact that this terrorist was not under anyone's custody and was under no pressure to say anything against his will. On the otherhand your government's reports include the staements of a terrorist who is under its custody and the terrorist's food, water, sleep and everything is under the control of the Indian government.