Ahmed Shah Masood's brilliant response to Taliban

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

If to ask from Afghanis ... there u mean there should be democracy in Afghanistan. Although I also don't like democracy ... but at least it is better than talban type rule.

So I appreciate you for this.

Now come to 'potent' force.

To prove that talban is popular force, elections are needed.

If it is other type of force .. then at the most it is militia. How much powerful it is...???

It is not powerful than opponent military.
democracy cannot work in afghanistan, you should go to afghanistan and ask people the question you have asked me of whether people want Talibas peace or were they happier with civil war. As for potent force i meant as resistance force taliban are potent, if afghans didnt support taliban then they would be easily defeated by military might of ISAF.
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

The reason is very simple bro, they are barbarians with guns and general population is fearful of them.

I'm not sure why this warrior nation that has confronted many invading forces cannot defeat taliban barbarians especially when thr general population has one of the most powerful military on its side
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

Also ... there is one way to know whether Afghanis were happy with the "peace" brought to them by Talban or not...

Consider following:

Human Rights Watch cites no human rights crimes for the forces under direct control of Massoud for the period from October 1996 until the assassination of Massoud in September 2001.[SUP][20][/SUP] 400,000 to one million Afghans fled from the Taliban to the area of Massoud.[SUP][81][/SUP][SUP][103][/SUP] National Geographic concluded in its documentary "Inside the Taliban":

So Afganis considered Massod area more peaceful that's why about 0.4 to 1.0 million afghanies migrated to area under the control of Massood.

If afghans loved massoud so much then why was he so weak compared to taliban?
 

iceburg

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

Quoting Wikipedia for Tlaiban is like Quoting wikipedia on the Kashmir conflict.Try it
You will get a one sided view.
Massoud by any measure killed far more then the Taliban could even dream of.
If you find this fact surprising you dont know anything about Afghanistan.

I have source at least. Now it is valid unless proved wrong. Wikipedia is a sea of information and it is useful. Will you not ever use a useful thing if some contents are found biased?

Second source is contained inside the quote itself. It is a National Geography documentary.
 

iceburg

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

If afghans loved massoud so much then why was he so weak compared to taliban?

See following to know how Talban became able to defeat Massood:

The Taliban, however, suffered a devastating defeat against government forces of the Islamic State under the command of Ahmad Shah Massoud. The Taliban's early victories in 1994 were followed by a series of defeats that resulted in heavy losses which led analysts to believe that the Taliban movement as such might have run its course.[SUP][53][/SUP]Pakistan, however, started to provide stronger military support to the Taliban.[SUP][46][/SUP][SUP][61][/SUP] Many analysts like Amin Saikal describe the Taliban as developing into a proxy force for Pakistan's regional interests.[SUP][46][/SUP] On September 26, 1996, as the Taliban with military support by Pakistan and financial support by Saudi Arabia prepared for another major offensive, Massoud ordered a full retreat from Kabul to continue anti-Taliban resistance in the Hindu Kush mountains instead of engaging in street battles in Kabul.[SUP][62][/SUP] The Taliban entered Kabul on September 27, 1996, and established the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan.[SUP][63][/SUP]
 

iceburg

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

democracy cannot work in afghanistan, you should go to afghanistan and ask people the question you have asked me of whether people want Talibas peace or were they happier with civil war. As for potent force i meant as resistance force taliban are potent, if afghans didnt support taliban then they would be easily defeated by military might of ISAF.

With following link you will find Afghani ppl opinions against Talban

http://www.rawa.org/index.php
 

Islam Yes

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

in short Islam is peace,Talibanisim is violence



الفاظ تو بہت حکیمانہ ہیں ، مگر یہ حکمت صرف "مجسموں" تک ہی محدود تھی


احمد شاہ مسعود ، افغان وار لارڈز میں سے ایک ظالم اور متعصب جنگجو تھا


افغان جہاد نے ان جنگجوں کے اصلی چہرے چھپا دئیے تھے ، احمد شاہ مسعود کا بھی اصلی چہرہ پشتون دشمن ، "متعصب تاجک" اور نسل پرست کا تھا

Taliban were created to end violence in Afghanistan ;)

Great answer. Don't destory anyone's worship places. If you are so desperate about islam then preach them islam. Good behavior have lasting effects than fear.

Is it difficult for Allah to destroy worship places of hindus and Christians? No, he can do so in seconds but he wants them to convert willingly and not due to some fear.

....and they did the opposite.Munafiqs

Following was the method to "end violence"...!!!

Massacre campaigns




According to a 55-page report by the United Nations, the Taliban, while trying to consolidate control over northern and western Afghanistan, committed systematic massacres against civilians.[SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP] UN officials stated that there had been "15 massacres" between 1996 and 2001.[SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP] They also said, that "[t]hese have been highly systematic and they all lead back to the [Taliban] Ministry of Defense or to Mullah Omar himself."[SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP] "These are the same type of war crimes as were committed in Bosnia and should be prosecuted in international courts", one UN official was quoted as saying.[SUP][29][/SUP] The documents also reveal the role of Arab and Pakistani support troops in these killings.[SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP] Bin Laden's so-called 055 Brigade was responsible for mass-killings of Afghan civilians.[SUP][24][/SUP] The report by the United Nationsquotes "eyewitnesses in many villages describing Arab fighters carrying long knives used for slitting throats and skinning people".[SUP][29][/SUP][SUP][30][/SUP] The Taliban's former ambassador to Pakistan, Mullah Abdul Salam Zaeef, in late 2011 stated that cruel behaviour under and by the Taliban had been "necessary".[SUP][152][/SUP]
In 1998, the United Nations accused the Taliban of denying emergency food by the UN's World Food Programme to 160,000 hungry and starving people "for political and military reasons".[SUP][153][/SUP] The UN said the Taliban were starving people for their military agenda and using humanitarian assistance as a weapon of war.
On August 8, 1998 the Taliban launched an attack on Mazar-i Sharif. Of 1500 defenders only 100 survived the engagement. Once in control the Taliban began to kill people indiscriminately. At first shooting people in the street, they soon began to target Hazaras. Women were raped, and thousands of people were locked in containers and left to suffocate. This ethnic cleansing left an estimated 5,000 to 6,000 dead.[SUP][74][/SUP][SUP][154][/SUP] At this time ten Iranian diplomats and a journalist were killed. Iran assumed the Taliban had murdered them, and mobilized its army, deploying men along the border with Afghanistan. By the middle of September there were 250,000 Iranian personal stationed on the border. Pakistan mediated and the bodies were returned to Tehran towards the end of the month. The killings of the Diplomats had been carried out by Sipah-e-Sahaba a Pakistani Sunni group with close ties to the ISI.[SUP][101][/SUP][SUP][155][/SUP] They burned orchards, crops and destroyed irrigation systems, and forced more than 100,000 people from their homes with hundreds of men, women and children still unaccounted for.[SUP][156][/SUP]
In a major effort to retake the Shomali plains from the United Front, the Taliban indiscriminately killed civilians, while uprooting and expelling the population. Among others, Kamal Hossein, a special reporter for the UN, reported on these and other war crimes. The city of Istalif i. e. was home to more than 45,000 people. In Istalif the Taliban gave 24 hours notice to the population to leave, then completely razed the town leaving the people destitute.[SUP][33][/SUP][SUP][157][/SUP]
In 1999 the town of Bamian was taken, hundreds of men, women and children were executed. Houses were razed and some were used for forced labor.[SUP][158][/SUP] There was a further massacre at the town of Yakaolang in January 2001. An estimated 300 people were murdered, along with two delegations of Hazara elders who had tried to intercede.[SUP][16][/SUP]
By 1999, the Taliban had forced hundreds of thousands of people from the Shomali Plains and other regions conducting a policy of scorched earth burning homes, farm land and gardens.[SUP][33][/SUP]

Sorry don't trust UN reports but I'm sure all sides commit atrocities during war.

The reason is very simple bro, they are barbarians with guns and general population is fearful of them.

Quoting Wikipedia for Tlaiban is like Quoting wikipedia on the Kashmir conflict.Try it
You will get a one sided view.
Massoud by any measure killed far more then the Taliban could even dream of.
If you find this fact surprising you dont know anything about Afghanistan.


I think Pakistan and its people are in deep sleep of deception from people like [MENTION=26330]iceburg[/MENTION]

Ahmad Shah Mahsood considered Pakistan as its Number 1 enemy. And at extreme he considered to capture half of Pakistan and include into Afghanistan.

But amazingly People of Pakistan like above are drunk or what, they are praising him. SubhanAllah. Apni moot ko awaz da rahy ho...lagay raho....gedaro, lagay raho...or Pakistan ko bach dalo...yeah he chahtay ho tum log.

Allah be ha......inshaAllah wo ho ga jo Allah chahay ga.....or ALLAH HAQ ka sath ha....batil ka sath nahi.


In the mean time, read this news and then start your plan to DIMOLISH PAKISTAN.............ALLAH ka gazab ho us per jo ISLAM ka khilaf sazish karay or us ka hisa banay...ameen.

http://www.tolonews.com/en/afghanistan/2588-isi-behind-assassination-of-ahmad-shah-massoud-relatives
[h=1]ISI Behind Assassination of Ahmad Shah Massoud: Relatives[/h]
Wednesday, 04 May 2011 19:44Written by TOLOnews.com
ahmad-shah-massoud.jpg


Ahmad Zia Massoud, the former vice-president and the brother of Ahmad Shah Massoud, Wednesday accused Pakistan's ISI of being directly behind Massoud's assassination.

Ahmad Zia Massoud said Osama Bin Laden, the former leader of al-Qaeda terror network, assassinated Ahmad Shah Massoud under the instruction of Pakistan.

People close to Ahmad Shah Massoud see the presence of Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) as a big threat to Afghanistan and the region.

On 9 September 2001, two days before the 9/11, two Arab nationals posing as journalists assassinated Ahmad Shah Massoud, the national hero of Afghanistan, in his base in northern Afghanistan after winning a chance to interview him.

"Ahmad Shah Massoud was an obstacle to Pakistan and some other neighbouring countries, so they plotted to get him assassinated by a terrorist organisation," Ahmad Zia Massoud, the brother of Massoud, said.

Some of Ahmad Shah Massoud's relatives criticise the Afghan government of not pursuing a thorough investigation into the assassination.

"Regretfully, the investigations have not gone further from the time they started," Afghan Ambassador in Spain, Massoud Khalili, said.

"The factory of insurgent networks in the region and in particular in Afghanistan is run by Pakistan's military intelligence organisation," Ahmad Wali Massoud, head of Massoud foundation and Massoud's brother, said.

Two days after Massoud's assassination the world was shocked by the 9/11 attacks carried out by al-Qaeda terror network.

The comments come after Osama Bin Laden was killed in Pakistan in an operation by US special forces. Osama
 

Hippie

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

I'm not sure why this warrior nation that has confronted many invading forces cannot defeat taliban barbarians especially when thr general population has one of the most powerful military on its side

By the same reason as all powerful Pakistan Army and other security apparatus can not stop the terrorists from attacking all over Pakistan and on Security forces itself.
 

sohailkhan007

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

Is this the same UNO u talkin about.....
[h=2]Afghanistan, Opium and the Taliban[/h]
JALALABAD, Afghanistan (February 15, 2001 8:19
p.m. EST


U.N. drug control officers said the Taliban religious militia has nearly
wiped out opium production in Afghanistan -- once the world's largest producer
-- since banning poppy cultivation last summer.

A 12-member team from the U.N. Drug Control Program spent two weeks searching
most of the nation's largest opium-producing areas and found so few poppies that
they do not expect any opium to come out of Afghanistan this year.

"We are not just guessing. We have seen the proof in the fields," said
Bernard Frahi, regional director for the U.N. program in Afghanistan and
Pakistan. He laid out photographs of vast tracts of land cultivated with wheat
alongside pictures of the same fields taken a year earlier -- a sea of blood-red
poppies.

A State Department official said Thursday all the information the United
States has received so far indicates the poppy crop had decreased, but he did
not believe it was eliminated.

Last year, Afghanistan produced nearly 4,000 tons of opium, about 75 percent
of the world's supply, U.N. officials said. Opium -- the milky substance drained
from the poppy plant -- is converted into heroin and sold in Europe and North
America. The 1999 output was a world record for opium production, the United
Nations said -- more than all other countries combined, including the "Golden
Triangle," where the borders of Thailand, Laos and Myanmar meet.

Mullah Mohammed Omar, the Taliban's supreme leader, banned poppy growing
before the November planting season and augmented it with a religious edict
making it contrary to the tenets of Islam.

The Taliban, which has imposed a strict brand of Islam in the 95 percent of
Afghanistan it controls, has set fire to heroin laboratories and jailed farmers
until they agreed to destroy their poppy crops.

The U.N. surveyors, who completed their search this week, crisscrossed
Helmand, Kandahar, Urzgan and Nangarhar provinces and parts of two others --
areas responsible for 86 percent of the opium produced in Afghanistan last year,
Frahi said in an interview Wednesday. They covered 80 percent of the land in
those provinces that last year had been awash in poppies.

This year they found poppies growing on barely an acre here and there, Frahi
said. The rest -- about 175,000 acres -- was clean.

"We have to look at the situation with careful optimism," said Sandro Tucci
of the U.N. Office for Drug Control and Crime Prevention in Vienna, Austria.

He said indications are that no poppies were planted this season and that, as
a result, there hasn't been any production of opium -- but that officials would
keep checking.

The State Department counternarcotics official said the department would make
its own estimate of the poppy crop. Information received so far suggests there
will be a decrease, but how much is not yet clear, he said, speaking on
condition of anonymity.

"We do not think by any stretch of the imagination that poppy cultivation in
Afghanistan has been eliminated. But we, like the rest of the world, welcome
positive news."

The Drug Enforcement Administration declined to comment.

No U.S. government official can enter Afghanistan because of security
concerns stemming from the presence of suspected terrorist Osama bin Laden.

Poppies are harvested in March and April, which is why the survey was done
now. Tucci said it would have been impossible for the poppies to have been
harvested already.

The areas searched by the U.N. surveyors are the most fertile lands under
Taliban control. Other areas, though they are somewhat fertile, have not
traditionally been poppy growing areas and farmers are struggling to raise any
crops at all because of severe drought. The rest of the land held by the Taliban
is mountainous or desert, where poppies could not grow.

Karim Rahimi, the U.N. drug control liaison in Jalalabad, capital of
Nangarhar province, said farmers were growing wheat or onions in fields where
they once grew poppies.

"It is amazing, really, when you see the fields that last year were filled
with poppies and this year there is wheat," he said.

The Taliban enforced the ban by threatening to arrest village elders and
mullahs who allowed poppies to be grown. Taliban soldiers patrolled in trucks
armed with rocket-propelled grenade launchers. About 1,000 people in Nangarhar
who tried to defy the ban were arrested and jailed until they agreed to destroy
their crops.

Signs throughout Nangarhar warn against drug production and use, some calling
it an "illicit phenomenon." Another reads: "Be drug free, be happy."

Last year, poppies grew on 12,600 acres of land in Nangarhar province.
According to the U.N. survey, poppies were planted on only 17 acres there this
season and all were destroyed by the Taliban.

"The Taliban have done their work very seriously," Frahi said.

But the ban has badly hurt farmers in one of the world's poorest countries,
shattered by two decades of war and devastated by drought.

Ahmed Rehman, who shares less than three acres in Nangarhar with his three
brothers, said the opium he produced last year on part of the land brought him
$1,100.

This year, he says, he will be lucky to get $300 for the onions and cattle
feed he planted on the entire parcel.

"Life is very bad for me this year," he said. "Last year I was able to buy
meat and wheat and now this year there is nothing."

But Rehman said he never considered defying the ban.

"The Taliban were patrolling all the time. Of course I was afraid. I did not
want to go to jail and lose my freedom and my dignity," he said, gesturing with
dirt-caked hands.

Shams-ul-Haq Sayed, an officer of the Taliban drug control office in
Jalalabad, said farmers need international aid.

"This year was the most important for us because growing poppies was part of
their culture, and the first years are always the most difficult," he said.

Tucci said discussions are under way on how to help the farmers.

Western diplomats in Pakistan have suggested the Taliban is simply trying to
drive up the price of opium they have stockpiled. The State Department official
also said Afghanistan could do more by destroying drug stockpiles and heroin
labs and arresting producers and traffickers.

Frahi dismissed that as "nonsense" and said it is drug traffickers and
shopkeepers who have stockpiles. Two pounds of opium worth $35 last year are now
worth as much as $360, he said.

Mullah Amir Mohammed Haqqani, the Taliban's top drug official in Nangarhar,
said the ban would remain regardless of whether the Taliban received aid or
international recognition.
"It is our decree that there will be no poppy cultivation. It is banned
forever in this country," he said. "Whether we get assistance or not, poppy
growing will never be allowed again in our country.
 

iceburg

Banned
@Islam Yes

Where did I praise Massood...???

I only presented some facts that falsify certain talban claims

I like talban being creation of ISI and defeating Masood.

But I dislike that at the end ... Talban turned disloyel to Pakistan.

They should work under Pakistan and that will be good for them and Pakistan both...!!!

End attitude of Talban was only of a person ... jis ko os ki awoqat se ziada mil gaya tha...!!!
 
Last edited:

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

See following to know how Talban became able to defeat Massood:

The Taliban, however, suffered a devastating defeat against government forces of the Islamic State under the command of Ahmad Shah Massoud. The Taliban's early victories in 1994 were followed by a series of defeats that resulted in heavy losses which led analysts to believe that the Taliban movement as such might have run its course.[SUP][53][/SUP]Pakistan, however, started to provide stronger military support to the Taliban.[SUP][46][/SUP][SUP][61][/SUP] Many analysts like Amin Saikal describe the Taliban as developing into a proxy force for Pakistan's regional interests.[SUP][46][/SUP] On September 26, 1996, as the Taliban with military support by Pakistan and financial support by Saudi Arabia prepared for another major offensive, Massoud ordered a full retreat from Kabul to continue anti-Taliban resistance in the Hindu Kush mountains instead of engaging in street battles in Kabul.[SUP][62][/SUP] The Taliban entered Kabul on September 27, 1996, and established the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan.[SUP][63][/SUP]
What is your point? Mossouds men were better equipped, Taliban suffered loses, they came back on equal footing with Pakistans support and pushed back Mossoud.
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

By the same reason as all powerful Pakistan Army and other security apparatus can not stop the terrorists from attacking all over Pakistan and on Security forces itself.
Taliban have outright control of many parts in Afghanistan and in some parts they have shadow governments, can you tell me how many parts of Pakistan are in complete control of TTP? As for terrorist attacks, they can happen anywhere.
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
@Islam Yes

Where did I praise Massood...???

I only presented some facts that falsify certain talban claims

I like talban being creation of ISI and defeating Masood.

But I dislike that at the end ... Talban turned disloyel to Pakistan.

They should work under Pakistan and that will be good for them and Pakistan both...!!!

End attitude of Talban was only of a person ... jis ko os ki awoqat se ziada mil gaya tha...!!!
ISI did not create Taliban but they did support them. It was Pakistan that turned disloyal to Taliban after 9/11.
 

iceburg

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

[hilar] are you seriously saying a secular feminist website represents view of afghan people?

Everyone who dares to speak is secular. Others just don't dare ... lest the 'peace' my not disturb with them. Like RAWA founder lady was also killed.
 

Mullah Omar

Minister (2k+ posts)
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

Everyone who dares to speak is secular. Others just don't dare ... lest the 'peace' my not disturb with them. Like RAWA founder lady was also killed.
The point is RAWA does not represent afghans ;)
 

iceburg

Banned
Re: Ahmed Shah Masood's brillient response to Talban

cheers, you should also stop denying facts.

Ok so what if they brought peace during civil war conditions. Then now in Pakistan (despite terrorism) there is still better peace than talban rule of afghanistan.

Why then you insist on talban rule in Pakistan...???
 

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