Babar Satar: Dangerous contradictions

ahnoman1

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
اب تو بابر ستار جیسے غیر جانبدار لوگ بھی عمران کو ننگا کر رہے ہیں



Dangerous contradictions


YOU can call for reform of a dysfunctional constitutional order. You can declare that the existing order doesnt work and needs to be replaced by a new one. But what are you thinking if you seek to delegitimise an existing order, cast aspersions on its institutions, inspire hate against its procedures and outcomes, and then appeal to the same institutions to produce outcomes of your liking? PAT wants a new constitutional order (even if it is coy about it). What about the PTI?

The latters conduct raises serious concerns about its commitment to our constitutional order. Its demands and tactics seem to be challenging foundational concepts of justice, otherwise settled by now: innocent until proven guilty; right to trial by a neutral arbiter; no one to be a judge in own cause; legitimate means produce legitimate ends; rights and responsibilities go hand-in-hand; not to yell fire in a crowded theatre; your freedom ends where my nose begins.

Article 225 states that no election can be called into question except by an election petition presented to the election tribunal. Imran Khan insinuates that election tribunals are either incapable or in Sharifs control (except when they rule in PTIs favour). Thus an ordinance must be brought in (without parliamentary debate) that somehow dances around Article 225 and enables a judicial commission to not only call into question election results in selected constituencies but also the overall electoral outcome across Pakistan.

This judicial commission should conduct a summary investigation, consider circumstantial evidence, not afford Article 10-A rights (fair trial and due process) to MNAs, and conclusively declare whether or not the entire electoral exercise in 2013 was a sham. But in doing so the commission is not to consider whether Imran Khans basic allegation (that Iftikhar Chaudhry, election commissioners, Returning Officers, Najam Sethi and Geo were all part of a grand conspiracy to deliver a fake mandate to Nawaz Sharif) is true and backed by evidence

So the PTI is demanding that the right of individual MNAs to represent their constituencies and the collective right of the PML-N to run the government be taken away without due process or a fair trial. The PTI is essentially saying that we, in view of the conclusive evidence we possess (not yet shared with a competent court) have concluded that we won the 2013 elections, which judgement must be accepted by all and sundry and thus the PML-N must now prove that it did not steal the PTIs mandate to remain in power.

And what are the PTIs means? The prime minister wont resign just because the PTI is asking pertly. The khakis have clarified that they are not intervening. So is PTI relying on the Supreme Court for a face-saver? If the remedy lay with the apex court why did Imran Khan not file a petition instead of demanding intervention from atop his container? Should the court comply with his demand because there is a mob occupying Constitution Avenue, which might go rogue?

While one hears about the PTIs rights, one seldom hears about its responsibilities. The PTI seems to have erroneously imagined that the right to protest includes the right to overthrow a government. The right to protest (which flows out of four fundamental liberties: to speak, associate, move and assemble) comes along with no guarantee or promise of immediate corrective action.

By protesting against an objectionable action or policy you record your disapproval while appealing to the conscience of the society and/or decision-makers. The demand is essentially moral in nature. If you seek to enforce such moral position through the use of force, youre demanding right to violence under the garb of protest. Thus in Pakistan and in democracies across the world, the right to protest is subservient to public order. You have a right to assemble to protest. But if the assembly becomes illegal, the right extinguishes.

The priority accorded to public order means that the right to protest doesnt come with the privilege to protest wherever and however you wish. Time, place and manner regulation of the right is standard practice across the world. Each Moharram, authorities work with organisers of marches to map out routes etc to ensure peace and public order, because under Article 16 of our Constitution the right to assemble peacefully is subject to reasonable restrictions imposed by law in the interest of public order.

Have the PTI/PAT breached any laws while exercising their right to protest? Under Section 141 of the Pakistan Penal Code, for example, any assembly of five persons or more becomes unlawful if the common purpose is to overawe by use or show of force the government, legislature or public servants, to resist the execution of any law or lawful process, to commit mischief or trespass, or to obtain possession of property or deprive anyone of the enjoyment of right of way etc.

The PAT/PTI protesters violated the initial permission to protest by changing the venue and moving into the red zone. We saw PTV attacked, parliaments fence broken, its premises trespassed, and police officers beaten up. We saw senior PTI leaders obstructing prison vans, IG police threatened by Imran Khan and the release of arrested PTI workers secured by force by the mighty Khan personally. We see vigilantes controlling the right of way on Constitution Avenue and even Supreme Court judges have to take a detour to reach the court.

Is this a lawful assembly?

Abuse of authority by the state has a long, abhorrent history. But the remedy lies in availing legal solutions and moving courts (which exist to uphold citizen rights and check the arbitrary exercise of state power) as opposed to relying on vigilantism. Can responsible leaders incite protesters to attack officials and then disown their responsibility for transforming an assembly into a mob?

State institutions and their legitimacy are hard to build but easy to destroy. The police uniforms being demonised represent state authority and not the Sharif government. Pakistan cant expect progressive evolutionary change if its proclaimed agents of change aim to settle partisan scores by hacking at state institutions and state authority. Once delegitimised, the erosion of state authority will affect all uniforms and not just those worn by civilians.

The writer is a lawyer.

http://www.dawn.com/news/1133444
 
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ahnoman1

Politcal Worker (100+ posts)
اب تو بابر ستار جیسے غیر جانبدار لوگ بھی عمران کو ننگا کر رہے ہیں
 

Asad Khan

MPA (400+ posts)
Babar Sattar sirf apnnne bread & butter ke saath janibdaar hee. Is ko ayeen tab nahi nazar ataa jaab mafias parliament me ghusse huwe he 67+ years se ? Is kee ayeenn love tab kahan hotee he jab Martial Law lagtaa he khabi fauji golli k samnne khara huwa he ? Babar Sattar is part & parcel of the system and the slightest threat to it unnerves them. Kahaan hee is ke ayeeen ke first 40 clausess usss pe khabi isss ko maroor nahi utheee, aya hee ayeen ke baat karta he. Cheery picking ayeeen is worse than no ayeeen. Reforms karooo n take another half century before any meaninful thing gets done. He can say it and afford it coz in this system he has it going for him but has he ever thought about the millions and millions of his countrymen living literally like rats, can they afford snail paced reforms ? His selfishness is disgusting and like the rest of the morally bankrupt brigade he is showing his true colors. IF THE ROAD IS EASY, YOU ARE MOST LIKELY GOING THE WRONG WAY (T Goodkind). Khan has taken the hard way and that for sure is the only right way in town.
 

crankthskunk

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Hanoman, since when Babar Sattar becomes independent? Ever since I know him, he is always been writing and saying BS against IK. Nothing new here. He educated from UK, a Barrister. Let him preach this BS to his colleagues in the INN. Then see the results.

All crooks fool only poor Pakistani nation.
 

zebust

MPA (400+ posts)
Ghair janabdaar??? He is also an ugly symbol of status quo... whatever he is saying, is not something new..... check his previous interviews, he has always been a defender of this corrupt systems.


He is among the same lot of the "usual suspects" i.e, To-let hussian, phatkar alam, saleem lifafi, hamid mir jaffar, najam shitty and co
 

Asad Khan

MPA (400+ posts)
@Zebust: To-let Hussain ahahahahahahahahahaa bro that is hilariousss. Thumbs up. That one word made my day, thanks. Such a befitting name.
 

crankthskunk

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
I have not read what BS he has written.

But let me say one thing, in the UK where he is educated, after recent allegations of the rigging as claimed by some videos shared on this forum. Even the supporters of "YES" vote have said, let the Police investigate the rigging. They said we are in Scotland not in an African country, where the rigging would go unpunished.

So, I ask this "Legal Eagle", can he justify the "oversight" of over 7000+ votes to Nawaz Sharif himself? In the UK there would have been a clamor for the PM to resign from his post. They would have demanded that action taken against the man who inflated the votes. There is something called, re-checking your work before submitting it. Did the RO failed to check what he is written before submitting it?
And why the ECP stayed quiet for over a year?
Similarly, what does this "Legal Eagle" say about thousands of fake votes, empty bags, bags full of rubbish, extra bags, no counterfoils, counterfoils without NI number, signature, thumb impressions etc?
In the UK police would have investigated it and put the culprits in the jail. There would have been no malacky of complaints to ECP, tribunals, vote counting, verification etc. The crooks straight to the jail, their rightful place.

But I am certain, this two faced crook would never talk to his British counterparts in such terms, hypocrite.
 

blatant

Senator (1k+ posts)
i Was a few years junior to babar sattar in Hasanabdal. I have seen him in days bygone.

Abdalians DO NOT HAVE A MYOPIC VIEW DR Adam. Infact they have a very diverse range of it.

Babar Sattar is in no way the prototype abdalian if that's what you think. He has numerouse more seasonings added to him since hasanabdal.

What you now look at is a defacto bureaucrat/diplomat or whatever else. He has his views which he knows attract a market price, and surprise surprise people are willing to pay the price. I think it's as simple as that.

​A typical myopic view of Moron Abdalians.
 
Babar Sattar ka article eye opener hai , he is genius guy lekin Po-tians mein hosla nahin hai sach baat sunn ne ka is liye Moron Po-tians ki majority galiaan bakna shuru ho jati hai......Sheeda Cigar wala in ki nazar mein status quo nahin hai jo 1985 se musalsal iqtedar mein shamil raha 2008 tak...Pervez Laai aur Ch Shujaat status quo nahin hain balkay inqlabi leader hain..1977 se 2013 tak musalsal iqtedar mein partner rehne waalay aaj tabdeeli aur inqlab ki alaamat ban chukay hain ...ici tarah Ahmed Raza Kasuri ,Mustafa Khar,Jehangir Tareen ,Pervez Khattak ,Shah Mahmood Qureshi, Khursheed Kasuri aur deegar beshumaar billionaire status quo jo is waqt Imran Kazzab ke left right pe kharra hai ,yeh qoum ko azadi le kar dein ge (what a shame and hypocrisy),,Imran ke moo se VIP culture ke khilaf bolna acha nahin lagta ,kia Karachi jaane ke liye zaroori tha ke chartered plane pe travel kiya jata ? ..aur Mubashar Lichman, Sabir Shatir ,Dr.Danish aur Arif Jahil Bhatti jaisay sold, rented aur biased journalists in ke hero hain (Kia mayyaar hai waaah)......
 

AKBER BADSHAH

MPA (400+ posts)
yeh kon idiot hai. Pakistan ka ye he problem hai kay jis ka jo kam hotta hai woh jodr kar dosra kaam shoro kar daita hai. we love imran khan and we believe on imran khan.
 

Saladin A

Minister (2k+ posts)
Personally, I never like this chap Satar and have always found him insipid, annoying and contradictory. He criticizes any one and every one for the sake and fun of it and enjoys disagreeing with others to prove his point however irrelevant. He is most comfortable in company of those nitwits who do not like Imran Khan out of envy some kind of or personal grudge and willing to sully him on the flimsiest excuse.

I wish that he has a face lift and looks better on the camera because he represent a picture of despair, depression and unhappiness and makes an atmosphere unpleasant all around. He must learn to acknowledge when he is wrong and others are right.

How can he justify massive vote rigging and post manipulation by any candidate even if that involved one vote especially when it points to deliberate fraud and deception to manipulate the result. In western democracies any irregularity discovered at the ballot box at local council elections or general election are thoroughly investigated by the police and the culprit banned for life from participating in politics or holding a high office. But, when the allegations of massive vote rigging are available on videos, TV cameras, mobile phones as well as supported by eye witnesses in every part of the country, there is no defense but to nullify the election results. I am therefore of the opinion that Pakistan's 2013 over 65% of general election results were the biggest fraud in in its electoral history and majority of the victors won by deception. In the western democracies and civilized societies, these results would have been unacceptable and declared illegal.

Mr Nawaz Shariff and PML-N were the largest beneficiaries of the alleged vote rigging, fraud and deception knowingly or inadvertently that should have disqualified them from the victory parade.


 
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Muneeb Shah

Councller (250+ posts)
The issues raised by him are well backed by the references and logic.. so instead of replying logically you have started his personal character assassination. i think bcoz you don't have justifications that is why.. otherwise you could argue it point by point ..i think this is a dilemma with most of the PTI supporters.. they don't have enough knowledge to argue on logic or facts, therefore, they always play below the belt..
 

Farooq Khan

MPA (400+ posts)
Pakistan as country and its people are suffering for the last 60 plus years,problem is roots of corrupt mafia style gangster are so deep and
underground many RaTs are working on the payroll we all know many Journos are doing this and getting ReWards (plot,Land,job for relatives and so on)so list is long and the enemy is doing everything to protect their Interests.
we have to be alert always only few good guys can and will change the fate of poor people in Pakistan Insha Allah.
 

Khurpainch

Minister (2k+ posts)
Zara Babur sattar say Pooochoo Pakistan main Kon Qanooon per Amul Kur Ruha Hai --- Agur wazeer e Azam hi Qanoon ko Fallow nahin kuray ga to phir Baqi Log bhi nahi Kurain Gay

Lohay Ko Loha Kat-ta Hai ------------------ Diamonds Cuts Diamonds
 

Jshah

Minister (2k+ posts)
This person's whole articles are on half truth based.
He think himself that he is very genus and unique like Talat Hussain and both are just s h i t.
 

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