Idraak: About Jinnat (Must See)

[saud491]

Dear crankthskunk, we all agree that word jinn means various things even in the quran. In verses of the quran meaning of word jinn depends on context within the quran and what is self evident. All I am interested in is to not to interpret the quran in such a way that it makes absolutely no sense.

In context of iblees and adam argument, word jinn cannot mean anything other than human being. It is fight over who has the right to rule on the earth ie rich or poor, strong or weak, knowledgeable or ignorant, authorized by allah or his adversary. Satan=adversary of divine rule.

In verse wa ma khalaqtul jinna wal insa, it is possible to interpret it your way as well but it makes more sense to interpret my way because here allah is talking about creatures with free will otherwise Allah would have said all my creation is for worshiping me ie allah would not need to separate these two. The reason they are separated in my view is because masses are more likely to be followers of clever people who lead them. So regardless you are leader or follower, you have to serve Allah. It is same category to which iblees belongs. Iblees is a clever guy but with evil intention ie he was hiding his true intention as to how he was going to rule people as compared to what adam wated to do for people.

In my view story of adam is a fight between imperialism and khilaafah. The rest of prophetic stories are all following the same pattern.

As for creation of jins before adam it may well be about how each character came about right in front of each other ie good and bad. Adam was moulded into shape one way and iblees another way just like you take a piece of a clay and mould it into any shape you desire. One ended up a person of good conduct towards others whereas the other who tried to use and abuse others. It is story of chiefs and their tribes and how adam is appointed over them as an overall chief.

As for possession of jinns, if you know people some times say to each other tere demaagh main keera hai. So if one talks unexpectedly or annoyingly people make such remarks toward each other ie too paaghal hai. Tujhe jinn ne qaaboo kiya huwa hai.

Also viruses and germs are invisible and they do infect people as well so I see no problem with such statements in the quran.

Allah states different kinds of earth materials from which he created adam likewise he talks about jinns ie to to explain to us their different of characters. This is not actual creation but an evolutionary process both for physical and psychological development in their own natural environment ie nature and nurture.

As I already explained the approach of the quran is very scientific. There is permanent conflict between make beliefs and the evidence based realities. So long as we do not let go blind faith idea we will not be able to appreciate the quran properly. Because make beliefs hold us back from conquering frontiers where no man has gone before or even from getting know what learned people have to say on certain matters.

The question of some of the chiefs that will adam rule the same way as some other rulers who shed blood before is not by angels but by people. MALAAIKA are also people but these are people who carry out will of Allah in his kingdom.

Since the whole quran has been misinterpreted and has remained so it is difficult to see what the quran is actually saying. For this one has to pay attention to each and every word, sentence etc etc. till one gets some sensible understanding of it. It is because we need to rediscover the message of the quran from the quran. It took me several decades to realise this much. Like most people here I too come from peeri mureedi back ground. it depends on what we have learned over life time to have any views about things. It is a very hard work, I too have been all over the place till I found that the quran was not interpreted correctly.

I know where these people are coming from who think I am not talking sense. They will come to know better so long as they keep on learning things in their life. Our worry should be how to educate our fellow human beings about Allah and his creation so that we all could get on with what we ned to do to better this world in the hope of better hereafter.

regards and all the best.

SURAH Al-A'raaf (7 - 11 to 12)

وَلَقَدْ خَلَقْنَاكُمْ ثُمَّ صَوَّرْنَاكُمْ ثُمَّ قُلْنَا لِلْمَلَائِكَةِ اسْجُدُوا لِآدَمَ فَسَجَدُوا إِلَّا إِبْلِيسَ لَمْ يَكُن مِّنَ السَّاجِدِينَ ﴿١١﴾قَالَ مَا مَنَعَكَ أَلَّا تَسْجُدَ إِذْ أَمَرْتُكَ ۖ قَالَ أَنَا خَيْرٌ مِّنْهُ خَلَقْتَنِي مِن نَّارٍ وَخَلَقْتَهُ مِن طِينٍ ﴿١٢﴾
او رہم نے تمہیں پیدا کیا پھر تمہاری صورتیں بنائیں پھر فرشتوں کو حکم دیا کہ آدم کو سجدہ کرو پھر سوائے ابلیس کے سب نے سجدہ کیا وہ سجدہ کرنے والوں میں سے نہ تھا

فرمایاتجھے سجدہ کرنے سے کس چیز نے منع کیا ہے جب کہ میں نے تجھے حکم دیا کہا میں اس سے بہتر ہوں تو نے مجھے آگ سے بنایا اور اسے مٹی سے بنایا ہے

11 We created you, then We shaped you and then We said to the angels, Prostrate yourselves before Adam, and they all prostrated themselves, except Satan. He was not among those who prostrated themselves.
12 God asked, What prevented you from prostrating yourself when I commanded you to? He replied, I am better than he is; You created me from fire, while You created him from clay.

 

[saud491]

Surah Hijr (15 )

وَلَقَدْ خَلَقْنَا الْإِنسَانَ مِن صَلْصَالٍ مِّنْ حَمَإٍ مَّسْنُونٍ ﴿٢٦﴾ وَالْجَانَّ خَلَقْنَاهُ مِن قَبْلُ مِن نَّارِ السَّمُومِ ﴿٢٧﴾ وَإِذْ قَالَ رَبُّكَ لِلْمَلَائِكَةِ إِنِّي خَالِقٌ بَشَرًا مِّن صَلْصَالٍ مِّنْ حَمَإٍ مَّسْنُونٍ ﴿٢٨﴾ فَإِذَا سَوَّيْتُهُ وَنَفَخْتُ فِيهِ مِن رُّوحِي فَقَعُوا لَهُ سَاجِدِينَ ﴿٢٩﴾ فَسَجَدَ الْمَلَائِكَةُ كُلُّهُمْ أَجْمَعُونَ ﴿٣٠﴾ إِلَّا إِبْلِيسَ أَبَىٰ أَن يَكُونَ مَعَ السَّاجِدِينَ ﴿٣١﴾وَلَقَدْ خَلَقْنَا الْإِنسَانَ مِن صَلْصَالٍ مِّنْ حَمَإٍ مَّسْنُونٍ ﴿٢٦﴾ وَالْجَانَّ خَلَقْنَاهُ مِن قَبْلُ مِن نَّارِ السَّمُومِ ﴿٢٧﴾ وَإِذْ قَالَ رَبُّكَ لِلْمَلَائِكَةِ إِنِّي خَالِقٌ بَشَرًا مِّن صَلْصَالٍ مِّنْ حَمَإٍ مَّسْنُونٍ ﴿٢٨﴾ فَإِذَا سَوَّيْتُهُ وَنَفَخْتُ فِيهِ مِن رُّوحِي فَقَعُوا لَهُ سَاجِدِينَ ﴿٢٩﴾ فَسَجَدَ الْمَلَائِكَةُ كُلُّهُمْ أَجْمَعُونَ ﴿٣٠﴾ إِلَّا إِبْلِيسَ أَبَىٰ أَن يَكُونَ مَعَ السَّاجِدِينَ ﴿٣١﴾
قَالَ يَا إِبْلِيسُ مَا لَكَ أَلَّا تَكُونَ مَعَ السَّاجِدِينَ ﴿٣٢﴾ قَالَ لَمْ أَكُن لِّأَسْجُدَ لِبَشَرٍ خَلَقْتَهُ مِن صَلْصَالٍ مِّنْ حَمَإٍ مَّسْنُونٍ ﴿٣٣﴾ قَالَ فَاخْرُجْ مِنْهَا فَإِنَّكَ رَجِيمٌ ﴿٣٤﴾ وَإِنَّ عَلَيْكَ اللَّعْنَةَ إِلَىٰ يَوْمِ الدِّينِ ﴿٣٥﴾ قَالَ رَبِّ فَأَنظِرْنِي إِلَىٰ يَوْمِ يُبْعَثُونَ ﴿٣٦﴾ قَالَ فَإِنَّكَ مِنَ الْمُنظَرِينَ ﴿٣٧﴾ إِلَىٰ يَوْمِ الْوَقْتِ الْمَعْلُومِ ﴿٣٨﴾ قَالَ رَبِّ بِمَا أَغْوَيْتَنِي لَأُزَيِّنَنَّ لَهُمْ فِي الْأَرْضِ وَلَأُغْوِيَنَّهُمْ أَجْمَعِينَ ﴿٣٩﴾ إِلَّا عِبَادَكَ مِنْهُمُ الْمُخْلَصِينَ ﴿٤٠﴾ قَالَ هَـٰذَا صِرَاطٌ عَلَيَّ مُسْتَقِيمٌ ﴿٤١﴾ إِنَّ عِبَادِي لَيْسَ لَكَ عَلَيْهِمْ سُلْطَانٌ إِلَّا مَنِ اتَّبَعَكَ مِنَ الْغَاوِينَ ﴿٤٢﴾ وَإِنَّ جَهَنَّمَ لَمَوْعِدُهُمْ أَجْمَعِينَ ﴿٤٣﴾ لَهَا سَبْعَةُ أَبْوَابٍ لِّكُلِّ بَابٍ مِّنْهُمْ جُزْءٌ مَّقْسُومٌ ﴿٤٤﴾
26 We created man out of dry clay, from moulded mud, 27 and the jinn We had created before from flaming fire.
28 Your Lord said to the angels, I am about to bring into being a man wrought from mud. 29 When I have formed him and breathed My spirit into him, fall down in prostration before him, 30 then the angels all prostrated themselves together. 31 But Satan did not; he refused to join those who prostrated themselves. 32 God asked him, What is the matter with you, that you are not among those who have prostrated themselves? 33 He replied, I am not one to prostrate myself to a man whom You have created out of a clay of moulded mud.
34 God said, Then get out of here; for you are accursed, 35 and the curse shall be on you till the Day of Judgement! 36 Satan said, O my Lord! Grant me respite till the Day of Resurrection. 37 He said, You are granted respite 38 till that Appointed Day.
39 He said, My Lord, since You have let me go astray. I shall make the path of error seem alluring to them on the earth and shall mislead them all, 40 except for Your chosen servants.
41 God said, This is the path which leads straight to Me. 42 Surely, you shall have no power over My true servants, except those misguided ones who choose to follow you. 43 Surely, Hell is the place to which they are destined, 44 it has seven gates: and each gate has a portion of them allotted to it.

 

[saud491]

http://www.islamawareness.net/Jinn/jinn1.html


The World of Jinn

Invitation to Islam, Issue 4, January 1998
Note this article was edited in April 07 to remove some offensive material that was deeemed unislamic as well



Throughout history man has always had a deep attraction for the supernatural and the unseen. The existence of a world parallel to our own has always fascinated people. This world is commonly referred to as the spirit world, and almost every set of people have some concept of one. With some people, these spirits are no more then the souls of dead people- or ghosts. With others, spirits are either the forces of good or the forces of evil - both battling against one another to gain influence over humanity. However, both of these explanations are more in tune with folk tales and fantasy. The true explanation of such a world comes from Islam. Like every other way, Islam also claims to explain this realm of the unseen. It is from this realm that Islam explains to us about the world of the Jinn. The Islamic explanation of the Jinn provides us with so many answers to modem day mysteries. Without the knowledge of this world, the Muslims would become like the non-Muslims and be running around looking for any old answer to come their way. So, who or what are the Jinn?
Existence
The Jinn are beings created with free will, living on earth in a world parallel to mankind. The Arabic word Jinn is from the verb 'Janna' which means to hide or conceal. Thus, they are physically invisible from man as their description suggests. This invisibility is one of the reasons why some people have denied their existence. However, (as will be seen) the affect which the world of the Jinn has upon our world, is enough to refute this modern denial of one of Allah's creation. The origins of the Jinn can be traced from the Qur'an and the Sunnah. Allah says:

"Indeed We created man from dried clay of black smooth mud. And We created the Jinn before that from the smokeless flame of fire"
(Surah Al-Hijr 15:26-27)​

Thus the Jinn were created before man. As for their physical origin, then the Prophet (saws) has confirmed the above verse when he said: "The Angels were created from light and the Jinn from smokeless fire" [1]. It is this description of the Jinn which tells us so much about them. Because they were created from fire, their nature has generally been fiery and thus their relationship with man has been built upon this. Like humans, they too are required to worship Allah and follow Islam. Their purpose in life is exactly the same as ours, as Allah says:

"I did not create the Jinn and mankind except to worship Me"
(Surah Ad-Dhariyat 51:56)​

Jinns can thus be Muslims or non-Muslims. However, due to their fiery nature the majority of them are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Jinns form a part of the army of the most famous Jinn, Iblis- the Shaytan[2]. Consequently, these disbelieving Jinns are also called Shaytans (devils). As for the Jinns who become Muslims, then the first of them did so in the time of the Prophet (saws) when a group of them were amazed by the recitation of the Qur'an. Allah orders the Prophet to tell the people of this event:

"Say (O' Muhammed): It has been revealed to me that a group of Jinn listened and said; 'Indeed we have heard a marvellous Qur'an. It guides unto righteousness so we have believed in it, and we will never make partners with our lord'"
(Surah Al-Jinn 72:1-2)​

In many aspects of their world, the Jinn are very similar to us. They eat and drink, they marry, have children and they die. The life span however, is far greater then ours. Like us, they will also be subject to a Final Reckoning by Allah the Most High. They will be present with mankind on the Day of Judgement and will either go to Paradise or Hell.
Abilities
That which clearly distinguishes the Jinn from mankind, are their powers and abilities. Allah has given them these powers as a test for them. If they oppress others with them, then they will be held accountable. By knowing of their powers, we can often make sense of much of the mysteries which go on around us. One of the powers of the Jinn, is that they are able to take on any physical form they like. Thus, they can appear as humans, animals trees and anything else. Over the last few years the interest in the subject of aliens and UFO's has become heightened. Programmes such as the X-files and the Outer limits have increased the popularity of the theory that aliens exist. Thousands of people have sighted strange looking creatures all over the world. These sightings however, have still not proven substantially that aliens exist. Rather - and it seems more plausible all the sightings of such creatures were just Jinns parading in different forms. So the next time you see something that looks like E.T, its most probably just a wicked Jinn trying to scare and confuse you!
The ability to possess and take over the minds and bodies of other creatures is also a power which the Jinn have utilised greatly over the centuries. This however, is something which has been prohibited to them as it is a great oppression to possess another being. Human possession is something which has always brought about great attention. But the true knowledge of this subject is rare amongst the people. Over the last 3 decades the subject of possession has become very commercialised. During the 70's films such as The Exorcist and Rosemary's Baby were used to educate people about possession. However, because such institutions (the film industry) were heavily influenced by Christianity, knowledge of the subject was non-existent. Rather then educate people about Jinn possession, films such as The Exorcist just tended to scare the living daylights out of us![3] Only through Islam can we understand such a phenomena. We know as Muslims, that Jinns possess people for many reasons. Sometimes it is because the Jinn or its family has been hurt accidentally. It could be because the Jinn has fallen in love with the person. However, most of the time possession occurs because the Jinn is simply malicious and wicked. For this reason we have been told by the Prophet (saws) not to loiter in those places where the Jinns reside, e.g. graveyards, ruins, deserts, market places etc. We have also been commanded to recite the Qur'an frequently in our houses as the Prophet (saws) said: "Indeed, the shaytan flees from the house in which Surah Al-Baqarah (the 2nd chapter of the Qur'an) is recited" [4].
If a person does become possessed, then the name of Allah has to be used in expelling the Jinn. If we look at the practice of the Prophet and his companions, we find many duas (supplications) to exorcise the Jinn. All these duas invoke Allah to help the possessed person. How contrary this is to many modern-day exorcists. Many exorcists, Muslim and non-Muslim, often invoke the names of others besides Allah to exorcise the Jinn[5]. When the Jinn does leave, these people believe that their way was successful. However, this is a ploy of the Jinn, as it knows that if it obeys the exorcist, then it has succeeded in making him worship others besides Allah i.e. commit shirk. The Jinn often returns when the exorcist leaves, as it knows that nothing except the words of Allah can stop it from oppressing others.
It is not only humans which are possessed, but also animals, trees and other objects. By doing this, the evil Jinn hope to make people worship others besides Allah. The possession of idols is one way to do this. Not so long ago the world-wide phenomenon of Hindu idols drinking milk, shocked the world. From Bombay to London, Delhi to California, countless idols were lapping up milk. Ganesh[6] the elephant god, Hanuman the monkey god and even Shiva lingam, the male private organ(!), all seemed to guzzle down the milk as if there was no tomorrow! Unfortunately people were taken in by this (including Muslims) and many flocked to feed (?) the Hindu gods. Anyone who knows about Jinn possession, will undoubtedly know that this is a classic attempt to make people commit shirk. And it worked, as many people started to worship these lifeless pieces of wood and marble. Anyone with half a brain would say to themselves, 'why on earth does a god need to be fed?!! Surely if Ganesh, Hanuman or Shiva were divine then they wouldn't need feeding?' However, such common sense seemed to be lacking as the Jinns played havoc with these gullible people.
The Occult
Through their powers of flying and invisibility, the Jinn are the chief component in occult activities. Voodoo, Black magic, Poltergeists, Witchcraft and Mediums can all be explained through the world of the Jinn. Likewise, so can the illusions and feats of magicians. Because the Jinn can traverse huge distances over a matter of seconds, their value to magicians is great. In return for helping them in their magic, the Jinns often ask for the magicians to sell their souls to them and even to Iblis. Thus the magicians take the Jinn and Iblis as lords besides Allah. In our day, some of the feats performed by magicians and entertainers are without doubt from the assistance of the Jinn.
One of the most frequent activities associated with the Jinn, is fortune telling. Before the advent of the Prophet (saws) fortune-tellers and soothsayers were wide spread. These people would use their associates from the Jinn to find out about the future. The Jinns would go to the lowest heaven and listen to the Angels conversing amongst themselves about events of the Future which they heard from Allah. The Jinns would then inform the fortune-tellers. This is why before the time of the Prophet (saws) many fortune-tellers were very accurate in their predictions. However, upon the Prophet's arrival the heavens were guarded intensely by the Angels, and any Jinn who tried to listen was attacked by meteors (shooting stars):

"And We have guarded it (the heavens) from every accursed devil, except one who is able to snatch a hearing and he is pursued by a brightly burning flame"
(Surah Al-Hijr 15:18)​

The Prophet (saws) also said: "They (the Jinn) would pass the information back down until it reaches the lips of a magician or forrtune-teller Sometimes a meteor would overtake them before they could pass it on. If they passed it on before being struck, they would add to it a hundred lies" [9]. Thus, it is clear from this as to how fortune-tellers get predictions of the future right. It is also evident as to why they get so many wrong. Men like Nostradamus[10] are an example, as some of his predictions of the future were correct whilst many were completely wrong. Unfortunately, the amount of fortune telling which occurs amongst the Muslims is also increasing. By visiting Muslim lands such as Morocco, one is able to see as to how much inter Jinn-fortune-teller activity there really is. If you look up at the sky on a clear night in Morocco, you will see the heavens ablaze with shooting stars! A clear display of the devils being chased away from the heavens.
Fortune-tellers also operate through the Qareen. The Qareen is the Jinn companion which is assigned to every human being. It is this Jinn which whispers to our base desires and constantly tries to divert us from righteousness. The Prophet (saws) said: "Everyone of you has been assigned a companion from the Jinn. The companions asked: Even you O' Messenger of Allah? And the Prophet replied: Even me, except that Allah has helped me against him and he has submitted. Now he only tells me to do good" [11]. Because the Qareen is with a person all his life, it knows all that has happened to the person from the cradle to the grave. By making contact with the Qareen, the fortune-teller is thus able to make out that it is he who knows about the person. He looks in his crystal ball or the palm of a person and proceeds to amaze him with knowledge which no one else knows[12]. The severity of going to a fortune-teller is such that the Prophet (saws) said: "The prayer of one who approaches a fortune-teller and asks him about anything, will not be accepted for forty days or nights" [13] and: "Whosoever approaches a fortune-teller and believes in what he says, has disbelieved in what was revealed to Muhammed" [14]
The effects of the Jinn are not just limited to fortune-tellers. Other activities such as oujia boards and seances, which are used to contact the dead, are manipulated by the Jinn. 'Are you there Charlie? Speak to us Charlie!!' are the sort of words spoken by anxious relatives (names are obviously different!) seeking to make contact with their loved ones. And it is when the Jinn starts to talk and communicate as 'Charlie', that the people are truly fooled[15].
One of the biggest manipulations of the Jinn is through visions. Through these visions the Jinns are more likely to lead people away from the worship of Allah then any other way. When a person sees a vision in front of his eyes it is something which is very hard to explain away. Only by having knowledge of the world of the Jinn and conviction in Allah, can a person fight such a trial. The countless numbers of visions of Jesus Christ and the Virgin Mary over the centuries has been a popular choice for the devils. It almost seems as if leading Christians astray is the most easiest trick for the Jinns! Not only are Christians fooled by these visions, but often the Jinns possess and begin to talk from their voices. To the Christians this is known as the tongues of the Angels and thus a proof for their faith. However, the amount of unintelligible nonsense and rubbish which is heard is a clear proof that this is in fact the tongues of the devils! For other people, visions of their parents or relatives are commonplace. By taking on the form of peoples parents, the Jinns can convince people that the souls of dead people still mix with the people of the earth. This is why so many people believe in ghosts.
The onslaught of satanic visions has also hit the Muslims. Many Muslims claim to have seen visions of the Prophet Muhammed (saws) and even Allah! By doing this, Shaytan is able to lead astray the weak Muslims. Through such visions, Muslims are often told that the commands of Islam are not applicable to them. The Jinns tell them that Prayer, Fasting, Hajj etc. are not obligatory for them. It is a great deception and unfortunately one which has been very effective. The extent of satanic visions still continues to this day. The recent death of Diana Princess of Wales sparked off great love and adoration for this woman. In fact the grief of the British people was such, that it was as if Diana was something divine. No sooner had the mourning of Diana reached its peak, that visions of her were already being seen at Hampton Court Palace! If these visions did occur, the desire of Iblis and his army of Jinn to capitalise on this event, was evident. Such visions are clear attempts by Iblis to lead mankind away from the path of Allah [16].
The world of the Jinn is one which is both sinister and intriguing. By knowing of this world we can explain many of the mysteries and issues which bother us. By doing this we can avoid the extremes which the people have gone to; nothing being more extreme then worshipping others besides Allah. By learning the Tawheed of Allah, we defend ourselves from these hidden allies of Iblis:

"Indeed he (Iblis) and his tribe watch you from a position where you cannot see them"
(Surah Al-A'raf 7:27)​

Maybe there is a Jinn sitting in the corner of your room right now, or even one behind you. If so, then how will you deal with this creation of Allah? Learn Islam properly and you will be able to deal with all of Allah's creation - and not just the Jinn. By becoming true Muslims and followers of Islam, the fear of Iblis, Jinns and anything else will leave us - nothing will touch the Believer unless Allah wills.

Footnotes
1 Reported by Muslim - Eng. Trans. Vol. 4, p.1540, No.7134
2 It must be remembered that Iblis is a Jinn and not an Angel. The concept of the Devil being a fallen Angel is from Christianity and not Islam.
3 In fact when The Exorcist was first shown on cinema, it was so scary that many people fainted and one even died!
4 Authentic - Reported by Tirmidhee
5 Whilst Christians invoke the name of Jesus, many Muslims invoke the name of pious Muslim saints! The rituals which are conducted by many Muslims are more akin to voodoo then the exorcism practised by the Prophet and his companions!!
6 Ganesh, the elephant headed deity, seemed to be the biggest drinker! In fact it didn't just stop at milk. At the time of these occurrences, a woman in India decided to see if Ganesh would drink anything else - so she offered him whiskey!! And Lo and behold Ganesh drank the Whiskey!!! Suffice to say, the woman was kicked out of India.
7 The ship which was recovered was more then 50 years old. It subsequently caught alight and was conveniently destroyed.
8 Authentic - Reported by Tirmidhee
9 Reported by Bukhari - Eng. Trans. Vol.7, p.439, No.657
10 Michel de Nostradamus was a famous French soothsayer of the 16th century.
11 Reported by Muslim - Eng. Trans. Vol.4, p.1472, No.6757
12 The classic example of how fortune tellers can be wrong is the case of Diana, Princess of Wales and Dodi Fayed. Both went to see a fortune teller who told Diana that she would live a long and happy life. A few weeks later, on August 31st 1997, Diana and Dodi Fayed were dead. After this the fortune tellers flew for cover, as their evil art showed its decadence.
13 Reported by Muslim - Eng. Trans. Vol.4, p.1211, No.5540
14 Authentic - Reported by Ahmed
15 Ouija boards are so misleading, that people have even managed to get in touch with the spirit of Jack the Ripper!!
16 An informative book on the world of the Jinn is Ibn Taymeeyah's Essay on the Jinn translated by Abu Ameenah Bilal Phillips.

 

[saud491]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NpLkLSZDnY&feature=player_embedded#at=404

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cykY5sU8tgs

Surah Younus (10)

بَلْ كَذَّبُوا بِمَا لَمْ يُحِيطُوا بِعِلْمِهِ وَلَمَّا يَأْتِهِمْ تَأْوِيلُهُ ۚ كَذَٰلِكَ كَذَّبَ الَّذِينَ مِن قَبْلِهِمْ ۖ فَانظُرْ كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الظَّالِمِينَ ﴿٣٩﴾
39 Indeed, they are denying something which they cannot comprehend; the reality not yet having dawned on them. Likewise those before them rejected the truth. But see what was the end of the wrongdoers.
بلکہ انہوں نے اس چیز کو جھٹلایا جسے وہ سمجھ نہ سکے اوربھی اس کی حقیقت ان پر کھلی نہیں اسی طرح جو لوگ ان سے پہلے تھے انہوں نے بھی جھٹلایا تھا سو دیکھ لو کہ ظالموں کاانجام کیسا ہوا

Surha Aal-e-Imran (3)
هُوَ الَّذِي أَنزَلَ عَلَيْكَ الْكِتَابَ مِنْهُ آيَاتٌ مُّحْكَمَاتٌ هُنَّ أُمُّ الْكِتَابِ وَأُخَرُ مُتَشَابِهَاتٌ ۖ فَأَمَّا الَّذِينَ فِي قُلُوبِهِمْ زَيْغٌ فَيَتَّبِعُونَ مَا تَشَابَهَ مِنْهُ ابْتِغَاءَ الْفِتْنَةِ وَابْتِغَاءَ تَأْوِيلِهِ ۗ وَمَا يَعْلَمُ تَأْوِيلَهُ إِلَّا اللَّـهُ ۗ وَالرَّاسِخُونَ فِي الْعِلْمِ يَقُولُونَ آمَنَّا بِهِ كُلٌّ مِّنْ عِندِ رَبِّنَا ۗ وَمَا يَذَّكَّرُ إِلَّا أُولُو الْأَلْبَابِ ﴿٧﴾ رَبَّنَا لَا تُزِغْ قُلُوبَنَا بَعْدَ إِذْ هَدَيْتَنَا وَهَبْ لَنَا مِن لَّدُنكَ رَحْمَةً ۚ إِنَّكَ أَنتَ الْوَهَّابُ ﴿٨﴾
7 It is He who has sent down the Book to you. Some of its verses are clear and precise in meaningthey are the basis of the Bookwhile others are allegorical. Those with deviation in their hearts pursue the allegorical, so as to create dissension by seeking to explain it: but no one knows its meaning except God. Those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say, We believe in it: it is all from our Lord. But only the wise take heed. 8 Our Lord, do not let our hearts deviate after You have guided us. Bestow upon us Your mercy. Surely You are a Munificent Giver.

وہی ہے جس نے تجھ پر کتاب اتاری اس میں بعض آیتیں محکم ہیں (جن کے معنیٰ واضح ہیں) وہ کتاب کی اصل ہیں اور دوسری مشابہ ہیں (جن کے معنیٰ معلوم یا معین نہیں) سو جن لوگو ں کے دل ٹیڑھے ہیں وہ گمراہی پھیلانے کی غرض سے اور مطلب معلوم کرنے کی غرض سے متشابہات کے پیچھے لگتے ہیں اور حالانکہ ان کا مطلب سوائے الله کے اور کوئی نہیں جانتا اور مضبوط علم والے کہتے ہیں ہمارا ان چیزوں پر ایمان ہے یہ سب ہمارے رب کی طرف سے ہیں اور نصیحت وہی لوگ مانتے ہیں جو عقلمند ہیں
اے رب ہمارے! جب تو ہم کو ہدایت کر چکا تو ہمارے دلوں کا نہ پھیر اور اپنے ہاں سے ہمیں رحمت عطافرما بے شک تو بہت زیادہ دینے والا ہے

 

[saud491]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NpLkLSZDnY&feature=player_embedded#at=404

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cykY5sU8tgs

PARWEZI PROPAGANDA ​

Recently, many Muslims are propagating the western-orientated ANTI-HADITH Parwezi School of Thought. Let us look at a brief history of the origin of such a sect. Professor Habibul Haq Nadvi in his book ISLAMIC RESURGENT MOVEMENTS IN THE INDO-PAK SUBCONTINENT (page 105) says:
'They initiated public denial of the Hadith as a legal Islamic Law and led the ANTI-HADITH movement in the Sub-continent. They formulated their own theories from the Quran and reinterpreted Quranic terminology according to their own understanding, which changed the meaning of the Quran explained by classical exegists (Mufassiroon) to a great extent.'
Writing about Al-Mashriqui in the same book, he says:
'Al-Mashriqui, a graduate of Cambridge and a rationalist, started his movement through free interpretation of the Holy Quran. In his AT-TAZKIRAH (1924) and HADITH-AL-QURAN (1951), he explained his views on religion and politics. He abridged the teachings of the Quran to ten points that replaced the five accepted pillars of Islam. He was acclaimed by western scholars for his courage and reconstruction of Islamic Faith (AQAA'ID).' (Note: This is in line with the conspiracy of the West against Islam).
Professor C W Smith in his book MODERN ISLAM IN INDIA (pages 264-276) and Professor Kramer in his article in the THE MUSLIM WORLD, an American Journal, VOL 21, No.2 April 1930, have praised Al-Mashriqui for his ANTI-HADITH views and took special interest in his AT-TAZKIRAH, which is almost non-existent for the last 40 years.
Ghulam Ahmad Parwez not only continued and carried on the message of Al-Mashriqui, but he went further and expounded his own theories. Professor Habibul Haq Nadvi in his book ISLAMIC RESURGENT MOVEMENTS on page 107 says:
'He (Ghulam Ahmad Parwez) disowned the corpus of Hadith as well as classical Tafaaseer (commentaries of the Quran), which according to him cannot be trusted as a source for understanding the Quran by a modern man. Like Al-Mashriqui, he had to redefine and recoin Quranic terminology. Moreover, his translation of the Ouran had been mingled and fused with his personal views and reviews. The four volumes of his LUGHAAT-UL-QURAN were prepared in order to support their new messages and interpretations. They were jointly compiled and written by various authors with similar persuasions but were published under his name.'
On page 108 of the same book, Professor Habibul Haq Nadvi also says:
'These theories, expounded by Parwez, sparked opposition among the orthodox Ulama as well as among the modernists. He was taken by many as a closer ally to Western economic thought and philosophy rather than to the Ouranic system. Dr. Aziz Ahmad, himself a modernist and a great admirer of Parwez, was very unhappy with his NIZAAM-E-RUBUBIYYAH concepts. In his book ISLAMIC MODERNISM IN INDIA AND PAKISTAN (pages 224-225), Dr Aziz Ahmad concludes that no modernist, right from the time of Sir Sayed Ahmad Khan to the present, was so close to Western thought as was Parwez.'
It is therefore not surprising that those who follow his 'mazhab' are causing so much confusion in explaining Quranic concepts. Recently, a special article had to be written by a Parwezi DR SAYED ABDUL WADUD trying laboriously to explain away the confusions created by the articles RELIGION AND LAW and RELIGION AND SCIENCE. These are the results of formulating one's own theories in the Quran and reinterpreting Quranic ideologies according to one's own understanding.
These Parwezis are still 'BARKING' aimlessly in their campaign to label all followers of the Hanafee, Maliki, Shafe'i and Hanbali Schools of Thought as MUSHRIKS (i.e. one who associates partners with Allah). According to their belief, all great scholars and saints in Islam are MUSHRIKS. Na'oozubillah! The Saint of all saints Sayyiduna Abdul Qadir Jeelani (RA), great scholars like Allamah ibn Taimiyyah, Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab and his son Shaikh Abdullah were all followers of the Hanbali School of Thought. Does this mean that they were MUSHRIKS? Na'oozubillah. By this principle, even they themselves are MUSHRIKS as they are blind followers of Parwez's un-Islamic theories. Let these Parwezis get their facts right as their own logical thinking process is also failing to support them.
These Parwezis believe that the Ulama in the Quran refers to the Scientists. Let us ask them one question: Does the Quran refer to westernized GODLESS scientists as Ulama or those who are firmly grounded in Faith? Every Muslim knows that the Quran does contain many scientific facts, which the Ulama are aware of. But this does not mean that the Ulama must study BOTANY, GEOLOGY, BIOLOGY, ANTHROPOLOGY, COSMOLOGY, ASTRONOMY, METEOROLOGY and NEPHOLOGY as we have them today. Such completely constructed sciences were not in existence in the time of Rasoolullah (SAW). And who can be a greater ALIM (sing. of ULAMA) than Rasoolullah (SAW)? O Allah! Help them to keep their big mouth shut until they KNOW what they are talking about. Ameen!
The Parwezis also openly reject the miraculous birth of Hazrath Isaa (AS), his miraculous ascension to heaven and his second coming into this world. The Holy Quran is very clear without any ambiguity on the miraculous birth and ascension of Hazrath Isaa (AS). But the Parwezis have played verbal gymnastics with these verses of the Quran as well. Articles such as SAVIOURS AND VIRGINS etc. are now appearing in many magazines and newsletters specifically to mock the following clear and unambiguous verses of the Quran:
SHE (MANY) SAID: '0 MY LORD! HOW SHALL I HAVE A SON WHEN NO MAN HATH TOUCHED ME?' HE (THE ANGEL) SAID: 'EVEN SO: ALLAH CREATETH WHAT HE WILLETH; WHEN HE HAD DECREED A PLAN, HE BUT SAITH TO IT, 'BE', AND IT IS!' (Surah Ah Imraan: 47)
HE (THE ANGEL) SAID: 'NAY I AM ONLY A MESSENGER FROM THY LORD (TO ANNOUNCE) TO THEE THE GIFT OF A HOLY SON.' SHE (MARYAM) SAID: 'HOW SHALL I HAVE A SON, SEEING THAT NO MAN HAS TOUCHED ME AND I AM NOT UNCHASTE?' (Surah Maryam: 19-20)
How then can we have any confidence on such Parwezis who make changes (TAHREEF) of the Kalaam of Allah? It definitely seem that they have a completely WESTERNISED version of the Quran as well.
These Parwezis have replaced Salaah and Zikrullah with Music as the food for their soul. Nowhere in their books is there any mention of the significance of Salaah and Zikrullah as food for the soul. A true follower of Quran should NEVER forget this great pillar of Islam. This also confirms that Salaah is no longer considered an important pillar of Islam by the Parwezis. The reason being that they dont accept the Hadith as a source of Islamic Law, so how will they read their Salaah, because the details of salaah are described only in the books of Hadith.
Let us not be misled by the stupid jokes and criticism of the Parwezis against our sincere and righteous ULAMA. Those who follow the Righteous Path of Allah are never afraid of being mocked. This mocking behaviour has always been the pre-occupation of the hypocrites and wicked ones. Allah says:
O YOU WHO BELIEVE! IF ANY FROM AMONG YOU TURN BACK FROM HIS FAITH, SOON WILL ALLAH PRODUCE A PEOPLE WHOM HE WILL LOVE AS THEY WILL LOVE HIM - LOWLY WITH THE BELIEVERS AND MIGHTY AGAINST THE REJECTERS, FIGHTING IN THE WAY OF ALLAH, AND NEVER AFRAID OF THE REPROACHES OF THOSE WHO FIND FAULTS. THAT IS THE GRACE OF ALLAH WHICH HE WILL BESTOW ON WHOM HE PLEASETH, AND ALLAH ENCOMPASSETH ALL, AND KNOWETH ALL THINGS. (Surah Al-Maa'idah: 57)
May Allah guide us all on the Straight Path, the path of those upon whom He has bestowed His favours, not of those upon whom His wrath descends nor those who are astray. Ameen.
Abdul Haq Abdul Kadir
Umhlanga Rocks, KZN, South Africa​

 

[niazi]

The use of word jinn in the quran is not meant what people mean by the use of the same word.

Jinns as people believe them do not exist but jinns talked about in the quran are people and they did and do exist. Iblees was a human not some other kind of creation. The quran has been deliberately misinterpreted by those forces who wanted to derail its message as a deen. If islam has become as mazhab instead of deen and it was all done by muslims themselves then what else these people will not do to it if they could?


The so called mullas and auliaas and scholars who pushed through changes and spread them widely without even giving them any thought, should not be trusted. They are criminals who changed islam from what it was to what it is. It is all magic of mullas, ruling elite and ignorant muslims.

People need to think things through and question their interpretations. By accepting all these make belief things in the name of islam people are actually helping destroy islam and muslims.

First you were making fuss about hudhuda being not a bird,now about iblees that he was a human ,well u by ur self look iblees by trying to make other people fool.

 

[saud491]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/25707350/Ghulam-ahmed-pervaiz-propaganda-of-Mullaizm

 

[crankthskunk]

Brothers,

Mughal1 has been shown the Quranic verses, but his problem is he likes to verify things from the science or what he calls reasons or senses.

I am proving him from science, reasons that human senses are very limited. And even according to the limited knowledge humans have, proves that almost whole of the light spectrum we human cannot see, except a very tiny part. Therefore, Angels and Jinns are not the only things, not visible to us but whole spectrum of light and energy fields we cannot see.

We cannot see them does not mean they are not all around us.

Mughal1,

Here is another video, from your god NASA, describing the EMS. According to the video, our rooms are filled with Rays, which we cannot see.

Reception on our TV, Radio, Satellite equipment, operation of your remotes, even microwaves to heat your food are all realities at the moment, waves which our human eyes cannot see, operate all these equipment. But you know they all work.

Your condition is of people 200 years ago, if someone would have asked them, I saw the glimpse of the future where you could see and hear people live talking from thousands of miles away or even from space, he would not believe you. But through TV and satellite signals we can watch live broadcasts from any corner of the earth and from space too.

Similarly even 70 years ago if someone would have said, you can heat up your food or even cook it, by using some unseen wave length, he would have consider you a nutcase.

But all these are realities now. Human history is proving that our knowledge is very limited indeed.

While Allah SWT over and over Decreed, with HIM SWT is the knowledge of the Unseen, but you are reluctant to agree to it.

If your NASA says to you in your room there are all kind of electromagnetic waves which operates the gadgets we all use, you will not only agree but accept it whole heartedly.

You only find it difficult to accept the existence of the Angels and Jinns despite Allah SWT clearly Decreeing in the Holy Quran that Allah SWT Created them with light and fire respectively.

Even though your science says, we only see very very tiny part of EMS but you still believe on idiots like Pervaiz who was neither a scholar nor a religiously educated person. But just a stooge, who tried to introduced his lies for the meanings of the Holy Quran.

And you call yourself logical?

 

[murtaza79]

It is absolutely non sense that Abdullah Shah is "SAHABI" and seven visits of his grave are useful for patients

 

[crankthskunk]

It is absolutely non sense that Abdullah Shah is "SAHABI" and seven visits of his grave are useful for patients

I am not defending what is shown in this program. Either if people were really possess or other information given in this program. In my personal opinion this program, not this episode but the series itself is very poorly prepared. Pakistanis are not good in making documentaries. What I have seen recently, they are trying to do programs like "Idrak" by picking up thousands of videos available on youtube, by including the images from those videos to create a dramatic impact on people.

My contribution and arguments are only based on the Quranic evidence of Angels and Jinns.

 

[shamsheer]

Dear EniGma, I don't curse anyone just stating facts as I understand them. Allah sent his message for giving people his direction and not to reenforce the nonsense the people already believed.

Our problem is that we try to understand the quran according to those peoples' explanations who never understood things from Allah's point of view rather they just pushed forth whatever was already in their own minds according to their own cultures and ways of life. Also prophetic household was destroyed for this very purpose to bring back imperialism against which the prophets struggled through out history.

The islam in the quran is no where to be seen because people are happy with whatever they have as islam. You cannot get back to that islam today for the very same reasons you could not in the first place. Imagine how hard the divine prophets had to struggle against people full of superstitions. This is the real miracle we are not seeing. Even today one is not allowed to stop muslims from worshiping graves and peers.

Getting people out of nonsense is biggest miracle of our prophet. However they did not stay away from nonsense for very long just like bani israel did not keep away from all sorts of nonsense despite prophet after prophet tried his utmost to put them on right track. All they did was fight with those who tried to educate them.

The quran is full of rational arguments simply for educating people out of make beliefs. I don't think anyone can come out of nonsense unless one makes real effort in trying to discover for oneself what exactly the quran may be trying to convey. All people who try and interpret the quran or try to understand the quran according to their preconceived ideas are bound to fail to understand it because the quran is here to convey its own ideas and concepts. This is absolutely vital point that is decisive in understanding of the quran in my view.

I have nothing against people who sincerely try and fail but only those who stop people even from trying for whatever reasons of their own. The quran takes scientific approach to things and stops people from make beliefs by asking them for proofs for their claims. Blind faith is wrong in light of the quran

regards and all the best.

And you claim to understand Alla's point of view more than Prophet Muhammad PBUH and his Sahaba? After 1400 years arabic of Allah has started making sense to some non arabs preachers that you follow? We have argued with you in the past too. Do not distort the message of Quran. Quran clearly talks in simple plain arabic that Jinnat is made of Fire, Angles are made of Light and humans are made of clay. If you do not want to comprehend the facts and want to give a new meaning to the words of arabic to appease the world you should worry about your eman. Quran is a not a parable. It was revealed in plain arabic that makes perfect sense to every sane person.
Tell me if you believe that you are wiser than Prophet Muhammad PBUH and Sahaba? just give this answer before copy pasting several paragraphs.

 

[biomat]

Guys he is busy on other thread now same as he left hudhud thread..
http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...ctors-in-US-accept-evolutionary-theory-Survey
Most-Pakistani-doctors-in-US-accept-evolutionary-theory-Survey

 

[modern fakir]

Ignorant, criminal ...and Ibleesi muslims like you ...Have you checked your language you moron ..How dare you call Awliya Allah Ra...with these worse names..These are only befitting of your retarded mental mind set. Its people like you who cause fasad fil ard..and start fights here and there...If you dont believe in something ..you dont have to ..No one is holding a gun to your forehead ...But atleast have the decency to respect Allah's Friends ...but i think decency is too civilized a trait to be expected from an uneducated Hick such as urselves.

Stick to the topic and learn to control your tongue ..It is only reflective of a troubled upbringing and nothing else ..

The use of word jinn in the quran is not meant what people mean by the use of the same word.

Jinns as people believe them do not exist but jinns talked about in the quran are people and they did and do exist. Iblees was a human not some other kind of creation. The quran has been deliberately misinterpreted by those forces who wanted to derail its message as a deen. If islam has become as mazhab instead of deen and it was all done by muslims themselves then what else these people will not do to it if they could?

The so called mullas and auliaas and scholars who pushed through changes and spread them widely without even giving them any thought, should not be trusted. They are criminals who changed islam from what it was to what it is. It is all magic of mullas, ruling elite and ignorant muslims.

People need to think things through and question their interpretations. By accepting all these make belief things in the name of islam people are actually helping destroy islam and muslims.

 

[Mughal1]

FAMOUS DEBATE SHIA VS SUNNI MUNAZRA (Day1 - Topic: Shaykh Tahir ul Qadri sets Dialogue Foundation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzJM1BIJlOo


FAMOUS SHIA VS SUNNI MUNAZRA (Day25 - " Following the Jama'ah ")
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx4Qhi8vyjg&feature=related



http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...-theory-Survey&p=448753&viewfull=1#post448753