Nobody left to dare speak about Islam

Steyn

MPA (400+ posts)
#1
Molana Tariq Jameel showed his true colors when he sat in the symposium on killing children ie population control, he was so scared he couldn't even utter a word in favor of Islam or quote the verses of Holy Quran.

Very few Ulma of deen can stand up to the Qazi and Badshah of the time (chief justice and prime minister) and dare tell them that they are wrong. To see a man like Molana Tariq Jameel act like a darbari molvi made me really sad and then his comments. Villages in KPK, Sindh, Punjab have education problem that's why they have more kids? Wow

Instead of teaching cjp and Imran khan on what Allah has said about kids and sustenance, he insults us even more by calling us uneducated and ignorant. I wish Molana Tariq Jameel had watched his own strong speech which he gave about population control when CJP and Prime minister weren't watching him on YouTube.

Truly, we have come near end times. I don't know any religious leader in Pakistan who can dare come on TV and mention these verses in Holy Quran

وَلَا تَقْتُلُوا أَوْلَادَكُمْ خَشْيَةَ إِمْلَاقٍ ۖ نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُهُمْ وَإِيَّاكُمْ ۚ إِنَّ قَتْلَهُمْ كَانَ خِطْئًا كَبِيرًا - 17:31

Sahih International
And do not kill your children for fear of poverty. We provide for them and for you. Indeed, their killing is ever a great sin.
 
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6zsIi/7yPJVa1WNwkg/MYs2YE8zPKN7dSVQZhhDTdHcD4SsN5dWb1EQQQWSgQQQQAQQQQBpbGjmkBWOCwBcNZEtEExcgd60zOitDwTSdJEFrTMP5BwHTxsu78MYHSwOd83Wd1gOGcC0Ma5g0thgdA7MAa3R6jxXSsNWDKbenkuhz7WNTEhoSMKwvOt23IfqoWFYajpOysXVPujZTxl0eIr8h/tLpUrR6qNRbJJ5D6qwobJX1DntGrU7Ip5qRiBIPgouHMiOn+BGacHWphzYIkFUWPyZrw5ocWNfOsNAIcfDl5K/AhR6lj3KlRzT7Fcr+Fg3ViO1XeTP/wCdPst99a6TV29FT5FgxQoUaA2p0mN8w0T7yreqbeijM9M93uqbJuUTHdpE6xKQDcIqU0hRsVTlveFLCQWqoFZQqWgqjz/Bi8g6SZdFyewWg37/AKq7xNPS7uRvaHC6KHE85yqqy5BDRqvJtvGoC4sO/dZnMcG+Y302JJN3b87ruOd5J8YEAW7JJNjqB5WuFk8XwlUMztJINusi/K6m+2+NuR1KJFjv05o30COS6HmXCNQAPDWyNxfa3/apcTlMEAh0uknsmAACB7/qo/hrNyslCIhXuKyZxkgRMmIOygDLnTcgSYEnna3uo/mrQQnaeHcbxayktwUSDbcjwHT0VmzLHNDbkE6S0kd8EEn1VzIQcLg2xJvu3z5FazIMGwy0glulhIJPaAIt0tMeSTRwWqRybGoREP27Lh5W5hXOQ4SoKkumJgxGkwBc7kTN1tJxFq/yUOFR2mRTdNiZuQBaD4LY4Ck58DkFSYHCF74aIEnlzMXK2tDDimyAmw1ejs0QPNIHIDmg5PYRu7vIeCGc+llkAKTTNkybhOlRWgVPlPgoNKzh0NlOqCx8FBrNsjIqY9qjVRv6+ieY6QCk1OqcCont+RUh528Ao4d2k6XWb4fQpSMqKsmyU5W5FNpFFlh7hHUppnAutCmOFlX4aHXoBw71EZTIVkzeE2+ndHPSpPSL8JN1MMCIIVkaYSHUlPC+KDEYERESE5UyOm5uktG17Dmp2Je1rS55DWjckwBfmVY1cPbUL8+siN+9By1i8w4ZZ8MjSJAsbzAuLrn2Z8LukBje1qJ2sRAMX5yAu6OwstMhV2IyxnVDXPk44y7huoXNJYBczMWHJWuHyGTEdlswB3xtbuXSmZWw8rKUzAsH3QnBfL1h8s4bIL9TWgWjrsPoZU2nlIDja5O4Ec7bLW1qQA6JeW4OTrO3Ifqn1N10MmysU2yRc7qVXMnwUqq6AodQhE9+0GHCTHX6KcWw2ExhGX1HyUh5RTzBYcJ0qPQqclIalVCdcKI8KWo9YXKcKhhhaPRKd0SGGCE6/qgRROsVIZdoPSR6pvEsul4c2hSyE/ZJCFRFRMoOHsK+HKyaqnZwKs6TrKpTB9kHiRKW8SEliodHRKdc1RxYx6Jb8RH69w6qbBVTnmVsxFKpRqN1NcIIPTqIXOMJVxuBx7MuwmLqVmdio6nUYxwpUyZc0uN9IbyBFyF1HEYloaaky1rS4lt7NBNo8F5bzXN6tTFVcTL6T31HO7LnNcyT8si9ojyRZGnizb1641Esn0UU0Wz1KpOBsdWq5Zh6tZxdUdTBJO5uQCe+AFfUhzKmRFnBvbASSYCD337h9VHfLjA/0qkSRTZ8R3cN+9WTRASaNIAQEdV0BK1c9GKtST4KMbmEdVycwlPmVXxM9pLBASSUp5SAURoi06kVCO/6qfTKgY1saX9HAHwNgfVSaT7wlSSCm67bSjaJMlFUvAUiidStuiMxKedsmgbFMKqoJCRST42TICdZQRN4SWWKKo64PkldFNMus1SsG+QmXCQk4Z0FOfQs2pBEFFq5oy8OEhUdFVbI8FW5lhjVo1WXdqY5sTpJlpEauSsTUVbjMY2i2pUcYa1pefBokpnHE8PkWZ4Npq4j+RRp0nNLmPZIbpOjS1hGp2qBJndQuHeCq+Oaa7alJxJDnCoX9tx7bgS0W5g7brPcScQVsZXfWqPdDidLJOljJ7LQNrLp32AY2pUqV6b3OcynSZoE9lnbdaOpn2Uyz9dF7J11/CUmtotY0QGhoAFgA0RA7rI3vhOYl8C6rziJsjLm1Tj3k2HNTMPRDR380jC0Yud1ILoRRAJhQsRWR4mv0UdlMlEgt6OmwuKnNEWSabICUmqQHJASiUgoUURMg7GxUTDk6i07hSgo9YAP1cy0iPDY+6X6Km0j2ZSqbeaSRDPRONU0uk1Sm2JVYpLE58JWhwEhMvfdE1+pocOgSKjTuE7GfCa2ycpOkBM6pRYV+481NNYMTTxBlLaUqo1MJFAyEhh0mEzhXKW9qqAiospx9lr6+Dq02Rqc2BO0yD+i17mWUfEUA4adybeqYnqvJWIwz6bix7S1wJBB6gwQvRX2O8NnB4TU9sVa8Pf1ayP5bPQz+ZOcR/ZzhcTTp0SXUjT+V7NJcQ4kuDpFwTdbPLcIyjSawEkMY1suMkhoiT32UWz8b632I+Z1OSLBYeLndKZT1O1nyTz6kKp8Y/Tjnwo1aum6lUnZOUaHMo4ZFKlNypTRCIuQAJQcg5RpTaaMhLp9NuSITj0lMxQqfFYoDFUqZ+/rA/KA791eNCp8Rg5xLKhHyG3mIKUKrx4sEoJJNgk1aoHioSaqFGCmpSgVociiyj+gzwT6CCaEc803hvmPgggooWLNk/yRIIBqnv5qeUEE4cK5Jql84QQTvwfp7GfOPy/Uo3f0/RBBZxVIbsmKiCC1SRR39VMOyCCDn00pTEEFNWdSCggoiYZeiQQWijjEzW3RIJA8eXn+iYqboIJRMBGEEFSn/9k=

Wake up Pak

Minister (2k+ posts)
#2
Molana Tariq Jameel showed his true colors when he sat in the symposium on killing children ie population control, he was so scared he couldn't even utter a word in favor of Islam or quote the verses of Holy Quran.

Very few Ulma of deen can stand up to the Qazi and Badshah of the time (chief justice and prime minister) and dare tell them that they are wrong. To see a man like Molana Tariq Jameel act like a darbari molvi made me really sad and then his comments. Villages in KPK, Sindh, Punjab have education problem that's why they have more kids? Wow

Instead of teaching cjp and Imran khan on what Allah has said about kids and sustenance, he insults us even more by calling us uneducated and ignorant. I wish Molana Tariq Jameel had watched his own strong speech which he gave about population control when CJP and Prime minister weren't watching him on YouTube.

Truly, we have come near end times. I don't know any religious leader in Pakistan who can dare come on TV and mention these verses in Holy Quran

وَلَا تَقْتُلُوا أَوْلَادَكُمْ خَشْيَةَ إِمْلَاقٍ ۖ نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُهُمْ وَإِيَّاكُمْ ۚ إِنَّ قَتْلَهُمْ كَانَ خِطْئًا كَبِيرًا - 17:31

Sahih International
And do not kill your children for fear of poverty. We provide for them and for you. Indeed, their killing is ever a great sin.
Who is asking to kill the children? Does having fewer kids = to killings?
 
#7
Molana Tariq Jameel showed his true colors when he sat in the symposium on killing children ie population control, he was so scared he couldn't even utter a word in favor of Islam or quote the verses of Holy Quran.

Very few Ulma of deen can stand up to the Qazi and Badshah of the time (chief justice and prime minister) and dare tell them that they are wrong. To see a man like Molana Tariq Jameel act like a darbari molvi made me really sad and then his comments. Villages in KPK, Sindh, Punjab have education problem that's why they have more kids? Wow

Instead of teaching cjp and Imran khan on what Allah has said about kids and sustenance, he insults us even more by calling us uneducated and ignorant. I wish Molana Tariq Jameel had watched his own strong speech which he gave about population control when CJP and Prime minister weren't watching him on YouTube.

Truly, we have come near end times. I don't know any religious leader in Pakistan who can dare come on TV and mention these verses in Holy Quran

وَلَا تَقْتُلُوا أَوْلَادَكُمْ خَشْيَةَ إِمْلَاقٍ ۖ نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُهُمْ وَإِيَّاكُمْ ۚ إِنَّ قَتْلَهُمْ كَانَ خِطْئًا كَبِيرًا - 17:31

Sahih International
And do not kill your children for fear of poverty. We provide for them and for you. Indeed, their killing is ever a great sin.
Looks like you wanted to have Khadim Rizvi on that stage uttering his words of wisdom in front of IK and CJ???
 

ahrc2000

Voter (50+ posts)
#9
thread poster is se bari chawal shayad hi maar sakta. First poppulation control is not killing children. Second the ayat he quoted is quoted completely out of context. An ayat that was revealed to stop the practice of burrying your own daughter alive is being quoted here. Truly this person is thick headed. Bas har koi islam ke khilaf kaam kaar raha hai, bas islam jo tha woh tha hi khadim rizvi ka aur koi islam ka kaam kar hi nahin sakta.
 

Kamboz

MPA (400+ posts)
#10
Molana Tariq Jameel showed his true colors when he sat in the symposium on killing children ie population control, he was so scared he couldn't even utter a word in favor of Islam or quote the verses of Holy Quran.

Very few Ulma of deen can stand up to the Qazi and Badshah of the time (chief justice and prime minister) and dare tell them that they are wrong. To see a man like Molana Tariq Jameel act like a darbari molvi made me really sad and then his comments. Villages in KPK, Sindh, Punjab have education problem that's why they have more kids? Wow

Instead of teaching cjp and Imran khan on what Allah has said about kids and sustenance, he insults us even more by calling us uneducated and ignorant. I wish Molana Tariq Jameel had watched his own strong speech which he gave about population control when CJP and Prime minister weren't watching him on YouTube.

Truly, we have come near end times. I don't know any religious leader in Pakistan who can dare come on TV and mention these verses in Holy Quran

وَلَا تَقْتُلُوا أَوْلَادَكُمْ خَشْيَةَ إِمْلَاقٍ ۖ نَّحْنُ نَرْزُقُهُمْ وَإِيَّاكُمْ ۚ إِنَّ قَتْلَهُمْ كَانَ خِطْئًا كَبِيرًا - 17:31

Sahih International
And do not kill your children for fear of poverty. We provide for them and for you. Indeed, their killing is ever a great sin.
You have picked a non issue and trying to malign Molana sb. He is there because people invited him... he is not going around begging to be on stage. Same way, he was asked to lead janaza of Kulsom nawaz... so let's stop blaming him for being greedy.... if someone has proof of him taking funds from anyone , pls bring forward.
Population control is different from actual abortion.... Hadees says that you may do your ways but that soul which is to come in this world will come.
 

kakamana

Senator (1k+ posts)
#11
well whoever listen to it, can easily understand he indirectly hit IK & CJ on all such things....like before planning need knowledge!!!! so even if u want population control planning u need to plan....to plan a baby...to plan u life hereafter....to plan ur education...all this need knowledge..if u put crooks like politician which lack knowledge and wisdom and ask them to plan and just for sake of argument if they do it with good intent, since they dont have knowledge their planning fails as it is happening quite often here in pakistan.
 

Steyn

MPA (400+ posts)
#12
Who is asking to kill the children? Does having fewer kids = to killings?
That’s a very valid question...
thread poster is se bari chawal shayad hi maar sakta. First poppulation control is not killing children. Second the ayat he quoted is quoted completely out of context. An ayat that was revealed to stop the practice of burrying your own daughter alive is being quoted here. Truly this person is thick headed. Bas har koi islam ke khilaf kaam kaar raha hai, bas islam jo tha woh tha hi khadim rizvi ka aur koi islam ka kaam kar hi nahin sakta.
Why did the Arabs at the time buried their daughters alive ? Use some brains, if you can't use your own brain and lack intelligence then listen to what all the ulema unanimously say about these Ayats and population control in Islam.

http://www.islamicstudies.info/tafheem.php?sura=17&verse=31&to=40

In pre-Islamic arabia, there were no ways of contraception, certainly not as effective and safe as there are today. They also couldn't find out the sex of the kid in the mother's womb so when a daughter was born, she would be buried. This is no different than population control because when the government restricts people, they will do ultrasounds and terminate pregnancy in case of a girl. They killed girls for the fear of sustenance and raised boys.

Heading back to the days of Jahiliya, aren't we?. In fact, way worse than days of Jahiliya because they weren't being forced by any government but "Islamic" Pakistan will force people to these acts of Jahiliya.

This is different than not having kids or less kids. Don't try to pull a straw man here, not having kids isn't the issue at all.

Looks like you wanted to have Khadim Rizvi on that stage uttering his words of wisdom in front of IK and CJ???
Bas har koi islam ke khilaf kaam kaar raha hai, bas islam jo tha woh tha hi khadim rizvi ka aur koi islam ka kaam kar hi nahin sakta.
Why would you bring Khadim Rizvi up in this thread to run away from the argument which you can't argue logically?. What has he to do with my argument?. Is my English too hard for you to understand or something because i fail to see where i have even remotely mentioned Khadim Rizvi. It's like i am talking about cars and you bring up an apple as an argument. What kind of morons am i arguing with?

You have picked a non issue and trying to malign Molana sb. He is there because people invited him... he is not going around begging to be on stage. Same way, he was asked to lead janaza of Kulsom nawaz... so let's stop blaming him for being greedy.... if someone has proof of him taking funds from anyone , pls bring forward.
Population control is different from actual abortion.... Hadees says that you may do your ways but that soul which is to come in this world will come.
I am not accusing him of anything, i respect Molana saab but he couldn't speak the truth and lecture CJP on his wrongdoings which takes a lot of courage, courage which he didn't have.

Read my post above. Population control will lead to murder of kids whether they're born or still inside the womb after their gender is found out. Watch this video

Why is everyone defending it with use of condoms or not having pregnancy at all. That isn't even an issue.

well whoever listen to it, can easily understand he indirectly hit IK & CJ on all such things....like before planning need knowledge!!!! so even if u want population control planning u need to plan....to plan a baby...to plan u life hereafter....to plan ur education...all this need knowledge..if u put crooks like politician which lack knowledge and wisdom and ask them to plan and just for sake of argument if they do it with good intent, since they dont have knowledge their planning fails as it is happening quite often here in pakistan.
Listen to his speech in the video and what he said when he wasn't infront of CJP and PM. He could've educated PM and CJP on how this is wrong but instead he chose to lecture on education and run away from the main issue.
 

ahrc2000

Voter (50+ posts)
#13
No one is advocating for abortions or even killing children. Conflating the topic of population control with abortion and killing children is a flaw in your premise. You're making assumptions and spreading misinformation. No one will legally allow it nor will it be condoned. However, using modern contraception methods, whatever they may be, is a sane and responsible choice.
 
#14
Why did the Arabs at the time buried their daughters alive ? Use some brains, if you can't use your own brain and lack intelligence then listen to what all the ulema unanimously say about these Ayats and population control in Islam.

http://www.islamicstudies.info/tafheem.php?sura=17&verse=31&to=40

In pre-Islamic arabia, there were no ways of contraception, certainly not as effective and safe as there are today. They also couldn't find out the sex of the kid in the mother's womb so when a daughter was born, she would be buried. This is no different than population control because when the government restricts people, they will do ultrasounds and terminate pregnancy in case of a girl. They killed girls for the fear of sustenance and raised boys.

Heading back to the days of Jahiliya, aren't we?. In fact, way worse than days of Jahiliya because they weren't being forced by any government but "Islamic" Pakistan will force people to these acts of Jahiliya.

This is different than not having kids or less kids. Don't try to pull a straw man here, not having kids isn't the issue at all.




Why would you bring Khadim Rizvi up in this thread to run away from the argument which you can't argue logically?. What has he to do with my argument?. Is my English too hard for you to understand or something because i fail to see where i have even remotely mentioned Khadim Rizvi. It's like i am talking about cars and you bring up an apple as an argument. What kind of morons am i arguing with?



I am not accusing him of anything, i respect Molana saab but he couldn't speak the truth and lecture CJP on his wrongdoings which takes a lot of courage, courage which he didn't have.

Read my post above. Population control will lead to murder of kids whether they're born or still inside the womb after their gender is found out. Watch this video

Why is everyone defending it with use of condoms or not having pregnancy at all. That isn't even an issue.



Listen to his speech in the video and what he said when he wasn't infront of CJP and PM. He could've educated PM and CJP on how this is wrong but instead he chose to lecture on education and run away from the main issue.
Why you getting pissed when people are sensing similarities between your and Khadim Rizvi thoughts. Regarding your analysis, it looks like you didn't understand Tariq's Jameel point. I recommend you listen it again but with open mind. Good luck
 
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