An account of Iftikhar Chaudherys Brilliant Career

[LeftBrain]

First you need to define who are "WE"?
When did "WE" asked for army interference?
And how becoming a goon in order to eliminate another goon can help solve any problem?

 

[MANNO]

Then let us get together and define those limits instead of bashing the people who helped create the freedom in the first place!

I mean this is all we do. We pit one institution against the other. If the parliament is corrupt we beg the army, if the army goes overboard we beg the judiciary, if the media goes overboard we beg for censorship.

My point is that since we are getting our institutions out of the clutches of self serving goons we should now work towards strengthening them through legislation instead of looking towards another institution to counter and challenge it!

This trend gives rise to hero worship when one person fells another and we sing their praises and then he becomes a tyrant and we look for yet another.

If institutions are strong from within then wont need to look for heroes to take care of us. These institutions will be the saviors themselves.

I guess you are living in fools paradise! Now days many people are relying on their so called free judiciary and my pupose of sharing above was very simple that we need to stop worshiping personalities. Instead we must initiate something good ourself instead of depending on so called heros. Do you really think that Mr Iftikhar Chaurhary is doing his job honestly? He fought for his own personal interest and such people dont deserve to be called Heros! Also such movements of self interests cannot protect institutions.

 

[awan4ever]

First you need to define who are "WE"?
When did "WE" asked for army interference?
And how becoming a goon in order to eliminate another goon can help solve any problem?

We are the 'people' who have been kicked around all along in this whole drama of power mongering generals and politicians.
We have a voice. We have our eyes open to many things now. We should atleast if nothing else support the strengthening of the institutions by our words.

Now it is debatable if they are becoming goons or not because right now the former goons i.e. the parliament are mostly blaming them for checking their powers. I for one am going to wait and see where they go with this before i take a stance against the judiciary. I would like the parliament to be given a few wake up calls by someone other than the military. At least wr know the judiciary cant come and take over like the Army. So let us give them a chance to work things out.

 

[awan4ever]

I guess you are living in fools paradise! Now days many people are relying on their so called free judiciary and my pupose of sharing above was very simple that we need to stop worshiping personalities. Instead we must initiate something good ourself instead of depending on so called heros. Do you really think that Mr Iftikhar Chaurhary is doing his job honestly? He fought for his own personal interest and such people dont deserve to be called Heros! Also such movements of self interests cannot protect institutions.

Ok then your suggestion would be what?

Zardari should sack the whole bench?
Army should take over the judiciary?
We should storm the Supreme Court like Nawaz Sharif did?

Id like to hear your suggestions on how to make the judiciary better.

 

[MANNO]

We are the 'people' who have been kicked around all along in this whole drama of power mongering generals and politicians.
We have a voice. We have our eyes open to many things now. We should atleast if nothing else support the strengthening of the institutions by our words.

Now it is debatable if they are becoming goons or not because right now the former goons i.e. the parliament are mostly blaming them for checking their powers. I for one am going to wait and see where they go with this before i take a stance against the judiciary. I would like the parliament to be given a few wake up calls by someone other than the military. At least wr know the judiciary cant come and take over like the Army. So let us give them a chance to work things out.

And what will Judiciary do in return?

 

[awan4ever]

And what will Judiciary do in return?

I already said that I am atleast willing to wait and see where they go now that they have been given a fair chance to prove their worth.

 

[MANNO]

I already said that I am atleast willing to wait and see where they go now that they have been given a fair chance to prove their worth.

What would you say about recent performance of so called azad Adaliya regarding "Do number degree case" ?

 

[MANNO]

Ok then your suggestion would be what?

Zardari should sack the whole bench?
Army should take over the judiciary?
We should storm the Supreme Court like Nawaz Sharif did?

Id like to hear your suggestions on how to make the judiciary better.

I would like to see and be part of revolution instead! Revolution would never prevail in Pakistan until we do not stop worshiping and relying on hypocrats like Ch. Iftikhar.

 

[awan4ever]

What would you say about recent performance of so called azad Adaliya regarding "Do number degree case" ?

Someone had to resign finally!
When was the lat time that happened in our political culture?

I know we want people to be hanged right and left (and some times i want that too i wont lie) but like I said try to look at the positives too.

 

[MANNO]

Someone had to resign finally!
When was the lat time that happened in our political culture?

I know we want people to be hanged right and left (and some times i want that too i wont lie) but like I said try to look at the positives too.

Exactly and later on the same person became the advisor of PM. We must expect a safe exit for every corrupt and criminals from your so called free judiciary. Are you trying to justify the judiciary's act of providing safe exit to a criminal?

 

[awan4ever]

Exactly and later on the same person became the advisor of PM. We must expect a safe exit for every corrupt and criminals from your so called free judiciary. Are you trying to justify the judiciary's act of providing safe exit to a criminal?

I think we are expecting miracles. Im not. I believe its going to be a slow process. You want instant justice. Thats something available in mature educated societies. We have a long way to go. Right now ill settle for that guy being removed from office. Hopefully in the not so distant future people will get punished too.

 

[LeftBrain]

We are the 'people' who have been kicked around all along in this whole drama of power mongering generals and politicians.
We have a voice. We have our eyes open to many things now. We should atleast if nothing else support the strengthening of the institutions by our words.

Now it is debatable if they are becoming goons or not because right now the former goons i.e. the parliament are mostly blaming them for checking their powers. I for one am going to wait and see where they go with this before i take a stance against the judiciary. I would like the parliament to be given a few wake up calls by someone other than the military. At least wr know the judiciary cant come and take over like the Army. So let us give them a chance to work things out.

Bro you are not being fair. You are taking past performance of parliament and politicians and blaming them for wrong doings and assuming they will keep on doing the same mistakes, but in the same breath, you are not taking past performance of judiciary and lawyers in to account and assuming that they will do differently.
On what grounds?

 

[awan4ever]

Bro you are not being fair. You are taking past performance of parliament and politicians and blaming them for wrong doings and assuming they will keep on doing the same mistakes, but in the same breath, you are not taking past performance of judiciary and lawyers in to account and assuming that they will do differently.
On what grounds?

Someone from the judiciary came forward to lead change and a drastic change. I support the effort.
Someone from the army minded their own business all along and didnt get involved. I salute that effort.
Some people from political parties stood against party lines and brought a small change within party circles. I support those politicians for this effort even though they might have done crappy stuff in the past.

My point is that I support the effort not the person. The person can be lauded for what he did but its the effort that shows others the way. Now people know that it is possible to take stand against the army. It is possible to take a stand against party policies.

That is all i am saying. I am in no way a fanboy of Iftikhar Chaudhry. I support you if you say he is not doing enough for reforming the lower cadre of the judiciary. I supprt you if you say he needs to bring some generals to court.
But is it possible that we can laud his effort against a dictator and also criticize him for his short comings at the same time?

I think it is.

 

[LeftBrain]

Someone from the judiciary came forward to lead change and a drastic change. I support the effort.
Someone from the army minded their own business all along and didnt get involved. I salute that effort.
Some people from political parties stood against party lines and brought a small change within party circles. I support those politicians for this effort even though they might have done crappy stuff in the past.

My point is that I support the effort not the person. The person can be lauded for what he did but its the effort that shows others the way. Now people know that it is possible to take stand against the army. It is possible to take a stand against party policies.

That is all i am saying. I am in no way a fanboy of Iftikhar Chaudhry. I support you if you say he is not doing enough for reforming the lower cadre of the judiciary. I supprt you if you say he needs to bring some generals to court.
But is it possible that we can laud his effort against a dictator and also criticize him for his short comings at the same time?

I think it is.

This is all I am trying to say repeatedly, thanks for seconding it.
This personality worshipping bring us to this disastereous position, and when we talk about Chaudhry, e should always keep in mind that he is capable of all wrong doing so dont worship him blindidly. keep an eye on him as well and try to counter all those bikaaoo people of media (like Ansar Abbasi) who are trying to portrait him as the only saviour of this country

 

[awan4ever]

This is all I am trying to say repeatedly, thanks for seconding it.
This personality worshipping bring us to this disastereous position, and when we talk about Chaudhry, e should always keep in mind that he is capable of all wrong doing so dont worship him blindidly. keep an eye on him as well and try to counter all those bikaaoo people of media (like Ansar Abbasi) who are trying to portrait him as the only saviour of this country

I didnt mean to give the fanboy impression but the topic itself is very one sided. It just criticizes him. Im ok with that too its just that I wanted to give some balance to the discussion by showing that there were some very good positives that came out of the movement so lets not discard those altogether.

I agree with you on the hero worship problem we have. Its a real hindrance in our progress and maturity as a nation.

P.S: I have to go watch to the cinema to catch ironman2 now so if you will excuse me! :D
See ya around!

 

[LeftBrain]

I didnt mean to give the fanboy impression but the topic itself is very one sided. It just criticizes him. Im ok with that too its just that I wanted to give some balance to the discussion by showing that there were some very good positives that came out of the movement so lets not discard those altogether.

I agree with you on the hero worship problem we have. Its a real hindrance in our progress and maturity as a nation.

P.S: I have to go watch to the cinema to catch ironman2 now so if you will excuse me! :D
See ya around!

Thanks for clarification bro,

Have a good time

 

[Raaz]

Exactly and later on the same person became the advisor of PM. We must expect a safe exit for every corrupt and criminals from your so called free judiciary. Are you trying to justify the judiciary's act of providing safe exit to a criminal?

This is your Chief Justice
Enjoy Him

 

[LeftBrain]

Well this same Judiciary decided in favour of every single dictator, this same judiciary decided in favour of every act of destabilizing or liquifying parliament.

This same judiciary decided to hang an elected prime minister on no evidence and no grounds.

These lawyers are the ones who defend these zameendaars, these criminals, defend gang rapists and terrorists, provide legal pathways to dictators, come up with LFO and PCO kind of ordinances.

Long live Judiciary, long live Lawyers

 

[gazoomartian]

:41:[FONT=&quot]

[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Manno ji, I salute your courage of posting something that has been truth for a long time but people have been hesitant to expose.

I have been saying for ages that justices should not be spared from factual accusations of being corrupt. It was reported that he, the CJ, has been driving a large and expensive car that exceeds the maximum allowed by the govt rule. He has also used his influence to obtain more than one residential lots in Islamabad, clearly violating the law. And now you just wrote that he help his son recruit into the FIA.

There above three deficiencies in his moral may be just a tip of the iceberg. Only Lord and he knows what else he has done. I quote here my own favourite saying: [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]جب قوم کا ہر آدمی چھوڑ، ڈاکو، اوراچکا ہو تو پھر منصف کیسے اس سے مستثنیٰ ہو سکتے[/FONT][FONT=&quot] ہیں[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]​

[FONT=&quot]Courts are labelled as AZAD, the fact is that the CJ has been zad` from the house arrest imposed by Musharaf. CJ is azad, but adlia is NOT. Tell me honestly, what has he done other than little things. The court registrars, I heard, are still charging Rs50000 just to register a case, and thats on top of the regular fees. This cost is much higher for a high profile. I do not know how true this is but knowing the situation I am willing to bet that this is correct news.

Every body is talking about article 248, why did he not take any sup moto against 248 at the beginning. AZ has been looting the country for over two years under the protection of 248. And dont tell me it takes time. If the CJ hides behind the time factor then one must think that the courts do not know how to prioritize their duties. Do you remember he was very quick in catching a corrupt woman in Khyber? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I think of another scenario: AZ must have threatened the CJ that if he rules article 248 unconstitutional then AZ would expose all the corruptions of the CJ. People would call this blackmailing but I do, in political terms, a bargaining You hide my corruption, I hide yours equal to I scratch my back and you scratch yours.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mind you that due to [/FONT][FONT=&quot]توہین عدالت[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]media does not expose courts, as much as they would love to, and they dare to expose the officials. Contempt of court itself is an article 248 for the judges. We all know the character of the judges that have the PCO cases being heard. Dogar et al.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now isnt it funny that a group of corrupt judge stands in the court of a group of corrupt judges? They will probably meet in the masters chambers and negotiate some sort of deals. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

 

[LeftBrain]

:41:[FONT=&quot]

[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Manno ji, I salute your courage of posting something that has been truth for a long time but people have been hesitant to expose.

I have been saying for ages that justices should not be spared from factual accusations of being corrupt. It was reported that he, the CJ, has been driving a large and expensive car that exceeds the maximum allowed by the govt rule. He has also used his influence to obtain more than one residential lots in Islamabad, clearly violating the law. And now you just wrote that he help his son recruit into the FIA.

There above three deficiencies in his moral may be just a tip of the iceberg. Only Lord and he knows what else he has done. I quote here my own favourite saying: [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]جب قوم کا ہر آدمی چھوڑ، ڈاکو، اوراچکا ہو تو پھر منصف کیسے اس سے مستثنیٰ ہو سکتے[/FONT][FONT=&quot] ہیں[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]​

[FONT=&quot]Courts are labelled as AZAD, the fact is that the CJ has been zad` from the house arrest imposed by Musharaf. CJ is azad, but adlia is NOT. Tell me honestly, what has he done other than little things. The court registrars, I heard, are still charging Rs50000 just to register a case, and that’s on top of the regular fees. This cost is much higher for a high profile. I do not know how true this is but knowing the situation I am willing to bet that this is correct news.

Every body is talking about article 248, why did he not take any sup moto against 248 at the beginning. AZ has been looting the country for over two years under the protection of 248. And don’t tell me it takes time. If the CJ hides behind the time factor then one must think that the courts do not know how to prioritize their duties. Do you remember he was very quick in catching a corrupt woman in Khyber? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I think of another scenario: AZ must have threatened the CJ that if he rules article 248 unconstitutional then AZ would expose all the corruptions of the CJ. People would call this blackmailing but I do, in political terms, a bargaining ‘You hide my corruption, I hide yours’ equal to ‘I scratch my back and you scratch yours’.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mind you that due to [/FONT][FONT=&quot]توہین عدالت[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]media does not expose courts, as much as they would love to, and they dare to expose the officials. Contempt of court itself is an article 248 for the judges. We all know the character of the judges that have the PCO cases being heard. Dogar et al.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Now isn’t it funny that a group of corrupt judge stands in the court of a group of corrupt judges? They will probably meet in the ‘master”s chambers’ and ‘negotiate’ some sort of deals. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

you are talking a lot sense lately!!!

kidding, agree with you 100%