Right to education for women - The mercy of an Islamic state

[KhanHaripur]

Galielo Scientifically deduced Earth Orbited the Sun, and was arrested in 1632 on the Popes Order for heretical sin. Yet 1000 Years before, Ibn Abbas (Ra) deduced from the Quran: Earth is round and even the Sun has an Orbital spin. Islam laid the foundations of Science a thousand years before the Enlightenment; firmly based on the Holy Quran. Muslims are encouraged to travel and learn so Science should enhance our Faith; rejecting God can only bring harm.

 

[Unicorn]

I would not argue about the schools because I don't know.

The story of Ibn Abas and his discovery that earth was round is not a believable story. If he proved that Earth was round specially from Quran than why did Muslims from centuries still believed that the earth was flat? Please explain.

Why did Sir Sayed Ahmed not consult the discovery of Ibn Abas and agreed with the western science and said " Yes guys we already knew this from Ibn Abas" instead he relied on Quran to prove that the earth was flat. Please explain.

 

[lurker]

This is one of those, "feel good" muslim threads. Where some OP says, "Oh Hey! Guess what!? The Earth was round, we muslims knew that before Mr Christian/Atheist/Secularist/ Tanduadamist/whatever. And it said so right here in the Quran. See! See!"

 

[salaudin]

I would not argue about the schools because I don't know.

The story of Ibn Abas and his discovery that earth was round is not a believable story. If he proved that Earth was round specially from Quran than why did Muslims from centuries still believed that the earth was flat? Please explain.

Why did Sir Sayed Ahmed not consult the discovery of Ibn Abas and agreed with the western science and said " Yes guys we already knew this from Ibn Abas" instead he relied on Quran to prove that the earth was flat. Please explain.

It were the Greeks who first thought (since Greeks had no concept of "Proving") that the earth is spherical. It was the matter of "agreeing" since there was no one to challenge him then. Put it this way, the Westerners could not care less about the shape of the earth then.

 

[Unicorn]

This is one of those, "feel good" muslim threads. Where some OP says, "Oh Hey! Guess what!? The Earth was round, we muslims knew that before Mr Christian/Atheist/Secularist/ Tanduadamist/whatever. And it said so right here in the Quran. See! See!"

O Yes, it got feel good written all over the place.

You can tell the vagueness under Islamic rule. It says that science was taught along with VARIOUS subjects, it can't be difficult to mention those "Various" subjects provided that they were there.

I just gooled to find out from a Muslim site that Fatima Al Fihriyya opened a Mosque that was converted into university which taught " natural science " there was no mention that it was for women.

 

[Unicorn]

It were the Greeks who first thought (since Greeks had no concept of "Proving") that the earth is spherical. It was the matter of "agreeing" since there was no one to challenge him then. Put it this way, the Westerners could not care less about the shape of the earth then.

If Greeks thought the earth was spherical it did not take hold, Yes there were some Greeks who did contemplated that earth was Spherical.

There were many people who had contemplated that earth was spherical before Islam but these theories were rejected because the earth looked flat to all common man.

 

[KhanHaripur]

"And we have made the earth egg shaped".*[Al-Qur’an 79:30]

The Arabic word Dahaha means egg shaped. It also means an expanse. Dahaha is derived from Duhiya which specifically refers to the egg of an ostrich which is geospherical in shape, exactly like the shape of the earth.Thus the Qur’an and modern established science are in perfect harmony.

Very simple, syed ahmed got it wrong.
Where does the Quran says earth is flat ?

I would not argue about the schools because I don't know.

The story of Ibn Abas and his discovery that earth was round is not a believable story. If he proved that Earth was round specially from Quran than why did Muslims from centuries still believed that the earth was flat? Please explain.

Why did Sir Sayed Ahmed not consult the discovery of Ibn Abas and agreed with the western science and said " Yes guys we already knew this from Ibn Abas" instead he relied on Quran to prove that the earth was flat. Please explain.

 

[salaudin]

If Greeks thought the earth was spherical it did not take hold, Yes there were some Greeks who did contemplated that earth was Spherical.

There were many people who had contemplated that earth was spherical before Islam but these theories were rejected because the earth looked flat to all common man.

Greeks could see the ships disappearing over the horizon so they had a bit of an idea that it is not perfectly flat. "Rejecting" was out of the question as they had no concept of scientific proof.

 

[yazindagi]

"And we have made the earth egg shaped".*[Al-Qur’an 79:30]

The Arabic word Dahaha means egg shaped. It also means an expanse. Dahaha is derived from Duhiya which specifically refers to the egg of an ostrich which is geospherical in shape, exactly like the shape of the earth.Thus the Qur’an and modern established science are in perfect harmony.

Very simple, syed ahmed got it wrong.
Where does the Quran says earth is flat ?

unicorn has no answer to reply.:P

 

[nvra911]

"And we have made the earth egg shaped".*[Al-Qur’an 79:30]

The Arabic word Dahaha means egg shaped. It also means an expanse. Dahaha is derived from Duhiya which specifically refers to the egg of an ostrich which is geospherical in shape, exactly like the shape of the earth.Thus the Qur’an and modern established science are in perfect harmony.

Very simple, syed ahmed got it wrong.
Where does the Quran says earth is flat ?

I strongly protest this post for the sake of honesty.

Go here to read the original Arabic and the English translation of 79:30.

Of all things, 79:30 refers to a spread, insinuating flatness. Now @KhanHaripur is saying that is it a word for spherical. How vague can you get.

I am frankly fed up that just for the sake of retro-fitting, you are interpreting the Arabic language in such a twisted manner that the same word now means spherical and flat. What-what??

That's some serious retro-fitting dude and anyone with a little reading ability and critical thinking can see right through it.

 

[nvra911]

I have a few things to add to for historical correction - as OP's post is fairly biased and more for the sake of 'feel good factor' as pointed out by ;@lurker.

When Islam spread in it early years, there were a lot of conquests for the neighboring nations, cultures and people. Most of them were very rich and prosperous. So when in early years of Islam, they were enjoined into the Islamic Empire, all the fruits of those cultures, nations and people were counted as of being of Islamic Empire.

But soon the decline followed. So much so that not a single, yes a single, scientific discovery or invention has come out of Islamic World for the last 800 years. Not a single.

So, it seems that when prosperous nations and cultures were annexed as a part of the early Islamic Empire, immediately afterwards the golden age of progress aspires. And after a centuries, it becomes so hapless that even the Mongols can come all the way over and take Baghdad from the Muslims in mid 1200s.

There is no doubt that from 700s to 1100s there was a lot of cultural hustle bustle and productivity that came out of the Islamic Empire, but those things came out of the newly acquired lands for a few centuries and even then those places became permanently intellectually barren for the next 800 years to date.

No one talks about that. Everyone is stuck in the era of 700s A.D. and how great we were one thousand four hundred years ago. Strange.

 

[Unicorn]

"And we have made the earth egg shaped".*[Al-Qur’an 79:30]

The Arabic word Dahaha means egg shaped. It also means an expanse. Dahaha is derived from Duhiya which specifically refers to the egg of an ostrich which is geospherical in shape, exactly like the shape of the earth.Thus the Qur’an and modern established science are in perfect harmony.

Very simple, syed ahmed got it wrong.
Where does the Quran says earth is flat ?

OK I will accept that Sayed Ahmed got it wrong after all he is one individual. But you have not explained why for the last 1400 years billions of Muslims have not been saying that earth is Egg shaped as per your translation? This translation is very clear and contrary to the beliefs held by the non-Muslim world at the time of revelation. Why for so long they held the same belief as non-Muslims that the earth was flat.

I think it was Zakir Naik's research that recently discovered that word Dhaha means egg shaped everyone before got it wrong. The Quran I have does not translate to egg shaped earth along with other translations that I looked up.
[FONT=&amp]79:30[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Sahih International[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Muhsin Khan[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth;[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Pickthall[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth,[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Yusuf Ali[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, moreover, hath He extended (to a wide expanse);[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Shakir[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, He expanded it after that.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Dr. Ghali[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, after that He flattened it (for life).[/FONT]

 

[Unicorn]

unicorn has no answer to reply.:P

I have:biggthumpup::biggthumpup:

 

[yazindagi]

OK I will accept that Sayed Ahmed got it wrong after all he is one individual. But you have not explained why for the last 1400 years billions of Muslims have not been saying that earth is Egg shaped as per your translation? This translation is very clear and contrary to the beliefs held by the non-Muslim word at the time of revelation. Why for so long they held the same belief as non-Muslims that the earth was flat.

I think it was Zakir Naik's research that recently discovered that word Dhaha means egg shaped everyone before got it wrong. The Quran I have does not translate to egg shaped earth along with other translations that I looked up.
[FONT=&amp]79:30[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Sahih International[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Muhsin Khan[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth;[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Pickthall[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And after that He spread the earth,[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Yusuf Ali[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, moreover, hath He extended (to a wide expanse);[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Shakir[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, He expanded it after that.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Dr. Ghali[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And the earth, after that He flattened it (for life).[/FONT]

can u give name(s)of islamic scholar(s) who agreed that earth is flat?

 

[yazindagi]

I have:biggthumpup::biggthumpup:

The concept of roundness is also present in other words derived from "dahv." For example, the word "dahv" also refers to children dropping a ball into a hole in the ground, games involving throwing stones into holes and games played with walnuts. Words derived from that root are also used for an ostrich making a nest, cleaning stones from where it is about to lie down, the place where it lays its eggs and the egg itself.

Indeed, the Earth is round, in a manner reminiscent of an egg. The slightly flattened spherical shape of the Earth is known as geoid. From that point of view, the use of the word "daha" contains important information about the shape that Allah has given to the Earth. For hundreds of years, people imagined the Earth to be completely flat and only learned the truth thanks to technology. Yet, this fact was revealed in the Qur'an fourteen centuries ago.

 

[KhanHaripur]

It says "spread" in another verse it says spreaded like carpet.the Quran doesn't mention Flat anywhere. Its th people who thought that way.

​

I strongly protest this post for the sake of honesty.

Go here to read the original Arabic and the English translation of 79:30.
Of all things, 79:30 refers to a spread, insinuating flatness. Now @KhanHaripur is saying that is it a word for spherical. How vague can you get.

I am frankly fed up that just for the sake of retro-fitting, you are interpreting the Arabic language in such a twisted manner that the same word now means spherical and flat. What-what??

That's some serious retro-fitting dude and anyone with a little reading ability and critical thinking can see right through it.

 

[nvra911]

It says "spread" in another verse it says spreaded like carpet.the Quran doesn't mention Flat anywhere. Its th people who thought that way.

Dude which carpet, today and all through history of humanity, has been spread so usually on a 'spherical' surface that it becomes the usual example?

Normally spreading of a carpet would be used to refer to flatness and not 'sphere-ness' of something.

 

[lurker]

An Egg is NOT spherical.

"And we have made the earth egg shaped".*[Al-Qur’an 79:30]

The Arabic word Dahaha means egg shaped. It also means an expanse. Dahaha is derived from Duhiya which specifically refers to the egg of an ostrich which is geospherical in shape, exactly like the shape of the earth.Thus the Qur’an and modern established science are in perfect harmony.

Very simple, syed ahmed got it wrong.
Where does the Quran says earth is flat ?

 

[Unicorn]

The concept of roundness is also present in other words derived from "dahv." For example, the word "dahv" also refers to children dropping a ball into a hole in the ground, games involving throwing stones into holes and games played with walnuts. Words derived from that root are also used for an ostrich making a nest, cleaning stones from where it is about to lie down, the place where it lays its eggs and the egg itself.

Indeed, the Earth is round, in a manner reminiscent of an egg. The slightly flattened spherical shape of the Earth is known as geoid. From that point of view, the use of the word "daha" contains important information about the shape that Allah has given to the Earth. For hundreds of years, people imagined the Earth to be completely flat and only learned the truth thanks to technology. Yet, this fact was revealed in the Qur'an fourteen centuries ago.

Well you keep on insisting that it was revealed 1400 years ago that earth was egg shape despite of the revelation you did not know that it was egg shaped for 1400 years. You found out that earth is egg shape(close enough) just like the rest of the people in the world. After you found out just like everyone else only than you discovered that Quran has already mentioned. Have I got it straight?

I am just shocked as to why none can explain as to why Muslims believed that the earth was flat just like the rest of the world.

 

[Unicorn]

It says "spread" in another verse it says spreaded like carpet.the Quran doesn't mention Flat anywhere. Its th people who thought that way.

Yes it does not say that the earth is flat. If you look at Quran and some of the Hadiths together ,the possibility of egg shaped earth is completely ruled out unless you consider the egg shape in flattened sense not spherical.