It is Haram to declare somebody a "Kafir" who says "Assalam-o-Alaikum"

[Citizen X]

jo jis baat per yaqeen rakhta hai wo kerta jaye , yehan ek thread bana maine us per ek hadees quote kerdi. jiski marzi maane jiski marzi na maane. Musleema per ya aur kisi mozu per agar koi behas kerni huwi tau skype wegera per aa ker krelo nahi tau na sahi. LAKUM DEENUKUM WALIYYA DEEN

I don't skype with strangers nor give out personal details online to strangers. If you are not willing to debate a point, then better not to start a conversation.

 

[Citizen X]

What about Qadiyani are they Muslims or not?
Pakistan declares them as non Muslims because they say there leader is last Prophet?

Pakistan is no authority on Islam and it shows just how filled with hypocrisy it is. A sect which has only one extra prophet is certified non muslim but another sect with 12 extra prophets, no worries at all. Either declare all of them certified non muslims or let everyone call whatever they want to call themselves.

Just because one country stands behind one, we act submissive and let them play havoc with the deen.

 

[ts_rana]

I don't skype with strangers nor give out personal details online to strangers. If you are not willing to debate a point, then better not to start a conversation.

I didnt start any conversation with you . Do what u think

 

[Citizen X]

I didnt start any conversation with you . Do what u think

 

[ts_rana]

کیا بات ہے ہے جی کیا بات ہے ۔ خود ہی مقابلہ کیا اور خود ہی جیت بھی گئے
اس سادگی پہ کون مر جائے نہ اے خدا

 

[Pakistani1947]

if you are trying to change my mind with your usual unnecessary long posts then you are mistaken for sure.
based on your assumption qadyanis also cannot be called kafir that means Muslims of whole world are wrong and you are right?
think about it only Muslims left is that jhannammi jehlami and you lot? and since he has not even spared Sahaba is he better than the Sahaba?

What about Qadiyani are they Muslims or not?
Pakistan declares them as non Muslims because they say there leader is last Prophet?

There is Ijma-e-Ummat about Qadiani that they are Kafir. Muslim Ummah would never be united on falsehood. They are for sure Kafir.

 

[Citizen X]

کیا بات ہے ہے جی کیا بات ہے ۔ خود ہی مقابلہ کیا اور خود ہی جیت بھی گئے
اس سادگی پہ کون مر جائے نہ اے خدا

Don't cry now, this is a public forum, you post that means you have initiated a conversation with its members. This is not your personal soapbox where you can come and make statements and leave unchallenged, members here are not subjects of your royal highness that they have to quietly listen to you.

SO next time you think of imparting your precious pearls of wisdom, be ready to be called on it. Otherwise keep them to yourself.

 

[Citizen X]

There is Ijma-e-Ummat about Qadiani that they are Kafir. Muslim Ummah would never be united on falsehood. They are for sure Kafir.

You just contradicted yourself

 

[ts_rana]

Don't cry now, this is a public forum, you post that means you have initiated a conversation with its members. This is not your personal soapbox where you can come and make statements and leave unchallenged, members here are not subjects of your royal highness that they have to quietly listen to you.

SO next time you think of imparting your precious pearls of wisdom, be ready to be called on it. Otherwise keep them to yourself.

اب میں تمہیں ذرا جواب دیتا ہوں تھوڑا لمبا ، میں نے اس تھریڈ کے حساب سے ایک حدیث یہاں لگائی بالکل ٹھریڈ کی مناسبت سے اور میں نے کسی سے کوئی مطالبہ نہیں کیا کہ اس سے کیا سمجھے اور کیا نہ سمجھے۔ لیکن تمہارے دل کو وہ حدیث بہت گراں گزری کیونکہ تمہیں اور فورم کے باقی لوگوں کی بھی پتا ہے کہ میں احمدی ہوں ۔ اور تم نے مسیلمہ کذاب سے متعلق ایک حدیث لگا دی ۔ جس پر میں نے یہ کہا کہ اگر مسیلمہ کذاب والے یا کسی موضوع پر اگر بحث کرنی ہے تو اس فورم سے کسی اور فورم پر جس طرح سکائپ ہے ، فیس بک آن لائن یا یو ٹیوب وغیرہ ہوسکتے ہیں وہاں بات کر لیتے ہیں ۔ اور اسکی کچھ وجوہات ہیں اس میں سے ایک وجہ بہت زیادہ ٹائپنگ ہے جو میرے لئے مسئلہ ہے ۔ دوسری وجہ یہ کہ ایک ہی وقت میں بہت سارے لوگوں کی طرف سے سوالات آتے ہیں اور بات ایک موضوع سے نکل کر کئی موضوعات کی طرف چلی جاتی ہے اور بات پھر وہیں آجاتی ہے کہ اتنی زیادہ ٹائپنگ آسان نہیں ہے اس کے برعکس بول کے بات کرنا آسان ہے۔ بس اتنی سی بات ہے باقی جس نے جو سمجھنا ہے سمجھتا رہے

 

[Citizen X]

اب میں تمہیں ذرا جواب دیتا ہوں تھوڑا لمبا ، میں نے اس تھریڈ کے حساب سے ایک حدیث یہاں لگائی بالکل ٹھریڈ کی مناسبت سے اور میں نے کسی سے کوئی مطالبہ نہیں کیا کہ اس سے کیا سمجھے اور کیا نہ سمجھے۔ لیکن تمہارے دل کو وہ حدیث بہت گراں گزری کیونکہ تمہیں اور فورم کے باقی لوگوں کی بھی پتا ہے کہ میں احمدی ہوں ۔ اور تم نے مسیلمہ کذاب سے متعلق ایک حدیث لگا دی ۔ جس پر میں نے یہ کہا کہ اگر مسیلمہ کذاب والے یا کسی موضوع پر اگر بحث کرنی ہے تو اس فورم سے کسی اور فورم پر جس طرح سکائپ ہے ، فیس بک آن لائن یا یو ٹیوب وغیرہ ہوسکتے ہیں وہاں بات کر لیتے ہیں ۔ اور اسکی کچھ وجوہات ہیں اس میں سے ایک وجہ بہت زیادہ ٹائپنگ ہے جو میرے لئے مسئلہ ہے ۔ دوسری وجہ یہ کہ ایک ہی وقت میں بہت سارے لوگوں کی طرف سے سوالات آتے ہیں اور بات ایک موضوع سے نکل کر کئی موضوعات کی طرف چلی جاتی ہے اور بات پھر وہیں آجاتی ہے کہ اتنی زیادہ ٹائپنگ آسان نہیں ہے اس کے برعکس بول کے بات کرنا آسان ہے۔ بس اتنی سی بات ہے باقی جس نے جو سمجھنا ہے سمجھتا رہے

Well if you can't type, then like I said refrain from posting here. Its that simple.

 

[Pakistani1947]

And how did the Prophet s.a.w react in regards to Musaylimah the false prophet
-------
I'm pretty sure if the Prophet s.a.w was among us today he would say the same about Ghulam Ahmed Mirza

You just contradicted yourself

Abu Said al-Khudri reported: 'Ali b. Abu Talib sent to the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) from Yemen some gold alloyed with clay in a leather bag dyed in the leaves of Mimosa flava. He distributed it among four men. 'Uyaina b. Hisna, Aqra' b. Habis and Zaid al-Khail, and the fourth one was either Alqama b. 'Ulatha or 'Amir b. Tufail. A person from among his (Prophet's) Companions said: We had a better claim to this (wealth) than these (persons). This (remark) reached the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) upon which he said: Will you not trust me, whereas I am a trustee of Him Who is in the heaven? The news come to me from the heaven morning and evening. Then there stood up a person with deep snnken eyes, prominent cheek bones, and elevated forehead, thick beard, shaven head, tucked up loin cloth, and he said: messenger of allah, fear allah. He (the Holy Prophet) said: Woe to thee. do I not deserve most to fear Allah amongst the people of the earth? That man then returned. Khalid b. Walid then said: Messenger of Allah, should I not strike his neck? Upon this he (the Holy Prophet) said: Perhaps he may be observing the prayer. Khalid said: How many observers of prayer are there who profess with their tongue what is not in their heart? Upon this the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: I have not been commanded to pierce through the hearts of people, nor to split their bellies (insides). He again looked at him and he was going back. Upon this he (the Holy Prophet) said: There would arise a people from the progeny of this (man) who would recite the Qur'an glibly, but it would not go beyond their throats; they would (hurriedly) pass through (the teachings of their) religion just as the arrow passes through the prey. I conceive that he (the Holy Prophet) also said this: If I find them I would certainly kill them as were killed the (people of) Thamud. (Book #005, Hadith #2319)

This man was Dhul Khuwaisirah Al Tamimie, The Prophet (saw) knows that he is khawaarij, and that from his children will be khawaarij, and that he conceals kufr, but he judged his imaan on his sayings and his actions, not from what was in his heart. Imam Ali killed thousands from the khawaarij, but only after they made takfeer upon and killed one sahabi - Abdullah ibn Khabbab. He did not judge their hearts, rather he judged them when they committed actions and made takfeer on them when they did, despite that they do believe and testify that "laa ilaaha illallah".

Khalid bin Waleed learnt from this that he should not judge someone by intention, but rather by his actions. This helped him in the time of Musailamah Kazab, who used to claim to be the brother of Muhammad and another messenger. Musailamah even used to try to make ayat, similar to the Qur'an. However even his own followers told him that it is better to repeat the ayat of Muhammad, and that they will accept it from him, because his own verses were so obviously defective.

Muja'a was a man who spent some time accompanying the Prophet (saw), and he was from the same town as Musailamah. Khalid bin Waleed was the one who was sent to fight against Musailamah, he conquered, and he captured from them 20 apostates. Muja'a said to him: "Assalamu 'Alaikum Wa Rahmatullah." Khalid looked to him and said: "Now you give me salaam?" Muja'a said: "O kahlid you know me, I was among them who gave baya'ah to Muhammad (saw) and I still believe in what I believed in the past …"Khalid said: "you do not believe in what you believed in the past, and your acceptance to live under this False Prophet (Musailamah kazab) and your silence is your consent. You are the most noble man in Yamamah, you knew that I was coming, yet you stayed with him and you did not come out with me, I cannot find any excuse for you at all, you heard what they said and you did not say a word, and there were among you people less than you, and they spoke against Musailamah, and they have been tortured and had been killed." Muja'a said: "I was fearing from my people," Khalid said: "Why did you not come to me or send me a letter, I am going to stop killing you, but I am not going to let you free, between releasing you from my sword and releasing you completely is a middle solution, I am going to imprison you until Allah finds us a way."

He (Khalid bin Waleed) consulted with other sahabah and he killed Muja'a, because he judged his kufr actions NOT his intention.

Imam Shaafi' said about this: "Khalid bin Waleed considered Muja'a kafir because he was silent and he left what he believed in the past."

 

[ts_rana]

Well if you can't type, then like I said refrain from posting here. Its that simple.

میری مرضی جناب میں جو مرضی کروں۔

 

[Citizen X]

میری مرضی جناب میں جو مرضی کروں۔

Same here, then like I said don't cry when you get called out on your lameness.

 

[ts_rana]

Same here, then like I said don't cry when you get called out on your lameness.

haha Cry : ??

 

[@@O.P]

Ive been called that too, but thats got to be some kind of record! LOL

that tellsm me im doing the right thing lol

 

[@@O.P]

Really? How? Genius? The brilliant topic of kafir? Hmmm.. Have YOU seen the recent photographs of Mars Rover? Do you think is the Red planet habitable ?

What happened to the people of Mars? Was there a nuclear annihilation?

the point is dont call people Qadiyani and Jews!

 

[@@O.P]

Ive been called that too, but thats got to be some kind of record! LOL

Tameerlane called me "Qadian of MODI." beat that hahah

 

[Sultan Raja]

There is Ijma-e-Ummat about Qadiani that they are Kafir. Muslim Ummah would never be united on falsehood. They are for sure Kafir.

But you said we can’t say Kafir to people who say they are Muslims then why you saying?

 

[Sultan Raja]

Please stop posting idiotic irrelevant topics on pk siasat.

Discussion and debate is must there is no haraam in getting knowledge.

 

[Sultan Raja]

You called me Qadiyani( non Muslim) and Jew, you could benefit from this thread!

Don’t call anyone jew or Qadiyani, we should leave some things to ALLAH